Class Action Against Newmar Debate

[Chickadee]

Say, Newmar Bunch:

Have ya seen the protracted discussion on the NKK Yahoo site regarding the idea being discussed by some Newmar owners affected by checking paint jobs, to enter a Class Action Suit against Newmar. Guess I can see BOTH sides of the argument. What do ya think? Steve

[Lug_Nut]

Hard to say what to make of it. If I was that upset I don't think I would be stirring the pot. It seems to me I'ld be looking for resolution or legal action, not looking for support from others.
This, or any other forums, should be used to gather ideas and opinions from other owners, not to form a legal support group.

Of course, that's my opinion. If you don't like that one, perhaps I could give you another.

[Nathan Focht]

You asked....

I think that the coaches are out of warranty and that the owners are ticked off. If they proceed with attempts to start a class action, they will only cost themselves more time and money and drive Newmar out of business. They will still have "checked" paint and a vacant shop in Nappanee.

I am not saying that they do not have a problem but they purchased a product with a clear warranty period and that period has passed by years in most cases. Lawyers and people that cannot be responsible for their own decisions are what will ruin civilization. Sell your checking coach for whatever you can get and learn a lesson. Here's your sign...

Remember, you asked! Flames can be forwarded directly to whocares@notme.com

[Nathan Focht]

WOW, You got me in trouble Steve! I responded and it says it is pending approval because of key words I used! I thought I was nice, I can only imagine what it would say if I was mad. Anyway, my comment may/may not be coming soon.

[lnwilson]

Hey Nathan, if you remember, you were there when we brought our checking issue up with Newmar while we were under warranty! Remember the nice cut and buff they gave us? Well, that was just one big band-aid that has come off. We even had a meeting with Steve Klotz and the head of the high line paint shop guys. They looked us straight in the eye and said it was scratches under the clear and that they are not going to go anywhere. There was nothing to be concerned about. This problem is not just in the paint it's in the fiber glass. Meaning complete replacement of the sidewalls. I guess it wouldn't bother me so much Nathan if it would have happened out of warranty. I would have to eat the 70 to 75K to have it fixed. It would be like when you blew your motor and they put a temporary fix on it, just time enough to get you out of warranty, knowingly that you are going to have to replace the motor at your expense, just when your out of warranty. When they knowingly knew it's going to be a matter of time! Besides that we have pictures of the whole crew looking at the coach as I was pointing some of these out to them. In my opinion that makes a big difference. I love my coach, but you have know idea how sick it makes me every time I wash it and see more and more checking taking place. I guess it makes me sick also when I hear people state some of their ridiculous remarks when it hasn't happened to them yet. They are so worried about Newmar and covering their own butts. I guarantee they would feel differently if it happened to them.

Larry
06 MADP 4304

[Nathan Focht]

That is the problem with these situations. It is a very different matter when you are the one affected. To your specific situation, if you have it documented that it was a known issue that existed during warranty, you have grounds to feel wronged. And you are correct that if my issue had been a patch and not a fix, I would up in arms.

Where I no longer support this topic is at the class action and never ending complaining. We met people that are in a three year old coach (or older) and they want to show you the 'checking' that you have to have your head at the perfect angle, looking into the reflection of the sun, only at 72.5F, and I think one time I had to stand on one foot or something. If and when you start a class action, you are throwing open a door and asking everyone to find a reason to come and get a piece of the free money available.

Look how that is working to fix our economy. It just makes for a chumming of the sharks. I am sure there are many cases that have valid basis but I am also sure there are many more that are people expecting something to look and operate like it just rolled off the line 3+ years into heavy use.

Please allow me to give one more example. In December a nice couple pulled into Newmar with a 5er that had some major damage to the right rear. It seems the entire wheel (rim, hub, everything) separated from the axle at highway speed. The tire bounced around trying to escape the 5er and ate the fiberglass on its way out. The owner was at Newmar not to get them to repair the coach to its condition pre-failure. No, they wanted them to give them a brand new coach "because they feel they deserve one". The legal term is "unjust enrichment" when they need only "make one whole" which means they need only restore what you had before the loss.

Since you mentioned my engine, I think it is a good example. I was ready to take on the entire supply line. I made sure that the coach was "made whole" but not back to new. Larry, I do hope they make you whole but I do not agree that stirring up as much trouble as possible will achieve that result. I would submit that the more "trouble" you create, the less inclined they are to comply.

[Lug_Nut]

Larry, I think you are entirely right in your case. There are, however some that unfortunetly did not occcur within the 3 year warranty period. 3 years is one heck of a warranty. A manufacturer can not accept warranty forever, there has to be a limit. I don't know to what extent you have persued this, and how. This issue is not isolated to Newmar, but other makes also. Why a class action? Your case sounds more feasible than some. Those that may be beating the drum, may be those that were clearly out of waranty. I truly hope you can get some form of resolution, as it sounds like you deserve it. Best of luck.

Peter

[ET]

My 2 cents…

Most consumers spend thousands of dollars for a coach based on a manufacturers reputation, not just their warranty period. If a major mistake is made by the manufacture and that mistake can seriously effect a coach's resale value the consumer is entitled to try any means possible to lower his effective losses. Dometic’s refrigerator recall is way past their warranty period but they had to make good because of the potential safety hazard of a coach catching fire. Toyota made good on a sludge recall of their 6 cylinder engines way past their 5 year – 60,000 mile powertrain warranty since it was a DEFECT in Toyota’s design, not the customers fault. Newmar might or might not have know about issues with checking but since it does effect many coaches including my 2002 which is way out of warranty I’ll assume that even though they knew of the checking issue, no changes were made in their production or material selection. That can spell deliberate negligence on their part which could possibly lead to a class action lawsuit. We’re not talking about normal wear and tear. We’re not talking about a one in a million problem. We’re talking about several coach owners having the same issues that effect their pocket book on resale.

[jurzbill]

I wasnt going to do this but here goes. I got involved in this discussion on that yahoo board and all of a sudden it became a personal thing with some. They were pretty much down on me for saying an option is a legal action. I have not had the problem. I did have some paint issues but Newmar rectified them under my warranty.
However I did see some, mostly those who owned the 02 and 03 coaches being repaired. Some being there for weeks to have the problem resolved. Walls removed, repainted,etc.
The problem was known of. If it was brought to the attention of Newmar they would fix it, if you didnt, which I also saw up there at the factory, so be it. Some owners chose to ignore it for whatever reason. Now they are screaming that Newmar will not repair the problem. I talked to one owner who didnt want to be bothered sitting around that long to have the problem fixed. Now who's problem is that.
However, in cases where owners were pushed off to the side with a quick fix and the real problem was not addressed, that is time for a legal action.
I think the average person wants to resolve problems with the least amount of trouble but there are times they must go to that next step.
Remember one thing, if a company, Newmar , or anyother company admits fault, they are subject to fixing all those problems for all those coaches. Some have said a class action suit would put them out of business. They have insurance just like we do. Will it put them out of business, who knows. But to rest your decision on that and not considering you "going" out of business is foolish.
Protect yourself at all times..

[Shaun and Amy]

From what I've read this issue with the paint and all are very isolated cases. To bring up this whole discussion on the boards seems kinda silly to me. No one reading this board can help the issue or knows how to fix it, other then saying take it a professional. So, why bring up and discuss something so negative since it can't be fixed here anyway. Clearly people have issues with their rigs and talk about them on here, but usually it's to get advice on how to fix the problem, which they DO get. Maybe it's just me, but these kind of discussions usually just turn into a Newmar bashing session. Not worth it to me. Let's talk about happy things and the enjoyment we get out of our wonderful Newmar products.

Well, I've said my opinion. Maybe I'm wrong....maybe this will now turn into a Shaun bashing discussion. LOL Oh well.

[jurzbill]

Ted
I tried emailing you but was sent back to me.
here is the site.
http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/Newmar-dp-owners/

[ET]

I've joined the Yahoo group so I can read what is going on to stay informed instead of just putting my head in the sand, holding hands and singing Kumbaya or drinking the cool-aid as suggested by others.

["007"]

Well said Shaun While RVers are allowed to vent, members can not resolve these type of problems. Its not something I or others like to see ,unhappy campers, this PAINT CHECKING has been discussed before.
As someone said not everyone has the problem the ones that do should be dealing with Newmar.

[Shaun and Amy]

If you're referring to me, I wasn't saying you should put your head in the sand by any means. Clearly you miss-read my post. Again it seems that since this is such an isolated topic other means of communicating could be used to achieve the same goal. Also as I said it cannot be resolved here on this forum.

Oh well. Good Luck.