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Old 10-27-2015, 09:54 PM   #1
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Newmar Quality Control Complaint

I picked up my DSDP from the dealer today for some warranty issues. When I got back to storage I decided to start gathering bulb part numbers for a LED conversion. I noticed that the passenger tail light bulbs where not fully inserted into the socket. I spent a considerable amount of time trying to insert the bulbs into the sockets. it turns out that the tail light housing is defective.

Here is my complaint. Someone on the Newmar line let this go! Instead of replacing the housing they simply pushed the bulb in the hole. The housing is defective. The socket will not and has never been inserted.

Is this a big deal? No I will go back to the dealer and get it addressed. Could this have been avoided. YES. Another trip, another loss of use, I'll live.
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Old 10-28-2015, 12:27 AM   #2
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Newmar should listen

Hopefully Newmar is in a listening mode. I visited the factory last month and was told that 9 new coaches are finished each day now. That would be adding many new people to the line or pushing the employees past there limits. The bulb should have been found and replaced by the first tech or taken care of during the final check. Surprise it wasnít, but this kind of quality is a no no that shouldnít be seen. I hear about how happy Newmar customers are with the final build.

We have the power with this media to make noise and correct the quality. If they donít listen then they will not need to continue to produce at this place for long. Maybe its a single error and just wasnít noticed during install. I sure hope so.
Thanks for taking the time to write and I wish you can have many carefree miles after this repair.
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Old 10-28-2015, 12:42 AM   #3
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For an "education" on quality control go over to the Thor, Tiffin or other brand boards!
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Old 10-28-2015, 05:44 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mpm2433 View Post
I picked up my DSDP from the dealer today for some warranty issues. When I got back to storage I decided to start gathering bulb part numbers for a LED conversion. I noticed that the passenger tail light bulbs where not fully inserted into the socket. I spent a considerable amount of time trying to insert the bulbs into the sockets. it turns out that the tail light housing is defective.

Here is my complaint. Someone on the Newmar line let this go! Instead of replacing the housing they simply pushed the bulb in the hole. The housing is defective. The socket will not and has never been inserted.

Is this a big deal? No I will go back to the dealer and get it addressed. Could this have been avoided. YES. Another trip, another loss of use, I'll live.
I agree. Most the poblems that I had with my Canyon Star are from faulty installation. There's no way a worker can install things wrong and not know about it. It's all about numbers. Unfortunatly it's not just Newmar. A friend saw all the problems I was having with mine so he bought a Tiffin instead. His has been in the shop several times and is there again. He's p***ed off.
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Old 10-28-2015, 06:42 AM   #5
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I agree. Most the poblems that I had with my Canyon Star are from faulty installation. There's no way a worker can install things wrong and not know about it. It's all about numbers. Unfortunatly it's not just Newmar. A friend saw all the problems I was having with mine so he bought a Tiffin instead. His has been in the shop several times and is there again. He's p***ed off.

Buying a Tiffin over a Newmar because of build quality concerns just means your friend didn't do his "due diligence". These coach builders are all extremely small in terms of vehicle manufacturing. They have little or no direct influence over their component suppliers/manufacturers or their dealers. They get unfairly compared to car manufacturers who have lots of control over their suppliers and their dealers.

This entire industry just went through a "depression" that many didn't survive. They are understandably spending and hiring adverse. The component manufacturers went through a similar contraction. In the case sited here, to prove Newmar's lack of quality, the complete tail light assembly, complete with bulbs came into Newmar and was installed as a unit. Of course it should be addressed by Newmar with the supplier but to eliminate any occurrence would result in a coach no one would buy.

I've been surprised by the number of threads lately very negative to Newmar, over issues that were ultimately resolved to the customers satisfaction. As an SOB owner/driver I'm having trouble understanding.


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Old 10-28-2015, 06:50 AM   #6
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Agreed. I wanted to be very carful in the tome of my concern. I am not bashing Newmar and thankfully no one says I am. Thats a tribute to this forum. My goal is to talk to Newmar.

I have owned new Fleetwood products. A 1998 Discovery and as well as a 2014 Keystone Fusion 5w. I agree that Newmar is head and shoulders above both in quality.

I really don't want this thread to run on. Thanks for letting me vent. I'll head back to the dealer, get it fixed and enjoy my DS which I truly love.
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Old 10-28-2015, 07:03 AM   #7
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Originally Posted by mpm2433 View Post
Here is my complaint. Someone on the Newmar line let this go! Instead of replacing the housing they simply pushed the bulb in the hole. The housing is defective. The socket will not and has never been inserted.
Just an FYI - That component was likely a "supplier" part.. and there is a 99.9% chance the component came "loaded" with bulbs... I would suspect Newmar simply installed it, not knowing there was a defect of any kind...

I think you would have a "complaint" if Newmar didn't address it in a timely fashion (did they?).. but to come out here and say this is a Newmar Quality control issues is completely unfair to Newmar...

As usual Steve, you are spot on with your comment of;

"Of course it should be addressed by Newmar with the supplier but to eliminate any occurrence would result in a coach no one would buy (or afford)."

I would venture to guess the people buying Foretravel, Newell and/or Prevost have some of the same issues as Rodz..

Rodz... I have no doubt you had a very poor experience with Newmar.. I'm sure you are very frustrated.. but I've noticed anytime there is a concern, question or complaint about Newmar, you are taking full advantage in bashing them.. It appears you've moved on to another coach.. you should do the same on the Newmar forum.. it's as if you are intentionally trying to hurt their reputation.. which may be true.. but it isn't coming off well.. I'm sure Newmar never intended to single you out and give you a bum coach.. but it's as if you believe they have.. I'm sorry you had such a poor experience..
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Old 10-28-2015, 07:36 AM   #8
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Just an FYI - That component was likely a "supplier" part.. and there is a 99.9% chance the component came "loaded" with bulbs... I would suspect Newmar simply installed it, not knowing there was a defect of any kind...

I think you would have a "complaint" if Newmar didn't address it in a timely fashion (did they?).. but to come out here and say this is a Newmar Quality control issues is completely unfair to Newmar...

As usual Steve, you are spot on with your comment of;

"Of course it should be addressed by Newmar with the supplier but to eliminate any occurrence would result in a coach no one would buy (or afford)."

I would venture to guess the people buying Foretravel, Newell and/or Prevost have some of the same issues as Rodz..

Rodz... I have no doubt you had a very poor experience with Newmar.. I'm sure you are very frustrated.. but I've noticed anytime there is a concern, question or complaint about Newmar, you are taking full advantage in bashing them.. It appears you've moved on to another coach.. you should do the same on the Newmar forum.. it's as if you are intentionally trying to hurt their reputation.. which may be true.. but it isn't coming off well.. I'm sure Newmar never intended to single you out and give you a bum coach.. but it's as if you believe they have.. I'm sorry you had such a poor experience..
Not bashing Newmar. I've never said they were a bad company. I believe they've had quality issues that can be traced back to poor installation. I've owned several makes over the last 40 yrs. Newmar certainly isn't at the top and I know other makes are having issues also. I try to hold back until someone puts a twist on the problems like it's ok as long as they are being taken care of. It is quite a nasty experience to pay that kind of money and take it back to the factory, sometimes several hundred miles away. Mine was there for a month just getting some of the wiring issues repaired. Other electrical problems never did get fixed. FYI, I bought another Newmar and so far it's been pretty good. Just minor normal things. They're not all bad, but mine was a nightmare. And on the tail light. When I had to replace the one that was destroyed when it fell out, the bulb assemblies came in another box and had to be assembled. Any poor installation is a chain of events that can be traced all the way to the top. Someone had to say close enough.
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Old 10-28-2015, 07:54 AM   #9
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FWIW nobody above the line worker had to say "close enough" if there was no way to inspect it after installation. As an example with a tail light assembly if the lights light they are good unless the inspector actually takes the assembly apart thus introducing more chance of error.
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Old 10-28-2015, 08:23 AM   #10
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FWIW nobody above the line worker had to say "close enough" if there was no way to inspect it after installation. As an example with a tail light assembly if the lights light they are good unless the inspector actually takes the assembly apart thus introducing more chance of error.
Where's the management? Someone is responsible for training the line worker.
The wiring harness is in place, then comes the lamp. An untrained, unsupervised worker said good enough .
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Old 10-28-2015, 03:03 PM   #11
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MPM for clarity were the lights working and you found that while working they weren't fully seated? If so the assumption would be that the supplier tested the lights before shipping and they worked. Newmar checked them and they worked when installed.

And yet the OEM has a quality issue. Those are the types of items that should be sent in an email directly to customer service and the QA manager at Newmar. And even directly to the OEM.
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Old 10-28-2015, 03:10 PM   #12
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Old 10-29-2015, 07:36 AM   #13
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I too assume you had to remove the lens to find the loose bulb? I too assume the tail lamp assemblies were purchased and installed as just that, an assembly. I'm sure someone at Newmar tested all the lights before the coach was allowed to leave the factory and they probably lit.

Newmar needs to know, and in turn needs to have a conversation with their vendor, but I wouldn't hang this one on them.

We had a phone book worth of warranty issues with our coach immediately after delivery and there was plenty of blame to go around, but I did make a distinction between what American Coach, in our case, screwed up and what they would have had no way of knowing was screwed up. Case in point, a bad air leveling valve. Whoever bolted that on the chassis had no way of knowing that it was bad internally, that was entirely on the part supplier, and it did work, intermittently. On the other hand, poorly installed or broken door and cabinet latches, that was on AC.

Every manufacturer has struggled with quality control issues, Newmar is not the exception, but as we do our research for a possible replacement for our current coach I'm looking for the preponderance of evidence - does it lean toward quality, and how does the manufacturer / dealer handle the inevitable problem?
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Old 10-29-2015, 07:40 AM   #14
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Where's the management? Someone is responsible for training the line worker.
The wiring harness is in place, then comes the lamp. An untrained, unsupervised worker said good enough .
Few industries are still trying to have enough management to watch every move every worker does. Among other things it turns into a contest of how to screw up a product without the manager catching it.

In a well run company with workers who are reasonably capable they should be trained and then get feed back when that unit had a problem and it is traced back to their shift. Easy enough in today's data rich environment. At 9 or 10 units a day each worker is doing a list of tasks and needs to have ownership of what is done and time to do it. That is how you get quality. Any company that is expanding it's work force has a problem developing that sense in the employee as well as weeding out the one's who can not or will not deal with those conditions. Even then folks are not robots so they occasionally have a bad day. Life happens.

That is not only a Newmar issue. It is the facts of working in a production environment. Every manufacturer out there has the same problems. Some just handle them better than others.
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