Plugged in to 50 amp and only showing 30.

[twinboat]

Originally Posted by Bigd9

I agree. Last year we stayed at a KOA Campground in Southern Georgia. I asked the front desk about the problem, but the young lady said she would pass the comment onto the owners. It was a older park and I assume they were trying to bring it into the new world of "camping" with present day coaches. The 30 amp socket was gone, and they had added a 50 amp socket.

The problem is the EMS will limit you to using only 30 amps when it thinks that is all there is.

The EMS limiting you to 30 amps may be a good thing.

If you pull 50 amps from both lines, it's going to overload the single neutral.

[jrpend]

Originally Posted by Jim T.

Build or buy yourself one if these. I built mine & use it to test campground pedestal before we even pull into the site. It will give you information you need to determine if there's a problem with the pedestal. It will also indicate a "fake" 50 amp (no "red" light=fake)

That looks very cool. Test the pedestal before you plug in. Where do you buy/get plans to build one?

So you are looking at voltage across the legs and the phase difference?

[Jim T.]

Originally Posted by jrpend

That looks very cool. Test the pedestal before you plug in. Where do you buy/get plans to build one?

So you are looking at voltage across the legs and the phase difference?

Go to post # 16 on this thread for supply list. Mostly or all can be bought at Lowes. If not there, go to an electrical supply store. Google RV Pedestal Tester for wiring descriptions. I adapted mine to include a toggle switch which allows switching between Leg 1 & Leg 2. Toggle switch is shown on the picture on post #16.


Jim & Shirley & Abbie (Scottish Terrier)
2013 Newmar Canyon Star 3911
2005 Dodge Grand Caravan - Braun Accessibility Modified Toad
Remco Lube Pump
5 Star Tune
Progressive Industries EMS-HW50C
Coach Net Emergency Road Service

[dnystrom]

We just pulled in to Liberal KS and plugged in to a REAL 50 amp pedestal and 50 is showing on the panel. Santa Rosa Camground RV Park is where we had the problem.
This guy that came to test the pedestal with his tester told me the 50 amp is working fine and there is something wrong inside my coach. I knew better. Since this is the 1st time in 12 years we ran across this and now know what and how this 50 amp should work, I'm going to chalk it to experience and something learned. The 50 amp service was 10.00 extra at that place. Scam? Maybe......

[Jim T.]

Now you know! Glad nothing wrong with you coach's electrical system. If it's a scam, maybe it's the electrician who scammed the campground owner & not the owner scamming the customer. We'll never know the truth!


Jim & Shirley & Abbie (Scottish Terrier)
2013 Newmar Canyon Star 3911
2005 Dodge Grand Caravan - Braun Accessibility Modified Toad
Remco Lube Pump
5 Star Tune
Progressive Industries EMS-HW50C
Coach Net Emergency Road Service

[Steve Ownby]

Originally Posted by dnystrom

We just pulled in to Liberal KS and plugged in to a REAL 50 amp pedestal and 50 is showing on the panel. Santa Rosa Camground RV Park is where we had the problem.
This guy that came to test the pedestal with his tester told me the 50 amp is working fine and there is something wrong inside my coach. I knew better. Since this is the 1st time in 12 years we ran across this and now know what and how this 50 amp should work, I'm going to chalk it to experience and something learned. The 50 amp service was 10.00 extra at that place. Scam? Maybe......

It's not a complete scam as there is technically 2 50 amp legs available for a total usable power of 100 amps. You only know about it because your coach EMS revealed it. The worst issue about it is the safety issue of the possibility of overloading the neutral wire. Chances are pretty good that it would be extremely rare for that to occur. I certainly am not defending this campground owner as he is putting unsuspecting customers at some small risk.

[twinboat]

Originally Posted by Steve Ownby

It's not a complete scam as there is technically 2 50 amp legs available for a total usable power of 100 amps. You only know about it because your coach EMS revealed it. The worst issue about it is the safety issue of the possibility of overloading the neutral wire. Chances are pretty good that it would be extremely rare for that to occur. I certainly am not defending this campground owner as he is putting unsuspecting customers at some small risk.

It may be extremely rare to draw more then 50 amps ?

I would think some "all electric" MHs would do that easily.

What electric code would allow that ?

My thought is that they simply swapped a 50 amp outlet for the old 30 and jumpered it. In that case it should have tripped at a bit over 50 amps.

To the OP, was it a double breaker or a single. Even with a double breaker, one could be a blank.

[Steve Ownby]

Originally Posted by twinboat

It may be extremely rare to draw more then 50 amps ?

I would think some "all electric" MHs would do that easily.

What electric code would allow that ?

My thought is that they simply swapped a 50 amp outlet for the old 30 and jumpered it. In that case it should have tripped at a bit over 50 amps.

To the OP, was it a double breaker or a single. Even with a double breaker, one could be a blank.

At a total draw of 50 amps the neutral would be fine. I can run 2 A/C units and the microwave without exceeding 50 amps. If indeed, the 50 amp was single pole and on the same wiring as 30 amp, the campground wiring is seriously under sized & out of compliance with code.

[CharlesinGA]

On a cheater 50 amp you are not only overloading the pedestal neutral, you are overloading YOUR neutral all the way to your panel. If you DID NOT have a EMS and did not realize what was happening, and you drew more than 50 amp TOTAL (for instance30 and 30 on each side) due to the fact the two hots are NOT 180 degrees out of phase, the neutral would be seeing 60 amps. Eventually your long shore power cord would get pretty warm.

You should instantly spot this by the fact that the pedestal will only have a single 50 amp breaker and not a double pole breaker (unless they are really trying to fool you)

This should be clearly noted in a Park Review.

Charles

[dnystrom]

Single pole switch breaker. Haven't seen that before ever. The Surge Guard will protect the electrical and won't energize the coach if somethings not right with the connection to the coach. Glad I learned something.

[Steve Ownby]

Originally Posted by dnystrom

Single pole switch breaker. Haven't seen that before ever. The Surge Guard will protect the electrical and won't energize the coach if somethings not right with the connection to the coach. Glad I learned something.

I don't believe any of the currently available Surge/EMS units will identify this particular condition.

[Steve Ownby]

Originally Posted by CharlesinGA

On a cheater 50 amp you are not only overloading the pedestal neutral, you are overloading YOUR neutral all the way to your panel. If you DID NOT have a EMS and did not realize what was happening, and you drew more than 50 amp TOTAL (for instance30 and 30 on each side) due to the fact the two hots are NOT 180 degrees out of phase, the neutral would be seeing 60 amps. Eventually your long shore power cord would get pretty warm.

You should instantly spot this by the fact that the pedestal will only have a single 50 amp breaker and not a double pole breaker (unless they are really trying to fool you)

This should be clearly noted in a Park Review.

Charles

A single pole 50 amp would not be dangerous to the coach as it's impossible to draw more than a total of 50 amps. The danger is a double pole 50 amp with both legs on the same phase. This is what makes it possible to see up to 100 amps on the neutral leg.

[CharlesinGA]

Originally Posted by Steve Ownby

A single pole 50 amp would not be dangerous to the coach as it's impossible to draw more than a total of 50 amps. The danger is a double pole 50 amp with both legs on the same phase. This is what makes it possible to see up to 100 amps on the neutral leg.

You are correct, I had my head in the dark and didn't consider this.

Pretty sorry campground to do this, especially when they charge you for it.

Charles

[Steve Ownby]

Originally Posted by CharlesinGA

You are correct, I had my head in the dark and didn't consider this.



Pretty sorry campground to do this, especially when they charge you for it.



Charles

My head is in the dark a good bit of the time. I'll refrain from telling you where this dark place is.

I agree that it's pretty sorry. Hard to believe a real electrical contractor would do this kind of work.

[ChasA]

But they were supplying 50 amp. No?

[twinboat]

Originally Posted by ChasA

But they were supplying 50 amp. No?

Yes 50 amps @120 volts.

Standard 50 amp RV service is 50 amps @ 240 volts. That works out to 50 X 2 @120 volts.

Here is an article explaining it.

http://www.rvtechmag.com/electrical/chapter3.php