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Old 01-12-2019, 12:05 PM   #1
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HWH Problem

Stuck in IL this winter so working on DP to do some little things. Stacks have been sticking off and on so contacted AZPete. Have been putting jacks down and spraying with WD40 and retracting. Still have 2 jacks that are intermittent. BIG PROBLEM is that the last 2 times when I ran engine and filled air bags the Manual Air Dump button on the pad doesn't do anything. When I hit auto level it does not dump the air tanks so jacks go down a the raised height but when I retract the jacks after about an hour or so the front of my DP drops on the frame with a thud before retracting jacks. Rear of DP did not drop.

Since buying DP last May I've only used the jacks when dumping on the road to get level - had engine idling during the dump - and here at home on the concrete pad. Mostly overnighted on grass, gravel or blacktop 1 night at a time so never put jacks down.

Air bags inflate and pressure holds at about 140psi. If I park without jacks air suspension gradually decreases over 3 to 5 days depending on temps.

Made appointment with HWH, Moscow, IA for 4/8/19 but they don't honor my ESP so I'll have to pay and then work with Compass for refund. Thought about calling Winnie as they do honor it.

2nd Problem - Manual says to turn front tires to left and you will be able to release air tanks using cable in wheel well. Finally found cable stuffed into chassis rail. Worked it out but no way do I want to pull it as I am physically in the wheel well trapped between the tire and coach. Only one cable so tried driver's side and found another there.

How do ya'll do it?

Thanks in advance - Richard
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Old 01-12-2019, 12:22 PM   #2
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Use your awning rod to pull the layards.
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Old 01-12-2019, 01:32 PM   #3
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WD is mostly solvent so provides almost no lubrication. You can use spray silicone. I've been using Corrosion X last 5 years...never sticky jacks.


No reason to ever bother manually dumping air tanks...that's why the lanyard hidden away.
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Old 01-12-2019, 02:58 PM   #4
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First I would not lower the jacks until the air dump is complete. 140psi is just too much and will strain the jacks.

Ok, you have trouble dumping so after the engine is off keep hitting the brake until pressures bleed down to reasonable levels. This would be a temp measure until you get the air dump fixed. Then manually lower jacks. Remember at 140psi your back brakes are open meaning the MH could roll . On my air guage I have two needles(red is for rear) so make sure that pressure is down for safety.

I have an older 210 HWH system and I have removed the panel several times. The cover makes contact to internal electronics through contacts that could become oxidized. Would certainly check this. Some of the contacts may be little springs. Just make sure they are clean. Be very careful taking of the plate.

I see that you probably have a Freightliner Chassis so get a sign in to www.dtnaconnect.com
This site will give a lot of info to you by VIN of chassis including the Air tanks.

Download all the manuals on your HWH system.
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Old 01-12-2019, 03:24 PM   #5
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First I would not lower the jacks until the air dump is complete. 140psi is just too much and will strain the jacks.

Ok, you have trouble dumping so after the engine is off keep hitting the brake until pressures bleed down to reasonable levels. This would be a temp measure until you get the air dump fixed. Then manually lower jacks. Remember at 140psi your back brakes are open meaning the MH could roll . On my air guage I have two needles(red is for rear) so make sure that pressure is down for safety....
This just doesn't make any sense (at least to me). The pressure in the air system has no connection or affect on the hydraulic jacks. There is no 'strain' on the jack if they are lowered while the airbags are still inflated, they just have to go further before they hit the ground and will therefore have less travel range to actually level the coach once they've taken the load off the airbags.

Pumping the brake pedal will use up air from the supply tanks and will lower the pressure available (if the engine isn't running), but will have no effect on the air in the suspension airbags. Similarly, dumping the airbags will not affect the air pressure available in the supply tanks, only the airbags themselves.

As far as the brakes are concerned the rear spring brakes will be engaged whenever the Yellow brake knob is pulled out. In addition, if the pressure in the air supply tank falls below about 60 psi the spring brakes will start to engage, with full engagement happening somewhere in the 20 to 40 psi range.

As a safety measure when camping one might elect to draw down the air supply so the the spring brakes will be automatically engaged and therefore eliminate the risk of the Yellow brake knob being inadvertently pushed in releasing the brakes.
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Old 01-12-2019, 05:32 PM   #6
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oK I will fire up my airbags tomorrow and check that out. I won't dump and just use my brakes to lower pressure. Get back to you.

As far as extending the jacks with bags inflated, be my guest. I have inadvertently done this before and I will not do it again. If I can't deflate I will not extend my jacks. I have replaced all my springs and one jack. The problem with the jack started after overextension. So judgement call I guess.

Not sure about the back brakes now that you challenge it. It will take some time for me to prove your point Oh wait..you are correct. If you pull that brake with air you will stop immediately. One technique to use during front blowouts. Sorry I guess I am just too cautious as I get older!
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Old 01-12-2019, 08:14 PM   #7
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oK I will fire up my airbags tomorrow and check that out. I won't dump and just use my brakes to lower pressure. Get back to you...

Interested to see what you find. At least with the OP's and my Freightliner chassis it should operate the way I described.
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Old 01-12-2019, 09:52 PM   #8
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WD is mostly solvent so provides almost no lubrication. You can use spray silicone. I've been using Corrosion X last 5 years...never sticky jacks.


No reason to ever bother manually dumping air tanks...that's why the lanyard hidden away.
Yes there is a reason, it's the only way to determine if moisture is getting past the air dryer. That will cause a lot of damage.

The HWH FAQ page states not to use silicone, only WD40 to clean the shafts.They are SST =will not rust.
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Old 01-12-2019, 09:58 PM   #9
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Stuck in IL this winter so working on DP to do some little things. Stacks have been sticking off and on so contacted AZPete. Have been putting jacks down and spraying with WD40 and retracting. Still have 2 jacks that are intermittent. BIG PROBLEM is that the last 2 times when I ran engine and filled air bags the Manual Air Dump button on the pad doesn't do anything. When I hit auto level it does not dump the air tanks so jacks go down a the raised height but when I retract the jacks after about an hour or so the front of my DP drops on the frame with a thud before retracting jacks. Rear of DP did not drop.

Since buying DP last May I've only used the jacks when dumping on the road to get level - had engine idling during the dump - and here at home on the concrete pad. Mostly overnighted on grass, gravel or blacktop 1 night at a time so never put jacks down.

Air bags inflate and pressure holds at about 140psi. If I park without jacks air suspension gradually decreases over 3 to 5 days depending on temps.

Made appointment with HWH, Moscow, IA for 4/8/19 but they don't honor my ESP so I'll have to pay and then work with Compass for refund. Thought about calling Winnie as they do honor it.

2nd Problem - Manual says to turn front tires to left and you will be able to release air tanks using cable in wheel well. Finally found cable stuffed into chassis rail. Worked it out but no way do I want to pull it as I am physically in the wheel well trapped between the tire and coach. Only one cable so tried driver's side and found another there.

How do ya'll do it?

Thanks in advance - Richard
Richard,
First of all, if you haven't, you really should read the HWH operators manual concerning your HWH 625 Computer Controlled Automatic Leveling System. In it, it stipulates the procedure for jack operation, pertaining to ENGINE RUNNING or not. You see, in one case, if the engine is running and you're trying to level the coach, your jacks will interfere with the RIDE HEIGHT SENSORS! In other words, the ride height sensors will try to compensate for what ever action your jacks impose on the coach ride height.

In the other operation, they don't. So, make sure you're following the correct procedure, that pertains to the operation of the HWH Jack system, if you want to keep the engine running. If you've read the Ops manual, forget all of this. I don't keep mine running at all. I shut it down and turn the key to ACC. That key position provides power to the HWH system which, takes care of dumping the bags and controlling the jacks, in the AUTOMATIC mode.

Scott

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This just doesn't make any sense (at least to me). The pressure in the air system has no connection or affect on the hydraulic jacks. There is no 'strain' on the jack if they are lowered while the airbags are still inflated, they just have to go further before they hit the ground and will therefore have less travel range to actually level the coach once they've taken the load off the airbags.

Pumping the brake pedal will use up air from the supply tanks and will lower the pressure available (if the engine isn't running), but will have no effect on the air in the suspension airbags. Similarly, dumping the airbags will not affect the air pressure available in the supply tanks, only the airbags themselves.

As far as the brakes are concerned the rear spring brakes will be engaged whenever the Yellow brake knob is pulled out. In addition, if the pressure in the air supply tank falls below about 60 psi the spring brakes will start to engage, with full engagement happening somewhere in the 20 to 40 psi range.

As a safety measure when camping one might elect to draw down the air supply so the the spring brakes will be automatically engaged and therefore eliminate the risk of the Yellow brake knob being inadvertently pushed in releasing the brakes.
Chris,
I'm pretty sure you know this but, at or below 60 psi, your LOW AIR warning will activate. Your parking brake/emergency brake, will activate or, auto-apply at or near 30-45 psi, depending on the general parameters of your particular system. You're pretty savvy on all this stuff so, hope I'm not stepping on some toes here. I'm certainly no expert on any of this. We used to test much of this stuff when on duty with our fire trucks. We'd pump the brakes 'till we reached very close to 35-40 psi and, that's when the parking brakes would come on. And, I did it recently on our coach. I was in an un crowded parking lot and was slowly rolling and pumped the brakes 'till I hit right at 32 psi and, zap, the parking brakes came on fully. So, this is my type of experience on this.
Scott
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Old 01-13-2019, 12:12 AM   #10
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...
Chris,
I'm pretty sure you know this but, at or below 60 psi, your LOW AIR warning will activate. Your parking brake/emergency brake, will activate or, auto-apply at or near 30-45 psi, depending on the general parameters of your particular system. You're pretty savvy on all this stuff so, hope I'm not stepping on some toes here. I'm certainly no expert on any of this. We used to test much of this stuff when on duty with our fire trucks. We'd pump the brakes 'till we reached very close to 35-40 psi and, that's when the parking brakes would come on. And, I did it recently on our coach. I was in an un crowded parking lot and was slowly rolling and pumped the brakes 'till I hit right at 32 psi and, zap, the parking brakes came on fully. So, this is my type of experience on this.
Scott
Sounds right to me!
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Old 01-13-2019, 08:29 AM   #11
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rgvtexan

Thanks for the recommendation but on my Meridian I can't get to the cable unless the tire is turned to the extreme. If the coach is to drop then it would be setting on the tire which could result in something breaking as the coach normally comes down abut an inch past the pot of my tires when the air bags/tanks finally drains out.
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Old 01-13-2019, 08:34 AM   #12
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Five2o,

Thanks for the input but my manual specifically states WD 40. AZPete told me the WD 40 cleans the shaft and lubricates the seals.

I've always used silicone spray on past MHs and did the first time on this DP as that is what I had in my tool chest. After talking with AZPete reading my HWN manual I switched to WD 40. Still the jacks are slow and getting slower and 2 almost never come all the way up without assistance.
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Old 01-13-2019, 08:53 AM   #13
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greystroke

Thanks for info on site. I beleive I'm already in but will check as I haven't been there lately. I've been building a library for immediate reference and have the HWH manuals.

I have released the air using my brake pedal repeatedly but that only affects the brakes. My coach doesn't lower using this procedure.

I don't run my engine when lowering jacks as that has one system working against the other. I shut off the engine and go to ACC. Since there is only DW and self normally in DP I don't use jacks often unless on unlevel ground that requires leveling.

AZPete told me to extend the jacks and spray jacks liberally and then retract. When I did my coach front dropped immediately 4 or 5" with a loud bang and then some squeaks as the coach set down immediately on the chassis rails. I waited a day and did it again and the same thing happened.

I can run engine which airs up system and then retract jacks and coach doesn't drop.

Made apt because there has to be something malfunctioning on top of the tank not automatically dumping when I hit the switch (auto manual).
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Old 01-13-2019, 08:59 AM   #14
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Scott,

Thanks. I ran engine first time because that was what I had always done (ughhhhh!) Realized something was wrong so, when all else fails, read the manual LOL).

Tanks don't empty so I'm at ride height. Didn't really care first time as I was getting under RV to spray jack shafts and the room was great but when I hit the store button she dropped like a bomb. I can honestly say I hollered, "Whooa Baby!" as if my voice could control it, but it did make me feel better. A little)

So far I haven't read anything in the manuals to address this but will spend the afternoon doing some more research.

Have a great day - Richard
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