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Old 03-12-2007, 02:16 PM   #1
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Does anyone know anything about the new FRED units that just came out?
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Old 03-12-2007, 02:16 PM   #2
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Does anyone know anything about the new FRED units that just came out?
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Old 03-12-2007, 05:00 PM   #3
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mrmrsbb, I believe the Newmar Grand Aire(FRED) has 300hp and 600ft./lbs.of torque, on a Freightliner Chassis. Ed.S
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Old 03-12-2007, 05:56 PM   #4
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very nice diesel chassis for the entry level diesel market, strong and reliable.
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Old 03-13-2007, 02:59 AM   #5
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The Grand Star should be a good seller. Tiffin has had the FRED chassis underneath the Allegro Bay since the FRED first was introduced and has been selling very well and is well accepted by it's buyers. In fact they've just added the FRED to the entry level Allegro line due to popular demand.

The FRED eliminates the noise issues of the earlier attempts at diesel pullers and is a well built chassis. It's never going to be the same as a diesel pusher but at it's price point, it nicely bridges the gap between a gasser and a pusher. The Cummins 300 ISB has more torque than a gasser and puts it down low in a useable RPM range. Many FRED owners are reporting 11 MPG fuel economy readings so it's an economical chassis to operate.

I predict that you're going to see a number of Grand Stars (and happy owners) hitting the road within the next year.
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Old 03-13-2007, 03:06 AM   #6
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After having the opportunity during a recent factory visit to check the Grand Star over from head to toe, I agree with Mark's prediciton.

Nice rig for the money....
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Old 03-13-2007, 06:48 PM   #7
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If Newmar's version of FRED is anything like Tiffin's They may well get some gas owner converters. However, there is zero comparison to a pusher,i.e. 5 speed tranny, no air suspension,no full basement with pass through compartments as the Freightliner chassis is not a raised rail unit, max. 5,000 # towing capacity.

One advantage that Tiffin has had over Newmar is the limited scope of their product line. Now with Newmar introducing yet another model series that differential will be even further widened. Was this not a mega problem for Fleetwood just a few short years ago? How much inventory can you really expect the dealers to carry? Ken,'04 DSDP....
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Old 03-14-2007, 08:51 AM   #8
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Ken, I agree that I think that Newmar has too many models. It does spread the product pretty thin and make it rough for dealers. If the Grand Star is Newmar's only FRED based coach though, I think you'll see it being one of their better selling units. It will definitely make a dent in Newmar's gas chassis sales.

As to comparing to a diesel pusher - you're right, there is no comparison. However, that's a different market. The FRED isn't priced anywhere near that. You can pick up a new 34' triple slide Allegro on a FRED for around $90K which keeps it far away from any diesel pusher pricing. I think you'll see FRED's market being gasoline chassis owners who want a bit more torque, better fuel economy, and greater cargo carrying capacity while staying in the lower price spectrum normally reserved for gassers. It's an excellent fit in that market segment.
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Old 03-27-2007, 07:17 AM   #9
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I'm in full agreement with Mark. The FRED isn't a pusher and doesn't compete in that market. It does, however, compete in the gas puller market at about a $9K upgrade price for a Tiffin Allegro Bay. I currently have a 5 year old W20 chassis that I have put 57,000 miles on. After several test drives with the FRED on a 37' quad-slide Allegro Bay and comparing that to my W20 and a 36' HR Neptune pusher, we were completely convinced that a FRED was the right choice for us at this time. Next week we are going down to Red Bay to watch our Allegro Bay 37QDB FRED start down the assembly line.
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Old 03-27-2007, 07:50 AM   #10
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I'd like to see some performance numbers comparing the Fred to the Workhorse UFO. The Fred has the 20+ ft drive shaft, only a five speed transmission. The UFO has a 2 ft drive shaft and the six speed allison. I honestly don't know which will out perform the other, but I think dyno info would be interesting. The UFO design is also conducive with pass through storage because there's no driveshaft or exhaust system to contend with. With the UFO reportedly getting 9 mpg and and the Fred getting 11 mpg I think if you consider the higher cost of diesel in most places this is a wash. After adding up the maintenance cost of diesel vs gas, I think the only real practical difference between the two units is going to be actual performance numbers at the rear wheels, not just engine ratings. I also heard the Newmar Grand Star with the Fred is coming in around $180,000. That's pretty pricey and not a lot of advantages. Time will tell.

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Old 03-27-2007, 11:26 AM   #11
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I like your post Jack from what I have read most RVers that have taken the trial ride on UFO were looking for more MFG's building a coach in their make. With 9 mpg and a reprogram of ECM bet it would push 11 mpg easily.
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Old 03-27-2007, 11:55 AM   #12
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Jack,
I would like to any reports on the UFO, I am assuming they are being sold now but have heard nothing from any owners.
Seeing a lot of posts from people test driving but evedently they haven`t bought or coaches are on order.
Beglad when people get some miles on them and see how they perform loaded.
007, I think you are being really optimistic about 11 MPG. I know people with GM pickups with the 8.1 who aren`t getting much over 12 MPG.
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Old 03-27-2007, 12:06 PM   #13
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Unfortunately, you're right in that we're going to have to wait for awhile to get feedback from owners. I also doubt that we'll be able to get a true performance comparison. Seat of the pants comparisons can't be done accurately because of different manufacturers, weight of coach, loading, wheelbase etc. The only true way we'd ever get a true performance picture of both would be to put them on a dyno. Even then, wheelbase on the FRED could cause a variable.

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Old 03-27-2007, 03:56 PM   #14
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Was getting 6.1-6.9 upgrade Ultra power 8.7 -9.1 with the shorter drive shaft who knows what good news may bring.
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