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Old 12-05-2015, 02:52 PM   #15
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Originally Posted by jimbo2013 View Post
One other point, they (Newmar) are not notifying the folks that bought these problem coaches to mitigate their liability.

(not all buyers are on this forum and are unaware)

If something bad happens a CEO may be found of gross negligence and get prison time.

By the way if several owners get together you may possibly have a class action lawsuit.
Unfortunately this will probably not be the case. Look at the issue with the ignition switch GM ducked for years. They finally got fined heavily but no one went to jail that I am aware of or even charged. And there were several deaths.

Gordon and Janet
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Old 12-05-2015, 03:11 PM   #16
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Originally Posted by Gordon Dewald View Post
IMO NCC and MSRP seem to be imaginary numbers dreamed up behind closed doors by the marketing folks to make the product seem better than it really is. In either case you should not believe them.
I'm definitely getting that impression.....

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Old 12-05-2015, 03:25 PM   #17
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Keep up the good work in challenging Newmar. I believe we are at the point where Newmar needs to understand that anything less than increasing the front axle components to a GAWR of 17000 for 40' and 20000 for 43' is totally unacceptable. It appears we are also approaching the point where Newmar needs to know that unless these demands are met making our coachs usable under reasonable conditions that a lawsuit may be forthcoming. We all know that the only people who win in law suits are the attorneys. The cost to Newmar will not only be financially costly(win or lose) but their company reputation will be destroyed. In other words for Newmar, a law suit of this nature is a going out of business strategy. Do they really want to risk that?

You might also want to remind them of their company slogan "When you know the difference." Mahlon Miller states because Newmar customers know the difference, that's why they choose Newmar. Now that the current owners know the difference, they are choosing to sue because we have learned that they don't stand behind the products they produce and future purchasers who know the difference are now taking their business elsewhere.

Allen & Angel
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Old 12-05-2015, 08:24 PM   #18
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Originally Posted by wam16 View Post
You might also want to remind them of their company slogan "When you know the difference." Mahlon Miller states because Newmar customers know the difference, that's why they choose Newmar. ...
Is Mahlon Miller out of the picture? In almost every issue that I read on this site, all I see noted that anyone is (unsuccessfully) trying to contact, is the kid, Matt.
In many areas these days, I am finding that the youngsters taking over, have totally different ideas of honor, than those of us who have so much time behind us, and so little in front. It is disquieting to read about the obfuscation, and outright... well, I'm not going to say "lying", but I am sure that after reading the company philosophy, we sure seem to be seeing a corporate disconnect.
As an apologist for Newmar (I love my bus in spite of its warts), I'm starting to gag, and have stopped bragging to my friends about Newmar products.

I wonder what will happen at Tiffin, when people who have concerns can no longer "just call Bob"?

Rob & Dee & Bailey, our Maltepoo
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Old 12-05-2015, 09:28 PM   #19
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"Just call Bob"

Many members, Tiffin owners, have voiced the same concerns. Bob had to come back once from retirement to save the ship. It is very obvious, IMO, it would behoove the Newmar brothers to call in the senior Miller to help calm the storm. He built the company into an industry leader and must be aware of this potential collapse of valued customer loyalty, coupled with nationwide market position? Can't believe if healthy Mahlon would not get involved. The ships taking on water and the bilge pumps are dangerously at risk.
Clay & Pebble.. Miss Butter our sweet Goldie (Jan. 2005-Jan. 2015) Sissy our Border Collie
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Old 12-05-2015, 09:57 PM   #20
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I had a conversation with a long time personal friend of Mahlon Miller, this July. He said that there was lots of pressure on Matt, he had pretty well bet the farm on the new slide mechanism. Since Mahlon had invented and patented the slide out, and used the simple cog wheel system, going away from that was a significant decision. And yes, they had several problems in two years of field trials, but seemed to be getting on top of them. Sounds like the axle weight was one of those things that got overlooked in the heat of the day.
Being a retired manufacturing guy, I can say this is not the first time, a sales/ marketing project got pressured thru engineering and operations in a heated rush, and then operations get to clean up the mess. And it's made worse with so many CEOs today, who are bean counters. The marketing guys gen up a bunch of real pretty numbers and the finance guys get giddy, and here you go. And don't you dare be a nay sayer, you aren't a team player. Get on board.
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Old 12-05-2015, 10:31 PM   #21
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I have not read all of the posts on this subject, so I apologize if I m repeating something.

It seems to me that there is a very real safety issue here. Has anybody filed complaint with DOT?

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Old 12-06-2015, 07:39 AM   #22
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This week, I went to visit the local RV dealers to look at my preferred choice of RV. Which include the Forest River Berkshire and Fleetwood Discovery. One of the dealers also has 3 of the Newmar DutchStar in their stock and come with their highly recommended. I am in the market for one of these in the next 6 to 9 months (estimate retirement date). After seeing the beautiful and very well appointed DS, my DW really loved the DS, that is why I began to read the pros and cons of the DS.

With the DS spec, I thought that I will have good capacity to carry a good load for long term RVing. On top of that, the slide issue is another one... Now I am beginning to question about Newmar product.

Note that I have researched the Newmar brands for some months and felt it would be a good choice, but hold back because it cost far from the competition. But now the DW like the RV, I thought that I may have to bite the bullet to foot the bill. Thank you for information, this would make me to re-think about the money to be spent.

Having that said, it is now off my list of RV choice. I will boycott Newmar until they have the resolution before I put my money down on one in the next 6 to 9 months...
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Old 12-06-2015, 07:56 AM   #23
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With the 'devil in the details' I find it interesting that after nearly 500 posts on the original posting where the message was that Newmar needed to add a proportioning valve and that the valves were no longer on the DS that the OP in this thread says "I asked if they had an official proposed fix and they said that they are working on changing the size of the proportioning valve for each model to transfer some weight".

This is starting to sound like a Wild West movie. Town marshall grabs the alleged bad guy, town folk form the vigilante group and march on the Marshall's office to string the miscreant up for his dastardly deed. Marshall on the front steps, town folk with the lighted torches gathered on the street with the vociferous leaders inciting the crowd. But not one of the 'leaders' is willing to be the first to be shot to follow through on the string 'em up plan. And the end of the movie? The 'bad guy' wasn't so bad because no one had the facts until after the trial, and in my version he gets the girl and lives happily ever after....

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Old 12-06-2015, 08:22 AM   #24
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WOW! What a mess. I've read through most of the other threads concerning this weight issue and my heart goes out to those that have these coaches. I'd be screaming at the top of my lungs at someone. It's ludicrous to think that one pays that much for what is supposed to be a quality coach only to find out that it can't be safely driven unless one tows a 15000 lb trailer.

I've been a huge supporter of Newmar and we love our humble '11 Ventana but if we were purchasing new (which we aren't), I think I'd have to pass on Newmar until this mess is fixed.

Hopefully, the wheels at Newmar are following these threads and see the responses. I rather think they are and will come up with a fix to satisfy the owners. To do it properly, it might cost them big but not to would cost even more. The safety of those traveling in these coaches and Newmar's reputation depends on their decision.
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Old 12-06-2015, 09:17 AM   #25
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Newmar has a serious issue here and needs to address it. I'll hold off buying one at this point and either wait to see if there is any meaningful change to the 2016 or 2017 coaches, or will be looking at SOB.
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Old 12-07-2015, 12:10 PM   #26
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Would it be possible to get a photo of the slide floor issue?
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Old 12-09-2015, 09:14 PM   #27
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While my DS is not effected by the front axle weight problem (thank God) it seems to me that the time has come to start compiling two lists 1) a list of DS owners effected and 2) a list of operators that were considering buying a new DS or any Newmar and have now decided not to. Ask for those two catagories to send you an email with their name, address, telephone number and (for the owners) their DS VIN number. Take that info to the next meeting or to a lawyer and start making serious waves.

Good luck and thanks for "carrying the ball".
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Old 12-10-2015, 08:24 PM   #28
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Did anybody weigh their Tour or Ellipse?

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ems, newmar, problems, slide, slide out, weight

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