IS NEWMAR BECOMING ANOTHER FLEETWOOD?

[Nancy Fisher]

Many of us who have owned a Fleetwood Product had at one time suffered the horror of trying to work with not only their Customer Service Department but also their Company Representatives. Run-a-rounds, promises, lies, financial destitution, marital problems, mental anguish, phone calls not returned; all are a daily ritual with Fleetwood Corporation. In the life of my husband and I for the past 3 months this has become a daily ritual with us with the Newmar Corporation in Nappanee, Indiana.

After disposing of our new 2005 Fleetwood 5th wheel and its problems, we purchased a 2005 Newmar Mountainaire 5th wheel in the sum of $103,000.00 on December 24, 2004 from Wheeler's R.V., a dealership located in Las Vegas, Nevada. We decided to go in debt for the Newmar as we had been told all positive and no negatives on their product.

Can lighting strike twice in the same place? I for one am beginning to believe it can. We work television for the NASCAR circuit and are on the road a constant 10 months throughout the year. We spent several months debating the aspects of selling our home last year and purchasing a 5th wheel, which in turn would allow us to have our home with us. Within 2 weeks of purchasing a Fleetwood Triumph, we were in a battle for 6 months until Fleetwood deemed our trailer unrepairable because of a twisted frame. The Fleetwood was purchased on July 9, 2004 in Texas for cash, and by the time I arrived in California with the unit to load up our personal items, it began to fall apart. It went to a Dealership for repairs on July 28, 2004 and was not returned to us until October 30, 2004. I picked it up and pulled it to Las Vegas, a total of 315 miles, when the side of the Triumph split open. I was left homeless.

After doing research on the Newmar Corporation, we purchased their product. I began speaking with Newmar Customer Service as the dealership it was purchased from had not done some of the repairs that were to have been done prior to delivery to us. The items they did do they had.....to put it mildly a 2 year old may have done a better job. I was advised by Newmar to take the trailer to a facility in Georgia (we were in Florida at the time). Newmar stated they would have them do all the necessary repairs and the warranty work that needed to be done and that they would deal with the dealership themselves. I took the Mountainaire to the facility Newmar advised me to on February 18, 2005. The facility found additional items that needed to be repaired including replacing the front cone. Newmar Corporation decided to take the trailer to their factory in Indiana and do the repairs there. They had stated that there was so many repairs to be done and since it needed a full-body paint, their paint shop would be better to have it done at. Newmar' Representative also stated after the trailer gets to their facility it will only take them a week to do everything. Newmar did not have the trailer picked up until early April. Well, today's date is May 3, 2005, and we still do not have our trailer.

From the time they picked up our trailer we had been told continuously by Customer Service "next week, next week". We constantly had been given the run-around. Each week a Customer Representative was to call us and give us the status on our 5th wheel. Well, we had to call him as he did not call us to report the status, and at times we even had to call the emergency number and hope our representative was the one on call that night. Each week, he would tell us "Oh, I found something else", so its going to be another week". Newmar's Representative continuously "stating he found something else", had became a great concern of ours. I began to wonder what piece of junk did we purchase, if it had all these additional problems. Each week we called, we were continuously told that all original repairs were completed, and they were waiting on the paint shop. We found out yesterday that they were not looking at the original work order sent by the repair facility in Georgia. In fact, he was finding the items that were on the original "list" that they were suppose to going by.

I could go on and on with "he said, she said" but many of you already know what I have gone through with the Customer Service Department at Newmar as we have experienced it with other companies. My main concern is to let you all know what this has cost us. From Febuary 18th until the Bristol Race in Bristol, Tennessee we lived in our company's truck. During the Bristol Race we had enough and my husband demanded that Newmar get us motels. So for the first 7 weeks we had no where to stay, just parking at the track or wherever we could as Newmar would constantly tell us our trailer would be completed the following week. We would have to walk long distances in the cold just to use an outhouse. No facilities to even wash our hands if we stayed at the track. We had to eat at restaurants several times a day and we all know what an average meal cost today. At times we would have to drive 50 miles to a truck stop to shower. If we couldn't get time to get laundry done and if there was not a laundry service available, at times we would have to wear our dirty clothes for several days. Most of our clothes are in our trailer and also our winter clothes, so many nights were very cold as we could only carry so much in the truck.

Our identity was stolen, during this time that we were in Tennessee. If we had our trailer as promised this would have never happened as our personal items would have been safe. Everything was stolen; Birth Certificates, Social Security Information, 2 land deeds, our trailer contract, insurance information, warranty information, credit information, copies of our drivers license for our insurance company, bank information, credit card information, bank checks, my receipt book and list of expenses, all of our bills, a portable printer which cost me $238.75 to replace, 122 movie DVD's, backpack (cloth, blue and white), 3 map books, and the most precious thing to me, my deceased brothers work on one side of my mother's family which took him 20 years to do (it was in 3 large notebooks). (Police Report # 0521641, Johnson City Police Bureau, Johnson City, Tennessee).

Newmar did reimburse 3 months of payments and insurance, but this has cost us our savings. The day I dropped the trailer off in Georgia I had $8,000 (eight-thousand dollars) saved towards our winter living as we have no income during the off-season. I now have a total of $2.44 (two-dollars and forty-four cents) in that account. I cannot even pull that out if it was needed as my accounts are frozen because of the theft and a stolen check was cashed. My receipts are gone for January, February and March except for 3-22 to 3-31-2005. I now have the worry even after we get our 5th wheel back as to how I can save enough for winter in the time we have left before we are off. The worry doesn't stop when your home is returned to you, all that it cost you is impossible to make up. On an $8,000 dollar credit card debt, they say if you only make the minimum payments it could take up to 47 years to pay off. I don't see how I can make these finances up in 5 1/2 months.


Promises of deliver of our trailer while we were doing the Texas race the week of April 17th cost us even more. During one phone conversation our representative promised to deliver our trailer at the Texas race. I drove down to Louisiana to drop off our fifth wheel hitch and electric brakes, air bags, etc. so when our truck we ordered came in they could put a rush on transferring the items to the new truck. I paid them the money needed for the cost (this would not have cost me anything if they had told us the truth as my husband could have transferred the equipment himself). I then had to return to Texas. We were told our trailer was going to be there during another conversation and I paid the car dealership to bring the truck up to Texas as it had come in (An additional cost that would have not accrued if we were told the truth). I stayed in Texas while my husband went on to do the Arizona race and then as always he called to see what day and once again was told by our Representative that he found something (This was also an item that was on the list). This once again was additional expense as I accrued expenses in Texas and my husband in Arizona at the same time. The same thing again happened this week. Last week we were promised our trailer would be delivered today (Wednesday) and Monday they told us it was going out Tuesday morning but that he wanted to walk around and inspect it once more. Well Tuesday (yesterday) came and you can probably guess by now what happened. "Oh, he found something", (Also another item on the list). My husband and I were very angry about this happening again and my husband demanded to speak with our representative's boss (whom we had tried to get through to for 2 weeks). My husband finally talked with him and he was to have had an answer for us this morning as to when our trailer would be returned. But as usual, all that happened was a conference call and no answer as promised. They said they would have an answer tomorrow, but I am unsure of that as the trust with this company no longer exists.

Even though we are now getting motels expenses still accrue. We have the expense of traveling to and from the track. Mileage and cost vary on fuel depending on where we may be staying. We still have to pay the high cost of additional fuel, cost of meals, at times laundry service (if available, because some Laundromats close before we leave the track) etc.

We have asked for some reimbursement on the additional costs that this has caused us and had given a list to one of the Customer Service Representatives prior to our items getting stolen. My husband was told by our Representative's boss at that time that they agree that additional compensation should occur over and above the payments and insurance. During the conversation today, all they talked about on compensation was, that they paid us back our 3 payments and 3 payments, and if I wanted to, send a list in on our expenses and he would look it over. Well, for one thing, we had already done this when we had the actual figures and receipts in front of us. I do not have the receipts now, for the first 7 weeks, as they were stolen with everything else. He told us to guess at what it cost and if we couldn't remember something then make something up.

I can't just make something up as this would be dishonest. Plus, all I believe he is doing is trying to satisfy us temporary until they can get the trailer back. Most people will just give up and this is what I myself believe they are hoping for......example, I'll be happy to have my trailer and won't want to be bothered with it anymore. I just can't believe that someone would tell another to be dishonest.....I for one refuse to go to that level. I can give them an honest cost from the time our items got stolen March 22 to today.

3-22 to 3-30-2005

Replace printer: $238.75
Replace maps: $130.71
Motels: $515.40 (We had to get a motel for a week as the truck had to stay at the track, mandatory week off)
Fuel: $542.01
Cash: $907.70 (Food, laundry, parking, water)

4-1 to 4-30-2005
Fuel: $ 448.03
Cash: $1,948.95 (Food, laundry, water, parking, $471.00 dealership for installation, $500.00 for delivery)
Motel: $ 489.58 (Motel, Texas while waiting for trailer that never came)

5-1 to 5-3-2005
Fuel: $108.08
Cash: $302.80

(NOTE) The above amount totals $5,632.01 and does not include the previous 7 weeks of expenses prior to 3-22-2005. Cash was strictly used on expenses. We never went out to a movie nor any other entertainment, if we wanted to we just did not do it as we could not relax enough. We could not see wasting money on entertainment with all of the tension we are under. So as you can see, even with our paychecks, after we paid our bills, we had to go into our savings accounts. One thing else I want to point out, after my personal items were stolen, not having the insurance information on my trailer caused my last payment to be late, I sent it out as soon as I could have a friend go find out what my policy number and address to my company was. But this caused my insurance to cancel. This was my last payment and would have paid me up to October. I had to find a new insurance company and I ended up paying an additional year which cost me $2234.00. I had to pay it in full because my previous policy had been cancelled for what they stated as non-payment. So if you add that, then you are seeing added expenses of $7866.01 since 3-22-2005.

If we had our trailer our expenses would be $100.00 week for food, $0.00 for fuel Wednesday to Sunday and sometimes Tuesday to Sunday depending which day we park as we would be parking at the track. $25.00 week for propane (this depends on what the weather is like), $20.00 a week for dumping tanks (they have a pump truck come and drain our tanks if we are not hooked up to sewage).My laundry would be $10.00 a week. This shows an extreme difference in having your home or being homeless and being forced to live like we had to.

I didn't mention names of persons involved in this do to the fact I believe regardless of what a person has done, everyone deserves some privacy. But if anyone wants to email me and ask me who they are whereas you may protect yourself and to prepare yourself in the event this may happen to you, I will answer any of your questions. Email: nancylee420@hotmail.com.

I only took my 5th wheel in for some warranty repairs and never dreamed I would experience the same treatment I had with Fleetwood. Experts found all the major problems, not us. We didn't even know these other problems existed. I could not believe that a $103,000 dollar coach would have even passed the initial inspection at the factory before being sent to a dealership. This only proves to me that no matter how good a Company's reputation is, there are some people that just do not do their job. But the scary part is innocent people like you and me pay the price. If my husband and I were retired and on a fixed income, we would lose everything and the worse part now is, we still may. You do not pay the price for a Newmar product for weekend get-a-ways. You do not work your whole life to be forced to live on the streets because an employee does not perform his/her job.

My husband and I have been told by many of our co-workers who have seen what has been happening to us that we trust and believe in people to much allowing them to treat us anyway they want to. This also answers the question as to "How can lightning strike twice?" I refuse to become a dishonest person as I know there are people in this world that have the same morals as I do. I was raised with one main teaching in life and that is "If you don't lie, you do not need a good memory". How true this is. I have to say one thing about the dealership in Georgia I had taken my unit to first, they are the most wonderful people I have met. They are the only people I will ever trust to work on my unit. They have stood by us throughout this whole ordeal. I will never believe an employee of Newmar Corporation ever again regardless of what respectable things others say about them.

The dishonesty of Newmar's Representative's has caused a great wound in my relationship with my husband. I feel at times that this has totally taken my sanity. I have cried for days non-stop, which in turn has made me ill at times. I get angry at my husband and blame things on him as I had sold the only roof I had over my head only to have my new home taken away. For the past 3 months I have felt that I would have put up with the gangs and shootings then to be treated like this. Newmar had a habit if they returned any of our calls, it was normally at the closing of their business day especially on a Friday, this in turn would cause my husband and I to be at each others throat all weekend. We never fought, we would have a lover's spat now and then but we never fought. It got to the point the other night when I told my husband I wouldn't care if we never slept in the same bed ever again. I have felt like I have been on a roller-coaster that never stops. Round and round, up and down. One day told my trailer will be brought to us, the next stating another week. Over and over. You begin to feel great one day, you're told your unit is done, that this is finally over just to be tore down the next day, week after week after week. No, I am not the happy person I once was, I used to be so patient and now I avoid speaking with people because I do not want to say something that may hurt someone's feelings. I wouldn't mean to, it's just that the anger in me is so strong and I don't want to take it out on anyone. The only person I talk with is my husband and he gets the blunt of it all, but I don't know what to do anymore. Is this driving me crazy? I'd say, yes it is. My husband had to take me to a physician because I couldn't stop crying because of the pressures. I have had to go on Paxal to try to help with the depression and the crying, but the 20 milligrams I have to take, daily doesn't help anymore. Is this how it is suppose to be? I don't think so. I used to be a strong person, a fun-loving person, and now I don't know what I am.

Do I hang a sign on my unit as I have seen others do with Fleetwood products? Should it state something like "Newmar cost me my savings and sanity, ask me why". If that is what it will take to warn others, then I may do just that. I do not want to see any couple go through what we have. They do have a good unit, but they have a lot of problems in communicating and persons full-filling their job requirements.

PLEASE BEWARE.................this can happen to any of us. If lightning could strike me twice, it can you also. And one thing to take into consideration before you buy. Weigh all your pros and cons especially when it comes to the price. Do you want to spend $100,000 on a unit and possibly have these problems or would it be better to go buy a different unit and not spend your life savings, which may save you in case of these problems.

PLEASE READ IMPORTANT DATA ......COULD THIS BE WHY I AM TREATED THIS WAY
(NOTE: DID NEWMAR BRING IN FLEETWOOD TACTICS)
Richard Parks, President, Newmar Corporation (Manufacturer). Prior to his position at Newmar, Dick Parks held several positions at Fleetwood Enterprises, including Senior Vice President of the Recreational Vehicle Group, over a period of 17 years. He has served on the RVIA Board of Directors, and on the Public and Legislative Affairs Committee of RVIA.

(NOTE: FOLLOWING IN FLEETWOOD'S FOOTSTEPS-I FOUND THIS ON iRV2 discussion forum on May 3, 2005, this was posted April 11, 2005 by Route 66 "Senior Member"�)

The grapevine says the 2006 Newmars will have a 1 year warranty instead of the 3 year warranty.

(RESPONSE BY EDMUND A. SKIBINSKI POSTED APRIL 11, 2005)

This was a quote from Jeff Regan, Alpine Recreation:
I wish this was just a rumor. Dick Parks told customers about the warranty rollback possibility at the F.M.C.A. Rally in Perry, Georgia.
This information has not been given to dealers officially, but I am told by my rep. that Essex will still have the 3yr./50,000mi. warranty, but no other Newmar products--they will all have one year warranties., except the chassis/drivetrains. Ed.S

2005 Newmar Mountain Aire W-24 , 2001 Jeep Grand Cherokee towed vehicle Newmar Kountry Klub 7284L Pa. State Directors

(Note: if memory serves me correctly; isn't this what Fleetwood recently did? If I had known this, I would have never purchased a Newmar. It also seems that their workmanship is beginning to show the same signs as the Fleetwood product)

I found this on Newmar's website, but are they truly living by this: A Message from the late Virgil Miller, President, Newmar Corp.
"It is my deepest belief that we need to treat others as we treat ourselves, that I should treat our customers in the same manner as I would want to be treated. I believe these values helped make our company what it is today. I know I will always hold onto these beliefs. Our managers, our designers, our assembly-line workers strive to follow these values, too.

[Nancy Fisher]

Many of us who have owned a Fleetwood Product had at one time suffered the horror of trying to work with not only their Customer Service Department but also their Company Representatives. Run-a-rounds, promises, lies, financial destitution, marital problems, mental anguish, phone calls not returned; all are a daily ritual with Fleetwood Corporation. In the life of my husband and I for the past 3 months this has become a daily ritual with us with the Newmar Corporation in Nappanee, Indiana.

After disposing of our new 2005 Fleetwood 5th wheel and its problems, we purchased a 2005 Newmar Mountainaire 5th wheel in the sum of $103,000.00 on December 24, 2004 from Wheeler's R.V., a dealership located in Las Vegas, Nevada. We decided to go in debt for the Newmar as we had been told all positive and no negatives on their product.

Can lighting strike twice in the same place? I for one am beginning to believe it can. We work television for the NASCAR circuit and are on the road a constant 10 months throughout the year. We spent several months debating the aspects of selling our home last year and purchasing a 5th wheel, which in turn would allow us to have our home with us. Within 2 weeks of purchasing a Fleetwood Triumph, we were in a battle for 6 months until Fleetwood deemed our trailer unrepairable because of a twisted frame. The Fleetwood was purchased on July 9, 2004 in Texas for cash, and by the time I arrived in California with the unit to load up our personal items, it began to fall apart. It went to a Dealership for repairs on July 28, 2004 and was not returned to us until October 30, 2004. I picked it up and pulled it to Las Vegas, a total of 315 miles, when the side of the Triumph split open. I was left homeless.

After doing research on the Newmar Corporation, we purchased their product. I began speaking with Newmar Customer Service as the dealership it was purchased from had not done some of the repairs that were to have been done prior to delivery to us. The items they did do they had.....to put it mildly a 2 year old may have done a better job. I was advised by Newmar to take the trailer to a facility in Georgia (we were in Florida at the time). Newmar stated they would have them do all the necessary repairs and the warranty work that needed to be done and that they would deal with the dealership themselves. I took the Mountainaire to the facility Newmar advised me to on February 18, 2005. The facility found additional items that needed to be repaired including replacing the front cone. Newmar Corporation decided to take the trailer to their factory in Indiana and do the repairs there. They had stated that there was so many repairs to be done and since it needed a full-body paint, their paint shop would be better to have it done at. Newmar' Representative also stated after the trailer gets to their facility it will only take them a week to do everything. Newmar did not have the trailer picked up until early April. Well, today's date is May 3, 2005, and we still do not have our trailer.

From the time they picked up our trailer we had been told continuously by Customer Service "next week, next week". We constantly had been given the run-around. Each week a Customer Representative was to call us and give us the status on our 5th wheel. Well, we had to call him as he did not call us to report the status, and at times we even had to call the emergency number and hope our representative was the one on call that night. Each week, he would tell us "Oh, I found something else", so its going to be another week". Newmar's Representative continuously "stating he found something else", had became a great concern of ours. I began to wonder what piece of junk did we purchase, if it had all these additional problems. Each week we called, we were continuously told that all original repairs were completed, and they were waiting on the paint shop. We found out yesterday that they were not looking at the original work order sent by the repair facility in Georgia. In fact, he was finding the items that were on the original "list" that they were suppose to going by.

I could go on and on with "he said, she said" but many of you already know what I have gone through with the Customer Service Department at Newmar as we have experienced it with other companies. My main concern is to let you all know what this has cost us. From Febuary 18th until the Bristol Race in Bristol, Tennessee we lived in our company's truck. During the Bristol Race we had enough and my husband demanded that Newmar get us motels. So for the first 7 weeks we had no where to stay, just parking at the track or wherever we could as Newmar would constantly tell us our trailer would be completed the following week. We would have to walk long distances in the cold just to use an outhouse. No facilities to even wash our hands if we stayed at the track. We had to eat at restaurants several times a day and we all know what an average meal cost today. At times we would have to drive 50 miles to a truck stop to shower. If we couldn't get time to get laundry done and if there was not a laundry service available, at times we would have to wear our dirty clothes for several days. Most of our clothes are in our trailer and also our winter clothes, so many nights were very cold as we could only carry so much in the truck.

Our identity was stolen, during this time that we were in Tennessee. If we had our trailer as promised this would have never happened as our personal items would have been safe. Everything was stolen; Birth Certificates, Social Security Information, 2 land deeds, our trailer contract, insurance information, warranty information, credit information, copies of our drivers license for our insurance company, bank information, credit card information, bank checks, my receipt book and list of expenses, all of our bills, a portable printer which cost me $238.75 to replace, 122 movie DVD's, backpack (cloth, blue and white), 3 map books, and the most precious thing to me, my deceased brothers work on one side of my mother's family which took him 20 years to do (it was in 3 large notebooks). (Police Report # 0521641, Johnson City Police Bureau, Johnson City, Tennessee).

Newmar did reimburse 3 months of payments and insurance, but this has cost us our savings. The day I dropped the trailer off in Georgia I had $8,000 (eight-thousand dollars) saved towards our winter living as we have no income during the off-season. I now have a total of $2.44 (two-dollars and forty-four cents) in that account. I cannot even pull that out if it was needed as my accounts are frozen because of the theft and a stolen check was cashed. My receipts are gone for January, February and March except for 3-22 to 3-31-2005. I now have the worry even after we get our 5th wheel back as to how I can save enough for winter in the time we have left before we are off. The worry doesn't stop when your home is returned to you, all that it cost you is impossible to make up. On an $8,000 dollar credit card debt, they say if you only make the minimum payments it could take up to 47 years to pay off. I don't see how I can make these finances up in 5 1/2 months.


Promises of deliver of our trailer while we were doing the Texas race the week of April 17th cost us even more. During one phone conversation our representative promised to deliver our trailer at the Texas race. I drove down to Louisiana to drop off our fifth wheel hitch and electric brakes, air bags, etc. so when our truck we ordered came in they could put a rush on transferring the items to the new truck. I paid them the money needed for the cost (this would not have cost me anything if they had told us the truth as my husband could have transferred the equipment himself). I then had to return to Texas. We were told our trailer was going to be there during another conversation and I paid the car dealership to bring the truck up to Texas as it had come in (An additional cost that would have not accrued if we were told the truth). I stayed in Texas while my husband went on to do the Arizona race and then as always he called to see what day and once again was told by our Representative that he found something (This was also an item that was on the list). This once again was additional expense as I accrued expenses in Texas and my husband in Arizona at the same time. The same thing again happened this week. Last week we were promised our trailer would be delivered today (Wednesday) and Monday they told us it was going out Tuesday morning but that he wanted to walk around and inspect it once more. Well Tuesday (yesterday) came and you can probably guess by now what happened. "Oh, he found something", (Also another item on the list). My husband and I were very angry about this happening again and my husband demanded to speak with our representative's boss (whom we had tried to get through to for 2 weeks). My husband finally talked with him and he was to have had an answer for us this morning as to when our trailer would be returned. But as usual, all that happened was a conference call and no answer as promised. They said they would have an answer tomorrow, but I am unsure of that as the trust with this company no longer exists.

Even though we are now getting motels expenses still accrue. We have the expense of traveling to and from the track. Mileage and cost vary on fuel depending on where we may be staying. We still have to pay the high cost of additional fuel, cost of meals, at times laundry service (if available, because some Laundromats close before we leave the track) etc.

We have asked for some reimbursement on the additional costs that this has caused us and had given a list to one of the Customer Service Representatives prior to our items getting stolen. My husband was told by our Representative's boss at that time that they agree that additional compensation should occur over and above the payments and insurance. During the conversation today, all they talked about on compensation was, that they paid us back our 3 payments and 3 payments, and if I wanted to, send a list in on our expenses and he would look it over. Well, for one thing, we had already done this when we had the actual figures and receipts in front of us. I do not have the receipts now, for the first 7 weeks, as they were stolen with everything else. He told us to guess at what it cost and if we couldn't remember something then make something up.

I can't just make something up as this would be dishonest. Plus, all I believe he is doing is trying to satisfy us temporary until they can get the trailer back. Most people will just give up and this is what I myself believe they are hoping for......example, I'll be happy to have my trailer and won't want to be bothered with it anymore. I just can't believe that someone would tell another to be dishonest.....I for one refuse to go to that level. I can give them an honest cost from the time our items got stolen March 22 to today.

3-22 to 3-30-2005

Replace printer: $238.75
Replace maps: $130.71
Motels: $515.40 (We had to get a motel for a week as the truck had to stay at the track, mandatory week off)
Fuel: $542.01
Cash: $907.70 (Food, laundry, parking, water)

4-1 to 4-30-2005
Fuel: $ 448.03
Cash: $1,948.95 (Food, laundry, water, parking, $471.00 dealership for installation, $500.00 for delivery)
Motel: $ 489.58 (Motel, Texas while waiting for trailer that never came)

5-1 to 5-3-2005
Fuel: $108.08
Cash: $302.80

(NOTE) The above amount totals $5,632.01 and does not include the previous 7 weeks of expenses prior to 3-22-2005. Cash was strictly used on expenses. We never went out to a movie nor any other entertainment, if we wanted to we just did not do it as we could not relax enough. We could not see wasting money on entertainment with all of the tension we are under. So as you can see, even with our paychecks, after we paid our bills, we had to go into our savings accounts. One thing else I want to point out, after my personal items were stolen, not having the insurance information on my trailer caused my last payment to be late, I sent it out as soon as I could have a friend go find out what my policy number and address to my company was. But this caused my insurance to cancel. This was my last payment and would have paid me up to October. I had to find a new insurance company and I ended up paying an additional year which cost me $2234.00. I had to pay it in full because my previous policy had been cancelled for what they stated as non-payment. So if you add that, then you are seeing added expenses of $7866.01 since 3-22-2005.

If we had our trailer our expenses would be $100.00 week for food, $0.00 for fuel Wednesday to Sunday and sometimes Tuesday to Sunday depending which day we park as we would be parking at the track. $25.00 week for propane (this depends on what the weather is like), $20.00 a week for dumping tanks (they have a pump truck come and drain our tanks if we are not hooked up to sewage).My laundry would be $10.00 a week. This shows an extreme difference in having your home or being homeless and being forced to live like we had to.

I didn't mention names of persons involved in this do to the fact I believe regardless of what a person has done, everyone deserves some privacy. But if anyone wants to email me and ask me who they are whereas you may protect yourself and to prepare yourself in the event this may happen to you, I will answer any of your questions. Email: nancylee420@hotmail.com.

I only took my 5th wheel in for some warranty repairs and never dreamed I would experience the same treatment I had with Fleetwood. Experts found all the major problems, not us. We didn't even know these other problems existed. I could not believe that a $103,000 dollar coach would have even passed the initial inspection at the factory before being sent to a dealership. This only proves to me that no matter how good a Company's reputation is, there are some people that just do not do their job. But the scary part is innocent people like you and me pay the price. If my husband and I were retired and on a fixed income, we would lose everything and the worse part now is, we still may. You do not pay the price for a Newmar product for weekend get-a-ways. You do not work your whole life to be forced to live on the streets because an employee does not perform his/her job.

My husband and I have been told by many of our co-workers who have seen what has been happening to us that we trust and believe in people to much allowing them to treat us anyway they want to. This also answers the question as to "How can lightning strike twice?" I refuse to become a dishonest person as I know there are people in this world that have the same morals as I do. I was raised with one main teaching in life and that is "If you don't lie, you do not need a good memory". How true this is. I have to say one thing about the dealership in Georgia I had taken my unit to first, they are the most wonderful people I have met. They are the only people I will ever trust to work on my unit. They have stood by us throughout this whole ordeal. I will never believe an employee of Newmar Corporation ever again regardless of what respectable things others say about them.

The dishonesty of Newmar's Representative's has caused a great wound in my relationship with my husband. I feel at times that this has totally taken my sanity. I have cried for days non-stop, which in turn has made me ill at times. I get angry at my husband and blame things on him as I had sold the only roof I had over my head only to have my new home taken away. For the past 3 months I have felt that I would have put up with the gangs and shootings then to be treated like this. Newmar had a habit if they returned any of our calls, it was normally at the closing of their business day especially on a Friday, this in turn would cause my husband and I to be at each others throat all weekend. We never fought, we would have a lover's spat now and then but we never fought. It got to the point the other night when I told my husband I wouldn't care if we never slept in the same bed ever again. I have felt like I have been on a roller-coaster that never stops. Round and round, up and down. One day told my trailer will be brought to us, the next stating another week. Over and over. You begin to feel great one day, you're told your unit is done, that this is finally over just to be tore down the next day, week after week after week. No, I am not the happy person I once was, I used to be so patient and now I avoid speaking with people because I do not want to say something that may hurt someone's feelings. I wouldn't mean to, it's just that the anger in me is so strong and I don't want to take it out on anyone. The only person I talk with is my husband and he gets the blunt of it all, but I don't know what to do anymore. Is this driving me crazy? I'd say, yes it is. My husband had to take me to a physician because I couldn't stop crying because of the pressures. I have had to go on Paxal to try to help with the depression and the crying, but the 20 milligrams I have to take, daily doesn't help anymore. Is this how it is suppose to be? I don't think so. I used to be a strong person, a fun-loving person, and now I don't know what I am.

Do I hang a sign on my unit as I have seen others do with Fleetwood products? Should it state something like "Newmar cost me my savings and sanity, ask me why". If that is what it will take to warn others, then I may do just that. I do not want to see any couple go through what we have. They do have a good unit, but they have a lot of problems in communicating and persons full-filling their job requirements.

PLEASE BEWARE.................this can happen to any of us. If lightning could strike me twice, it can you also. And one thing to take into consideration before you buy. Weigh all your pros and cons especially when it comes to the price. Do you want to spend $100,000 on a unit and possibly have these problems or would it be better to go buy a different unit and not spend your life savings, which may save you in case of these problems.

PLEASE READ IMPORTANT DATA ......COULD THIS BE WHY I AM TREATED THIS WAY
(NOTE: DID NEWMAR BRING IN FLEETWOOD TACTICS)
Richard Parks, President, Newmar Corporation (Manufacturer). Prior to his position at Newmar, Dick Parks held several positions at Fleetwood Enterprises, including Senior Vice President of the Recreational Vehicle Group, over a period of 17 years. He has served on the RVIA Board of Directors, and on the Public and Legislative Affairs Committee of RVIA.

(NOTE: FOLLOWING IN FLEETWOOD'S FOOTSTEPS-I FOUND THIS ON iRV2 discussion forum on May 3, 2005, this was posted April 11, 2005 by Route 66 "Senior Member"�)

The grapevine says the 2006 Newmars will have a 1 year warranty instead of the 3 year warranty.

(RESPONSE BY EDMUND A. SKIBINSKI POSTED APRIL 11, 2005)

This was a quote from Jeff Regan, Alpine Recreation:
I wish this was just a rumor. Dick Parks told customers about the warranty rollback possibility at the F.M.C.A. Rally in Perry, Georgia.
This information has not been given to dealers officially, but I am told by my rep. that Essex will still have the 3yr./50,000mi. warranty, but no other Newmar products--they will all have one year warranties., except the chassis/drivetrains. Ed.S

2005 Newmar Mountain Aire W-24 , 2001 Jeep Grand Cherokee towed vehicle Newmar Kountry Klub 7284L Pa. State Directors

(Note: if memory serves me correctly; isn't this what Fleetwood recently did? If I had known this, I would have never purchased a Newmar. It also seems that their workmanship is beginning to show the same signs as the Fleetwood product)

I found this on Newmar's website, but are they truly living by this: A Message from the late Virgil Miller, President, Newmar Corp.
"It is my deepest belief that we need to treat others as we treat ourselves, that I should treat our customers in the same manner as I would want to be treated. I believe these values helped make our company what it is today. I know I will always hold onto these beliefs. Our managers, our designers, our assembly-line workers strive to follow these values, too.

[palmetto]

[Bill Senick]

Unbelievable, maybe it is.

["007"]

Nancy,
A warm Welcome to irv2. It can not completely make up for what you are going thru.
Since the lost of Mr. Miller I believe his commitment to the customer has been put thru a grinder. I have visited the Newmar repair center 3 times with 3 different coachs for work to be done because of Dealer problems in not knowing how to fix something. The employees were the most dedicated group of people you would see for a company towards the customer. That was during Virgil Miller's management. I made one last visit, April 04, after he died, an they still had this dedication.

This past year the management has changed, you guessed it someone from Fleetwood, an changes have been made, an you have been caught up in these changes so it would seem.
The employees are caught up in this also an I don't think they are too happy about it also.
I would sent a copy of your post to Newmar an you can send it thru there web site on customer contact. You can sign on because your a Newmar owner. Newmarcorp.com
Newmar isn't the only Mfg with customer problems lately,Winney, your friends at Fleet are having customer relation an coach problems also.
If stock holders start losing profits maybe some changes will be made before everything is lost.
I will stop now because I'am sure some others will have something to say, I hope your problems will be quickly resolved. ---"007"

[PhilnJune]

All I can say is wow, I am shocked!!!!!

[jojolima]

I would suggest that you send a CERTIFIED letter to Mr. Parks. It would also be appropriate that he knows that this has been posted on the internet.

I know personally of a problem that Fleetwood had with a Bounder Motorhome. They would NOT replace, but rather spent $190,000 to repair and reimburse the owner for living expenses while it was in the repair shop. He was planning to trade for a Mountain Aire or Essex, but is not afraid because of the "Fleetwood" management at Newmar.

There is NOT excuse of this poor service.

They owe you total reimbursement for your expenses. They also owe you for the multiple issues that they have caused.

[Nancy Fisher]

I want to "Thank you" all for your support on this matter. You have allowed me to regain some of my faith in people and for that I will always be indebted to you.

My husband was fortunate today to have finally been able to have put in contact with upper management after he totally lost his cool. This was after our Customer Representative Customer Rep., stated today "your trailer is done and will be shipped to you Monday morning,(here comes that word again) "BUT" we have some repairs that have to be finalized Monday morning". As you know from my first letter this was our Friday ritual and then of course we all know what happened on Monday.....Common sense tells you......if you have repairs to finalize on Monday then the trailer is not done on the Friday before.....

A meeting about this matter had taken place between upper management and we were promised by them that our trailer would be finished today and the employees would work until it was done. He also assured us the trailer would be delivered to us Wednesday morning.

They also stated that a check for the expenses we accrued would be cut and over-nighted to us Monday.

I will follow-up this week and let you know whether everything went as promised.

Once again "Thank You" all so very very much.

[PhilnJune]

Yes Nancy please keep us posted, I am concerned about a once "outstanding Motorhome Manufacturer" becomming just another profit centre having no customer Loyalty and producing run of the mill product.

[Nancy Fisher]

Well I do have some good news, Mr. Rutledge of Newmar stuck to his word and our trailer was returned to us yesterday. Mr. Rutledge also agreed after carefully looking at the expense this had cost us financially that he did over-night me a check for those expenses we accrued and for this I am very greatful.

I am deeply sorry that this could not have been resolved earlier. It was a battle for us to get past Customer Service to reach someone in the Upper management. I wish these companies would not make it so difficult for a party to speak with in a situation like ours. To many times problems could be resolved if a person is given to someone with authority.

There are a few items that had not been repaired and had been overlooked but I will have that taken care of when I take it to Dick Gore's RV in Georgia for service. I can depend on them to get things done and repaired in a timely manner, and they have an excellent staff.

I really hated to lose my confidence in a Comapany such as Newmar, and hopefully one day I will regain the trust that has been lost. I do love my trailer and they do build a decent coach, but the communication needs to be improved. I guess I will have to see what time brings.

[Lady Nyrtle]

We are very glad to hear that you have your trailer back and that you have a good service representative. Independence RV in Winter Garden, Florida, takes care of our coach and the last time we had it in, they did about five repairs of things we had overlooked! Now there is a confidence builder.

Trust is a tricky thing. It takes a long time to build and only one incident to destroy. The rebuilding takes even longer. The many posts on this and other forums about the management changes at Newmar have convinced us to look around hard when we are ready to trade. Before all of this started coming up, Newmar would have had a strong position for consideration.

Right now we are in Tampa at the Good Sam safety rally, which we highly recommend. There are several Newmar product owners here and there has been much discussion among us and others about the alarming changes. Hope they come to understand the public relations hit they are taking and go back to their previous attitudes.

Good luck with your trailer.

[edgray]

Originally posted by SchnoodleMom ::<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">The many posts on this and other forums about the management changes at Newmar have convinced us to look around hard when we are ready to trade. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Please allow me to post two observations:

1. the title of this thread seems meant to imply that Fleetwood is a bad company with bad products and poor management. I guess some people will make that inference about almost every RV manf. out there. I know there are owners of Fleetwood products out there that are happy with their choice, because I've spoken to several in campgrounds. I have no personal experience with Fleetwood, and therefore remain neutral in that debate.

2. the statement quoted above is good advice to ANY prospective buyer. If more RV shoppers would take a "hard look",and then reward the builders of QUALITY products with their purchase, we would all see an improvement in overall quality. Sadly, people buy on impulse or fall in love with a product pitched to them at a show and do not do their homework. Then, as soon as the "buyer's remorse" kicks in, we are all treated to endless posts about how they were tricked and how bad all these dealers and manufactures are when it comes to customer service.

and now an editorial:


As a Newmar owner (who looked hard at competing brands) I've been very pleased with our unit's quality and VALUE. That does not mean I will blindly buy from Newmar next time. It does mean that I'll use Newmar's quality,at that time, as the benchmark to judge other manufacture's quality. And then I'll buy what represents the best VALUE for me. Thanks for listening. ED

[RobAndTeresa]

Glad all worked out for you in the long run. Very well said Ed and I whole heartedly agree. We thus far have been very pleased with our Newmar, and hope that remains so. I don't like to see the reduction from 3 yr to 1 yr on Newmar's future warranty period...but, that being said, I have (knock on wood) only had several small issues within the first couple months that were taken care of very quickly by Independence RV. Hopefully things will work themselves out.

[Michael Richardson]

Nancy, it is good to hear that everything seems to be going your way now. We had a similiar experience with another brand of fifth wheel. The rules change when the unit is you home. I remember the first time the dealer asked can you leave it. It did not matter that I had an appointment and everyone knew we lived in the unit. It was very emotial for us . My background is logistics and customer service. I have been to the Newmar factory two times the issues from my perspective are two fold.
1) Dealer support
2) Scheduling
There are a lot of issues with dealer support, everything from overcharges, to charging for work not being done to doing shoddy work.When you as an owner have problems with a dealer what do you do ? call the factory and set up an appointment. Nancy I know this was not the circumstance in your case. But you were caught up in the scheduling issue. The repair shop is covered up with work, IMHO most of this is because the dealers will not support the manufacturer or the customer after the sale. Newmar makes a quality product. The technicians that do the work at the factory are great people with a good work ethic, good knowledge, craftsmanship and they do care, they just get covered up, the best jugglers can only balance so many balls in the air. I also know how hard it is to build up trust after you have been burned. This will be very hard to do. Nancy. I am not sure how a situation like yours deteriorates to the point of pure frustration. I have a feeling the information is being kept in someones head and it isn't being passed up the chain of command..There are not many easy roads when you have service problems the road is much rougher if you live in your unit. . I do know this if I ever bought another unit I would give Newmar the first chance. I do hope everything works out for you