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Old 11-19-2016, 11:31 AM   #15
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Originally Posted by Dr4Film View Post
That's correct!

Actually the Autoformer has surge protection along with surge protection inside the PI EMS-HW-50C unit.

Once one set of MOV's in the Autoformer have been sucked up the surge will be sucked up by the second set in the EMS-HW-50C.

However, neither will protect you from a direct lightning strike.

Dr4Film ----- Richard
Thanks! And do you know what the difference is between the EMS-HW50C and the EMS-LCHW50?

Secondly, if the Autoformer has built in surge protection, then why would you even need PI unit?
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Old 11-19-2016, 12:09 PM   #16
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Originally Posted by specmga1 View Post
Thanks! And do you know what the difference is between the EMS-HW50C and the EMS-LCHW50?

Secondly, if the Autoformer has built in surge protection, then why would you even need PI unit?
This....
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Old 11-19-2016, 02:42 PM   #17
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Originally Posted by PanJH View Post
I had the same concerns about protecting the autoformer. I called Hughes and they recommended that the PI EMS be placed after the autoformer
If your surge guard has low/high voltage protection ,like to PI EMS, you are not going to fully utilize the autoformer as the low voltage cutoff would shutdown current flow and the autoformer will not have a chance to do it's thing.
What I did was put an inexpensive surge guard ( e.g. spike protection) between the park power and the autoformer, then after the autoformer is the ""good" PI EMS that will monitor the power coming out of those devices before it enters the transfer switch

park power -> spike/surge protector -> autoformer -> PI EMS -> xfer switch

It all fits neatly in the power bay and each component is attached with a plug and receptacle so that any device can be removed from the flow in the event of failure by simply unplugging it.
My autoformer starts to boost at 116v ...........
Post #3 in the link I posted above:

From what i have read the autoformer does not have a low voltage shutdown. It just wants to try and boost the voltage by 10%. This is why i also bought the surge protector so the shutdown will take place at 102 volts.my thought was to put the autoformer after the surge protector but i will be shut down at 102 volts on the primary and with the 10% i would loose power at 112.2 volts , but i could still be running in a safe range of 112 volts?

At 102VAC coming into my surge guard, and the Coach voltage being boosted to 112VAC at that point............I am OK with the surge guard shutting down the incoming power...........I do not care to operate the Coachs equipment on any lower voltage than 112 VAC.
Like posted........has operated fine since 2009 set up this way.......and yes, I have seen it boost and also the surge guard shut down the incoming low voltage. Hughes does not care about the shipping cost for repairs...........you are paying those
My Autoformer is the older one, no surge protection, the new Hughes Autoformer that has "Built in Surge Protection" has a "Replaceable Surge Board" and it is in front of the Autoformer circuit.


The all new Hughes Autoformer RV220-50SP has the same performance and reliability of the RV220-50 now with advanced surge protection in one package. The surge / spike protection unit is also replaceable. In the event of a massive spike, the surge unit will take the hit ensuring your booster and more importantly, your RV stays safe.

https://hughesautoformers.com/
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Old 11-19-2016, 03:59 PM   #18
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David... Seems kinda silly of me to report on specs of something you can no longer purchase --- but the Power Master VC50 has / had

Max boost 12%
Surge Protection to 3,580 Joules

With an operation range of approximately 94 to 125 volts input, the PowerMaster autoformer will boost your RV voltage to safe & efficient level.

I don't have my math hat on today but think that gets me to 105 on the low end. I remember going down this road with you and Richard some 3 or 4 years ago. Where does the time go?

So Happy Thanksgiving!
I'm holding a space for you in Arizona... hurry on down.
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Old 11-19-2016, 04:17 PM   #19
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Originally Posted by flaggship1 View Post
David... Seems kinda silly of me to report on specs of something you can no longer purchase --- but the Power Master VC50 has / had

Max boost 12%
Surge Protection to 3,580 Joules

With an operation range of approximately 94 to 125 volts input, the PowerMaster autoformer will boost your RV voltage to safe & efficient level.

I don't have my math hat on today but think that gets me to 105 on the low end. I remember going down this road with you and Richard some 3 or 4 years ago. Where does the time go?

So Happy Thanksgiving!
I'm holding a space for you in Arizona... hurry on down
.
Happy Turkey Day To the both of you also Steve!!
I am not wishing my life away........but I am for sure counting the day's ........I have less time than than the conversation you mention 3-4 years ago............
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Old 11-19-2016, 04:27 PM   #20
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Happy Turkey Day To the both of you also Steve!!
I am not wishing my life away........but I am for sure counting the day's ........I have less time than than the conversation you mention 3-4 years ago............
At the risk of being off topic - 1st Social Security check set for Feb 22nd. As a tie to the topic - think about this - the autoformer and at PI 50C eat up a $1,000 bill. On the bright side - they are saving us money in the long run. And perhaps saving our lives.
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Old 11-19-2016, 07:12 PM   #21
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Thanks! And do you know what the difference is between the EMS-HW50C and the EMS-LCHW50?

Secondly, if the Autoformer has built in surge protection, then why would you even need PI unit?
The EMS-LCHW50 has the display on the cover of the device. And if you want to utilize the bypass feature you have to purchase the bypass switch and add it to the circuit.

The EMS-HW-50C has a remote display where you can mount it in a convenient location. Plus the display has a bypass switch which allows you to maintain surge protection but no EMS protection. That is used when you have to do any repairs to the control boards. Simply place the device into bypass mode and remove the boards for replacement.

The EMS-HW-50C also allows you to purchase a second display with an A/B switch so you can have a display in two different locations.

The Autoformer and the PI EMS-Hw-50C units are for entirely different purposes even though they both contain surge protection MOV's.

The Autoformer boosts low voltage to keep your RV deivces working in the proper ideal voltage range.

The PI EMS-HW-50C is primarily used to monitor the quality of the incoming power to make sure that it stays within specific specs. When it goes outside of those specs then it will quickly shut down the bad power going to your RV. Examples of the characteristics that it monitors is high and low voltage, high and low hertz/frequency, open ground, open neutral and reverse polarity.

Dr4Film ----- Richard
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Old 11-19-2016, 08:00 PM   #22
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Originally Posted by Dr4Film View Post
The EMS-LCHW50 has the display on the cover of the device. And if you want to utilize the bypass feature you have to purchase the bypass switch and add it to the circuit.

The EMS-HW-50C has a remote display where you can mount it in a convenient location. Plus the display has a bypass switch which allows you to maintain surge protection but no EMS protection. That is used when you have to do any repairs to the control boards. Simply place the device into bypass mode and remove the boards for replacement.

The EMS-HW-50C also allows you to purchase a second display with an A/B switch so you can have a display in two different locations.

The Autoformer and the PI EMS-Hw-50C units are for entirely different purposes even though they both contain surge protection MOV's.

The Autoformer boosts low voltage to keep your RV deivces working in the proper ideal voltage range.

The PI EMS-HW-50C is primarily used to monitor the quality of the incoming power to make sure that it stays within specific specs. When it goes outside of those specs then it will quickly shut down the bad power going to your RV. Examples of the characteristics that it monitors is high and low voltage, high and low hertz/frequency, open ground, open neutral and reverse polarity.

Dr4Film ----- Richard
Now I understand! Thanks!
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Old 11-23-2016, 02:30 PM   #23
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AutoFormer and surge suppression

We have the Hughes Autoformer and a Progressive Industries surge suppressor. At the time of our installation, the AutoFormer with surge protection was not available. We had them installed by Newmar during our factory pick-up and both fit in the bay with the 50 amp cord reel. I asked Newmar to install them with "plugs" on both ends so they could be bypassed (unplugged) if necessary. I carry an external mount surge protection as a back-up.
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