OASIS shorting out on AC II

[Scarab0088]

THREAD WARNING

This thread is wobbling off topic.
Off-topic posts are removed by staff.

Please discuss the topic, NOT each other

Thanks to all who have posted within the Community Rules.

Steve as iRV2 Staff

[TJ]

I have now checked the Oasis electrical connections in our 2018 MADP and found the new-style connector blocks. All connections were tight, no chafing of the wires was found. That's a relief.

We all owe NealC a big thank you for exposing this potential problem and detailing his first-hand experience in dealing with it. This is very important important information of great value to Newmar owners and should be preserved for the benefit of future Oasis users. Sticky, perhaps?

Hopefully, the nuggets of information in this thread will not get buried in a thread drift.

TJ

["007"]

Thanks Neal for bringing up this problem, do not usually view these type posts but found it in back room, so took a look.

Seemed to have wondered of subject and into fires, no problem with that give your suggestion than get back on subject of the wiring and cause.

I would ask you members with OASIS, notifying 0ASIS may help, of this problem and let them work out problem with Newmar, if its a Newmar problem.

I will post this thread in the NEWMAR OWNERS Sticky under possible recalls section to warn other members.

After looking through the whole thread I would say Newmar needs a better wiring harness coming off the top of that burner, movement of coach and vibration has caused this problem, wires are floating in the breeze one of Neals post agree's.

One other thing the Newmar forum is for the exchange and help with problems, done in a professional manner, the back and forth remarks I do not go for, thank you.

[Peter M]

Originally Posted by NealC

It sounds like we already have a failure of the new connector. While they look nice and may be better they seem harder to fit into the small compartment. I’m not an electrician but it seems to me all should consider adding electrical tape to the connections to help further secure and protect. An external storage box may be a viable solution but I’d like to hear a recommendation from both ITR and Newmar. This is ultimately an ITR issue as it is their design and it seems their junction port is too small for two romex connections.

Wire connection SOLUTION:

Posi lock has a product posi-connectors. I have used the product in numerous motorcycles. Tested and proven failure free in extreme riding conditions They simply are indestructible, seal with shrink wrap or Lineman's tape. Lineman tape found at HD is elastic tape and does not leak electricity.
The junction box is a great idea,perhaps spray paint in red or green for the factory look.

https://www.posi-products.com/posilock.html

[Buly]

Originally Posted by Peter M

Wire connection SOLUTION:



Posi lock has a product posi-connectors. I have used the product in numerous motorcycles. Tested and proven failure free in extreme riding conditions They simply are indestructible, seal with shrink wrap or Lineman's tape. Lineman tape found at HD is elastic tape and does not leak electricity.

The junction box is a great idea,perhaps spray paint in red or green for the factory look.



https://www.posi-products.com/posilock.html

Hi Peter,
I can not find Lineman tape listed anywhere? Do you have more specific info?
Good advise on Posi connectors. Never knew about them. Thanks.

[redbaron73]

Lineman tape is what my dad called electrical tape

[stang37]

Scotch 33 is a brand name for electrical tape

[TJ]

I think the "lineman's tape" referred to is Scotch 70 Self-Fusing Silicone Rubber Electrical Tape...

https://www.3m.com/3M/en_US/company-...2437112&rt=rud

...widely used by electrical workers to seal outdoor connections. It is similar to Rescue Tape in concept.

TJ

[Stealth01]

Originally Posted by NealC

It’s really not hard to inspect and EVERYONE should inspect and secure theirs ASAP. This is a fire hazard.

The cause I believe was scraped wires when Newmar stuffed into the hole. Don’t just check for tight wire nuts. Use a flashlight and inspect the wires for missing insulation.

Well, I’ve watched this post and I think its time for a little clarity and correction of “terms”, ESPECIALLY if posters are going to be talking to Newmar or ITR. Neil suggested his issue was from “scrapped wires” during installation... well, lets talk about that.
SHORTS: Generally speaking, a short occurs when a power wire is exposed to ground. The general affect is a large spark and the power Circuit Breaker popping (opening, terminating the application of power). The “usual” cause of a “short” is chaffed or scrapped wires touching a grounded surface. The usual affect is a popped CB and localized (depending upon amperage) wire damage and or arc/flash damage. Based on Neil’s photos, this is NOT WHAT OCCURED ON NEAL’S COACH!
DEFECTIVE CONNECTION: A Defective Connection occurs in a number of ways. A connection can be defective OR become defective during use if the connection becomes loose. This can occur with “spade” connectors over time and vibration. Wire twist connectors that are A.) In sufficiently tightened during installation and then exposed to vibration OR, B.) become loose during use when exposed to vibration. A wire/screw connection where a wire is either inserted or wrapped around a screw and subsequently become loose due to thermal/vibration. The AFFECT of a defective connection, assuming the connection does not simply “Open” where the circuit function ceases (in this case the best outcome) the Defective Connection begins to heat due to increased resistance within the connection. As the connection heats it creates more resistance and the increased resistance creates more heat, thus we have a Thermal Runaway! (THIS IS WHAT MOST PROBABLY OCCURED ON NEIL’S COACH!). The heat within the connection will become intense enough to melt the connectors, wire, wire insulation and any insulating tape! The end affect can vary, the defective connection burns itself open; the power wire is liberated and touches ground popping the CB (which seldom occurs); or the defective connection causes a fire within surrounding combustibles!
The attached photo was taken form our house Ground Loop Heating/Cooling System. The relays shown control the high amperage “Strip Heaters” within the system. The photo is a perfect example of spade connector thermal runaway and the results, in this case the wires burned themselves “open” terminating the operation of the circuit. Now imagine this connection wrapped in insulating tape or a plastic connector and you would have the same results Neil is looking at on his coach!
If you’re going to “inspect” your coach you want to look for scrapped or damaged insulation on the wiring. Signs/indications of excessive heat of the connection and associated wiring and/or loose connections. IF you note heat damage, it is important to note that you CANNOT just tighten the connection!! The over heated wiring must be cut back to a point where you find “bright shiny” wire... The dull, heat damaged wiring has been comprimised and must be removed! (The wiring, once damaged by heat will create a “high resistance” connection and create another thermal runaway!). Sorry this is so lengthy but, these failure mechanisms can be tricky!! ANd BTW, one of the best Electrical Tapes you can use is Scotch 2228 Rubber Mastic Tape.

[Stuart W]

Originally Posted by Stealth01

Well, I’ve watched this post and I think its time for a little clarity and correction of “terms”, ESPECIALLY if posters are going to be talking to Newmar or ITR. Neil suggested his issue was from “scrapped wires” during installation... well, lets talk about that.
SHORTS: Generally speaking, a short occurs when a power wire is exposed to ground. The general affect is a large spark and the power Circuit Breaker popping (opening, terminating the application of power). The “usual” cause of a “short” is chaffed or scrapped wires touching a grounded surface. The usual affect is a popped CB and localized (depending upon amperage) wire damage and or arc/flash damage. Based on Neil’s photos, this is NOT WHAT OCCURED ON NEAL’S COACH!
DEFECTIVE CONNECTION: A Defective Connection occurs in a number of ways. A connection can be defective OR become defective during use if the connection becomes loose. This can occur with “spade” connectors over time and vibration. Wire twist connectors that are A.) In sufficiently tightened during installation and then exposed to vibration OR, B.) become loose during use when exposed to vibration. A wire/screw connection where a wire is either inserted or wrapped around a screw and subsequently become loose due to thermal/vibration. The AFFECT of a defective connection, assuming the connection does not simply “Open” where the circuit function ceases (in this case the best outcome) the Defective Connection begins to heat due to increased resistance within the connection. As the connection heats it creates more resistance and the increased resistance creates more heat, thus we have a Thermal Runaway! (THIS IS WHAT MOST PROBABLY OCCURED ON NEIL’S COACH!). The heat within the connection will become intense enough to melt the connectors, wire, wire insulation and any insulating tape! The end affect can vary, the defective connection burns itself open; the power wire is liberated and touches ground popping the CB (which seldom occurs); or the defective connection causes a fire within surrounding combustibles!
The attached photo was taken form our house Ground Loop Heating/Cooling System. The relays shown control the high amperage “Strip Heaters” within the system. The photo is a perfect example of spade connector thermal runaway and the results, in this case the wires burned themselves “open” terminating the operation of the circuit. Now imagine this connection wrapped in insulating tape or a plastic connector and you would have the same results Neil is looking at on his coach!
If you’re going to “inspect” your coach you want to look for scrapped or damaged insulation on the wiring. Signs/indications of excessive heat of the connection and associated wiring and/or loose connections. IF you note heat damage, it is important to note that you CANNOT just tighten the connection!! The over heated wiring must be cut back to a point where you find “bright shiny” wire... The dull, heat damaged wiring has been comprimised and must be removed! (The wiring, once damaged by heat will create a “high resistance” connection and create another thermal runaway!). Sorry this is so lengthy but, these failure mechanisms can be tricky!! ANd BTW, one of the best Electrical Tapes you can use is Scotch 2228 Rubber Mastic Tape.

Thank you, great explanations !

[tom chelbana]

Would suggest adding inverter, automatic transfer switch box and power cable reel to the list of items to check now and once a year like Oasis system wiring. We have found loss connection in automatic transfer switch.
Newmar man

[Peter M]

Originally Posted by Buly

Hi Peter,
I can not find Lineman tape listed anywhere? Do you have more specific info?
Good advise on Posi connectors. Never knew about them. Thanks.

Your welcome..
Buly it is a 3 M product Temflex 2155 Rubber Splicing tape. Available at the big box store electrical department. Google search 3 M Temflex 2155. Available in blue or black.

https://www.morrisproducts.com/pc_pr...8FEA9293830715

[rtspence]

After reading this thread I checked my wiring while doing the annual Oasis service. Sure enough one of the hot leads was melted.
I agree with Stealth01 about the poor connection after inspecting all of the other connections I noticed the stranded wire from the Oasis was only stripped back maybe 1/4”. No way that will make a solid connection with a wire nut.
Thanks NealC for posting I would never thought to check otherwise

[CaptainGizmo]

Neal, et al...

Upon your suggestion, I did call ITR..and he acted surprised. (Surprise! [emoji2357]) After a little coaching, along with agreeing that you can’t read forums without getting worried [emoji849], he bagged in Newmar saying they used some “weak-handed employee, and have since then changed their crimping methods.

This was before my ‘19 DS delivery. So, I asked Mike (at TLRV) to please check mine. Mike knows there wasn’t a problem and he was right; the connections are all end-cap crimps and solid.

Thanks for the warnings!