shocks

[DAN L]

Originally Posted by aedwards

I am going to buy new shocks for my 2001 winnebago adventurer, so i started to research them. Now i am torn between Koni's and Bilstein's, I have read good and bad on each. This is my first motorhome so i need help!
Thank you,
aedwards

i got my koni's from shox.com. they are working well for me.

http://www.shox.com/appguide/shoxsho...ctsdisplay.php

[freebirdbus]

It is important to understand the unique challenges buying shocks for a coach represent. That is why there are so many people who feel so strongly about one company vs. another based on their comparative experience. Until you get into custom valving, shocks are a mass produced 'off the rack' item. They are built to bolt onto a specific suspension system. For most production vehicles this allows a reasonable shock "head to head" comparison. Unique floor plans, even from the same manufacturer, as well as the personal gear loaded into a coach can dramatically change the weight each corner of the coach is carrying. Different tires (Michelin, Toyo, etc) will also have an effect on the load the shock is to dampen. Shocks use oil, and the oil's flow rate is affected by temperature. The same shock on the same coach will feel different on a cold day leaving New England compared to a warm Florida day at the end of that trip. Experience of others with an identical coach and tires is a good starting point. Externally adjustable shock valving works to tune the shock to your individual taste. That may limit your choice to Koni, but with a little tinkering with settings, you might be happier in the long run.

[okie-dokie]

Personally, I like the Koni's.

[Mike Canter]

The truth is that shocks are like political parties (and tires). Which ever you are or whatever you buy you are going to say is the best and defend it. If you bought Koni means you didn't try Bilstein and if you bought Bilstein means you didn't try Koni. If you painted both brands the same color and put some on a MH you wouldn't be able to tell the difference. Let me say there is nothing bad about today's Koni or Bilstein or Road King.

[freebirdbus]

Originally Posted by Mike Canter

The truth is that shocks are like political parties (and tires). Which ever you are or whatever you buy you are going to say is the best and defend it. If you bought Koni means you didn't try Bilstein and if you bought Bilstein means you didn't try Koni. If you painted both brands the same color and put some on a MH you wouldn't be able to tell the difference. Let me say there is nothing bad about today's Koni or Bilstein or Road King.

Wow, what 'truth' is that? A few, from shock engineers to consumers might think differently. Yes, there are a few people in the world with a toukus as hard as granite and who cannot tell the ride difference from a Monroe to a Road King. Probably can't tell if they are driving on a flopping flat tire either. For the rest of us who live in the real world, where physics and fluid dynamics makes a difference, shock choice will influence and enhance the joy of our driving experience. Perhaps if someone spent a little less time at the keyboard and had a little more experience behind the wheel that wouldn't' come as such a surprise
I applaud the OP and all with constructive advice based on actual, pertinent experience. Real, truthful, and constructive advice is what I think the OP was looking for, and why I am here responding.

[Mike Canter]

And that is why I am responding based on my engineering background in the aerospace industry and my many hours/miles behind the wheel of my motorhome and previous motorhomes. It is the truth.....all three shock companies are after the same great ride and they all accomplish it via one method or another. If they didn't then they wouldn't still be in business. You can't go wrong buying either of the three major brand shocks. Here is a test where they had the time and money to try all three major brand shocks on the same motorhome. Read this and you will see what I mean.

[freebirdbus]

Originally Posted by Mike Canter

If you painted both brands the same color and put some on a MH you wouldn't be able to tell the difference. .

Maybe you spent a little too much time drinking the kool-aide in the land of $400.00 hammers. For those of us with real-world suspension and shock experience, there is a ride difference between brands, and shocks with-in the same brand. The OP was looking for help to make his best educated purchase. It's OK if you don't know or understand the difference between shocks, I'm just not sure that you want to tell the whole community that you don't know or understand that.

[Mike Canter]

There is no reason to be obnoxious or rude in any replys to any theread. We discuss things on these forums in a friendly manor without trying to insult other members with rude remarks. I probably know more about the construction of shocks than you think. I totally understand shock valving and the effect on shock piston speed and other factors. We are not trying to design shocks here. They are already designed and out there and if you read enough posts on this forum you will see that people are happy with all three major brands just like the shock test article states. To help us understand where you are coming from please tell us what shocks you have, how many and how many airbags on your suspension on your motorhome. It would help us all relate if you would add your motorhome data to your signature and also fill out your profile.

[freebirdbus]

Originally Posted by Mike Canter

The truth is that shocks are like political parties (and tires). Which ever you are or whatever you buy you are going to say is the best and defend it.

Mike, That is no where near a helpful response. I posted an explanation of how the shock choice for a motorhome differs from that of a mass produced car or truck. I am not defending any manufacturer. The OP asked for help to pick one that he will be satisfied with. There is more to life that what is read in an article in a magazine. If you do truly understand how shocks work and differ, then I would think that you would understand why others posting here have found that one brand or shock works for them better than another. Maybe you patronize or defend a decision, but it doesn't mean that everyone does.

[Mike Canter]

Yes, it is a helpful response because the OP may not want to spend the high price for a shock when he can get the same ride by buying a cheaper shock. All I am trying to say is that because it is more expensive or it is a certain brand name does not mean it is a better ride. My answer was directed to the question presented by the OP and has nothing to do with your response.

Are you going to tell use what kind of shocks you have on what motorhome? It makes it hard on this forum to understand where a person is coming from if we don't know what he is driving. Thank you.

[freebirdbus]

Originally Posted by Mike Canter

Yes, it is a helpful response because the OP may not want to spend the high price for a shock when he can get the same ride by buying a cheaper shock. All I am trying to say is that because it is more expensive or it is a certain brand name does not mean it is a better ride.

Based on that can we assume that you have $59.95 Monroe shocks on your coach? Somehow I think not....

[Mike Canter]

Based on past history of RVer complaints on this forum I would not even consider a Monroe shock as a candidate for a replaceemnt shock. It is the primary shock that all want to get away from. In all my posts I only refer to three brand name shocks which are Koni FSD, Bilsteins and Road King.

So do you own a motorhome?

[freebirdbus]

Originally Posted by Mike Canter

Based on past history of RVer complaints on this forum I would not even consider a Monroe shock as a candidate for a replaceemnt shock. It is the primary shock that all want to get away from. In all my posts I only refer to three brand name shocks which are Koni FSD, Bilsteins and Road King.

So there is a consideration other than price for you? Your cost/benefit might be different than his. So, do you have personal experience with those four shock Manufacturers on your coach, or you just what you read about them.

[Mike Canter]

Again, Monroe shocks have never been considered to be a replacement shock candidate because of their history. There is thread after thread on this forum about Monaco and other motorhomes companies that used Monroe shocks as original equipement for a period of time and they failed after 15,000 to 17,000 miles and the motorhome actual becomes very rough riding, unstable and hard to handle. The Monroe's appear to be great for a short period of time. One of the problems is that Monroe painted their RV shocks all yellow top and bottom and they are often mistaken for Bilstein that are just yellow on the bottom and blue on the top dust cover so Bilstein in many cases were wrongly condemmed as a bad. Another problem was that in the late 1990's and 2001-2002 Monaco used performance valving vice comfort valving so their mhs were a little harsher in the ride which people complained about. This was according to Monaco's specs and not the shock company. In 2002-2003 Monaco switched to comfort valving in the MHs that had Bilsteins installed and the ride was greatly improved. Yes, I have had experience with both Koni and Bilstein but never with Road King because of the price of $400 a shock. Had both Bilsteins and Koni on a previous MH looking for that perfect ride and could not tell the difference between the two. My current motorhome has Bilstein shocks installed by the factory and I have not had to change them and don't expect to.

So what shocks do you have on your motorhome?

[freebirdbus]

Originally Posted by freebirdbus

Yes, there are a few people in the world with a toukus as hard as granite and who cannot tell the ride difference from a Monroe to a Road King.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike Canter
I bet that you can't tell enough difference between a Koni FSD, a Bilstein or a Road King other than cost.


Actually I could and did. Went through five sets of Bilsteins when working with Reyco Granning on the rough ride after the front axle change. The last set of Bilsteins was pretty good, they were labeled "30% less compression". Ended up with Koni Adjustables as neither Koni (FSD) nor Bilstein (Comfitrack) makes a "self adjusting" shock for this 14,600# axle. Koni has yet to make it and Bilstein no longer makes it.
Mr_D
Senior Member

Ok, so you had two types of shocks that you couldn't tell the difference between, and the rest is just stuff that you read.
'nuf said, I think we all got it now.

[Mike Canter]

So what motorhome do you own now with what shocks on it?

[JohnRR]

I think at this point in time "Point" & "Counterpoint" has been made so let's just leave it at that.

[rrs-ase-evt]

I agree with the Motorhome report on shocks that Mike posted, all about the cost and preference. I will stay with Bilsteins if I were looking to replace all eight of mine. Good info Mike .

Ron

[Coached]

Yeah, don't turn these things into a contest, please. I just want to report (to anybody who's interested) on our recent experience, one that might help the OP. We have our wonderful '08 Jeep Grand Cherokee Diesel, which now has about 65k miles under power and about 25K dragged behind our coach(s) riding on the Bilsteins that I put on it as soon as I got it. I have always been a great Bilstein fan for all our vehicles, including motor homes. At the beginning of January I took the jeep in for an "overhaul" 'cause I want to keep it for at least a few more years and, it's time. I had the front struts and rear shocks replaced along with rotors, calipers, a rear bearing, both serpentine belts and all (count 'em - 5!) fluid containers flushed and re*filled. I was really impressed with the Mechanic that did all the work by the way. I told him to go ahead with Bilsteins and he asked me if I'd ever used KYB before ... I'd never heard of KYB! He and a couple of the other Guys there raved about them so, long story still long, I went for them. Wow! One of the reasons I'm so picky about my ride is that it is almost 1400 miles from here to our Coach in Port St. Lucie, Florida so I want a great ride. I rode around on that setup for about a week then left to come home ... what a great ride home. Without trying to throw fuel on anybody's fire, please, believe me when I say I am in the corner that believes there is a difference in ride. I see that KYB sells shocks for motorhomes and, if you do a search on here, it seems that this subject has come up before? Anyway, I wanted to throw KYB into the ring for the OP ... if they are the same price or, hopefully, a bit cheaper than the Bilsteins, or Koni;s (I think Road King is off its rocker) then, based on my most recent experience, I say go look at them.

[freebirdbus]

Originally Posted by Coached

I'd never heard of KYB! .......... Anyway, I wanted to throw KYB into the ring for the OP ... if they are the same price or, hopefully, a bit cheaper than the Bilsteins, or Koni;s (I think Road King is off its rocker) then, based on my most recent experience, I say go look at them.

KYB is a superb shock brand. The key to any shock application is matching the shock's characteristic's to the suspension's frequency. For a shock manufacturer, this is more difficult in a motorhome application. The shock is designed around a suspension system with a 'best guess' of what the chassis load will be . Thank you for sharing . .