HWH jack question

[CMcCardell]

I just got back from a short trip to Laramie/Fort Collins (my 2004 Adventurer 35U is now freeze-tested to zero degrees plus 35 mph winds, thanks very much). In that kind of temperature, all the hydraulics worked a bit more slowly, jacks (especially the right rear, which has always been slow to retract) would take 20 minutes or so to store, but everything worked.

On the last night, at only about 30 degrees, I parked and started to level the coach, and realized that the right front jack wasn't coming down. I stored the jacks, and the right rear wouldn't come back up at all (broke a 4x4 trying). I recycled the system and tried again, and now both the right front and left rear won't come down, and the right rear still won't retract (although it'll go down).

Since the jack's only about an inch down, but the jack alarm is driving me loopy, I check the fuse panel and identify the "jack alarm" fuse, and pull it. No idea what it is (though I'm thinking that it may be the thermometer/compass, which now reads exactly 180 degrees off), but it isn't the jack alarm.

I broke out the manual and figured out how to manually retract the jacks. It took a bit of trial and error, since my setup is backwards from the manual, but with a block and lever I was able to get the RR jack back up. I was also able to get both the front jacks down when the manual bleed was open, but they'd go right back up again when releasing the button.

After driving an hour or more, the jack alarm was back on - the RR jack had dropped an inch or so again. I attempted to store while driving, with no luck after 15 minutes, so I pulled over and manually retracted it yet again. It's now been 18 hours or so and it hasn't dropped again.

Any hints on what may be the issue?

- Clay

'04 Adventurer 35U

[Suncircles]

HWH Tech Support needs to here this problem. 1-800 321-3494. Joe Portilli has been extremely helpful for my Jack problems. Joe is also highly respected at the dealership service center where I purchased my MH.

Suncircles
2005 Winnebago Journey 36G

[DAN L]

Quote:

Originally Posted by CMcCardell I just got back from a short trip to Laramie/Fort Collins (my 2004 Adventurer 35U is now freeze-tested to zero degrees plus 35 mph winds, thanks very much). In that kind of temperature, all the hydraulics worked a bit more slowly, jacks (especially the right rear, which has always been slow to retract) would take 20 minutes or so to store, but everything worked. On the last night, at only about 30 degrees, I parked and started to level the coach, and realized that the right front jack wasn't coming down. I stored the jacks, and the right rear wouldn't come back up at all (broke a 4x4 trying). I recycled the system and tried again, and now both the right front and left rear won't come down, and the right rear still won't retract (although it'll go down). Since the jack's only about an inch down, but the jack alarm is driving me loopy, I check the fuse panel and identify the "jack alarm" fuse, and pull it. No idea what it is (though I'm thinking that it may be the thermometer/compass, which now reads exactly 180 degrees off), but it isn't the jack alarm. I broke out the manual and figured out how to manually retract the jacks. It took a bit of trial and error, since my setup is backwards from the manual, but with a block and lever I was able to get the RR jack back up. I was also able to get both the front jacks down when the manual bleed was open, but they'd go right back up again when releasing the button. After driving an hour or more, the jack alarm was back on - the RR jack had dropped an inch or so again. I attempted to store while driving, with no luck after 15 minutes, so I pulled over and manually retracted it yet again. It's now been 18 hours or so and it hasn't dropped again. Any hints on what may be the issue? - Clay '04 Adventurer 35U

did the slides work ok? is the fluid reservoir full with everything retracted?

[CMcCardell]

Yes, the slides work fine, no sound of air in lines or anything, though at zero degrees they're pretty slow - I didn't physically check the fluid level, because I couldn't figure out how the cap/dipstick is removed and I could find anything to stand on to make the reach down around the hood flap manageable.

I'll give HWH a call today and see if they have any pointers -

Thanks both!

- Clay

[Outbumn]

Almost the same think happend to us in January in Virginia Beach (temperature in the upper 30's). The left front jack would not go down, and the right rear jack would not retract after being lowered.

Solution, 4 new solenoids and a new motherboard. 2 uotings since the repair and evrything s still working.

Hope you have better luck!

[Fossilhog]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Outbumn Almost the same think happend to us in January in Virginia Beach (temperature in the upper 30's). The left front jack would not go down, and the right rear jack would not retract after being lowered. Solution, 4 new solenoids and a new motherboard. 2 uotings since the repair and evrything s still working. Hope you have better luck!

I installed some fog lights and used the gounding lug next to the hydraulic pump for the installation. When I went to set the jscks, 2 wouldn't work. Thinking back I wene to the grounding lug and it was loose. As soon as I tightened it, the jacks worked fine. Hope that's your problem.

[CMcCardell]

Thanks Tim -

I'll check that out!

- Clay

[CMcCardell]

An update -

I spoke to Frank at HWH, who suggested checking the fuses in the main control box behind the front bumper (which I'm now referring to as the R2D2 panel after all the blinking lights). There's a 15A mini fuse for each jack. Sho'nuf - 3 of 4 are blown.

Is this the problem, or a symptom? So I proceed to waste 3 new fuses. Just a symptom.

Spoke again to HWH, and I need 3 (they recommend 4) new solenoids. Apparently while a jack is attempting to retract, power goes through all the solenoids, and one slow jack can screw all of them up. I told him that I'd downloaded the jack retraction times spec sheet from their website, and even though that one jack was always slow, it was always within the retraction time specified for that temperature (though the other jacks were consistently faster). He said it shouldn't take longer than 5 minutes or damage would occur over time - at which point I asked why the spec sheet called for times up to 20 or 25 minutes in cold temps?

Since that jack has always been gawdawful slow, and since I know my dad had had it looked at several times since the coach was new, and since he's saying that's what would fry the other solenoids, I asked him whether I could get some warranty help. He said no, since they had no warranty claims for that coach, but that I should check with Winnebago to see if they had any records. If they did, maybe he'd be able to do something.

So I called Winnebago, and they do have records of that one solenoid having been replaced when the coach was about 6 months old.

I emailed that info to HWH, and am awaiting a response.

I will probably end up needing 4 new solenoids, a new set of springs for that jack (to get rid of that possible reason), and to check to make sure the breather cap isn't plugged (given as another possible reason).

- Clay

[Cheryl Bisson]

With our 2005 Adventurer 33V we have had several problems with our HWH jacks over the last couple of years that began while under warranty, such as different jacks not going down and very slow right rear jack retraction. The fix always required new solenoids, and new heavy duty springs replaced the original. The answer for the slow jack was that it was last in line in the hydraulic system.

The last time it happened we were far from home and had the rig looked at by Capitol RV in Bismarck, ND, when one jack would not extend. As an aside to Capitol, we said that also the right rear was very slow. The extension problem was, again, a burned out solenoid. And...the tech felt that the right rear jack was bent. We have no idea how that happened because we never leave the tires suspened above the ground. If the jacks aren't long enough to level the rig, we put blocks between the ground and the jacks and the tires, usually not more than 2-3" worth.

Once again, all new solenoids, as well as a rebuilt jack cylinder were put on. Since then, our jacks have come up so fast, 3-5 minutes, and slightly longer in 20 degree weather. Usually the last one up is the one that was most extended where in the past it was always the right rear. We wonder if our past jack extension problems were all related to the jack being bent which caused slow retraction resulting in a burned out solenoid.

2005 Adventurer 33V
2005 Honda CRV toad

[CMcCardell]

Hi Cheryl -

That's great info, thank you! I'll ask about that as well.

2 email messages and 2 phone messages to Frank since Friday; still waiting for a response.

- Clay

[Pubtym]

I've had from slow jack retraction to partial jack retraction problems for past year. Solenoids working..verified with switch clicking sounds and alternate retraction methods.

I replaced OE springs with "new" HWH springs. Retraction time shortened but still intermitttent partial retraction. I reset the auto level sensor to correct level...jacks no longer extended to extremes..

Last year at GNR, I learned from HWH Tech rep that HWH makes their own springs...
After going to the website for "Century Springs", I learned what material characteristics and manufacturing processes yield the highest quality springs. My opinion: HWH springs are a D+ with Century Springs A+. Century Springs are generally sold in good hardware stores on a large assorted display board of springs. I have had good success with Century Spring C-307. I have one C-307 booster piggy back to each HWH Spring on a rear W22 HWH jack. Retraction time is cut in half and no other problems to date with that jack...I continue to work the piggyback booster spring rigs concept...I have ordered Century Spring #5582 ($11 each) from the Century Spring Manufacturer and this model should work slightly better than C-307. I'll be testing this new spring rig on the rear jacks this week. More to follow...

[CMcCardell]

Good to know, thanks Pubtym -

With the manual retraction valve closed, and using a block and a 4x4, I couldn't get the RR jack to budge - so I figure it's probably not a spring problem, but that'll depend on how it works when I get the solenoids replaced (since now they're just blowing fuses).

I'll file those Century numbers - let us know how the # 5582 works!

- Clay

[Pubtym]

I received the four Century Springs #5582. They are heftier than the C-307s and should work too...Installation and test next week.

I'm also trying to find a crossover aftermarket 12 Volt Solenoid Valve that is higher quality than HWH solenoids that have the high failure rates..

The HWH Solenoid Valve Part Number is RM90729. Incidentally, at my local Winnebago Dealer, I found this HWH valve...it was from HWH and it was a "remanufactured" valve @ $164 each. I did not buy it...parts counter person says they always order "remanufactured" valves from HWH....brand new are $30 more. At this point, the consistent and frequent customer comments I see on posts regarding the high failure rates of these valves...and the finding of these 'remanufactured' HWH valves prevalent in stock dealer supplies....leads me to say "muddy water" about quality of these valves currently used by HWH.

I'm not a hydrualics engineeer but I believe there has to be another valve manufacturing company with a identical crossover valve of higher quality.

I'd appreciate search assistance from any Member having knowledge of these valves and how to find a quality replacement solenoid valve.

[Pubtym]

Quote:

Originally Posted by CMcCardell Good to know, thanks Pubtym - With the manual retraction valve closed, and using a block and a 4x4, I couldn't get the RR jack to budge - so I figure it's probably not a spring problem, but that'll depend on how it works when I get the solenoids replaced (since now they're just blowing fuses). I'll file those Century numbers - let us know how the # 5582 works! - Clay

Manual retraction valve needs to be "open"...valve top nut carefully turned counter clockwise no more than about 4 turns..to relieve fluid pressure on jack so springs can retract..when jack is fully retracted, the top nut needs to be retightened carefully...turn nut clockwise to "snug" tightness...think about spreading butter on toast...it is a lite tighten.