Quality

[rodz]

I finally heard back from Newmar about the list of issues I had sent them. The only thing he would discuss is the furnace. With batteries fully charged and everything turned off, it will run for 3 hrs. and the batteries are completely dead. He tells me that's the way it was engineered. He said he's had several complaints from others with the same concern. He was told by the engineers that it is not an engineering flaw and that it was never designed to run without an external power source. I've owned several motorhomes both gas a diesel over the last 40 yrs. and have never had one that wouldn't run the furnace all night. I asked if they would do anything to help with the situation. Flat out no. It's working as designed and the dealer should have told me when I bought it that it needs to be plugged in to run the furnace. I bought it because I kept hearing about their quality. My first and last Newmar.

[zmotorsports]

I would look to see about making room to fit another couple of batteries and try to get your AH capacity up. That would be a permanent fix and most people who boondock have a four battery series/parallel setup for this very reason.

I am assuming you have a two battery setup and probably 12 volters at that, but I am only assuming here without being familiar with your exact coach/setup.

Mike.

[FlyingDiver]

This is not a quality issue. It's an expectation issue. You expected one thing, and either didn't express that expectation to the dealer, or the dealer gave you bad information. Easily solved if you have room to add another battery or two. If the dealer misled you about the battery run time, I'd take it up with the dealer to add the batteries.

["007"]

My furnace ran all night while camping in Cracker Barrels every night for four stops in Jan, snowy weather, on the way to FL.
I removed the two wet cell 6v's and installed two 12v AGM's, did the same thing coming back home from FL.
Furnace kept us plenty warm and was able to use TV for short period plus lighting with out the need to run Gen.
All batteries were recharged by alternator for next nights stop.

[wildtoad]

Agree not a quality issue, but perhaps a valid concern. As previously posted, look into increasing your battery capacity.

[VP Chianese]

Originally Posted by FlyingDiver

This is not a quality issue. It's an expectation issue. You expected one thing, and either didn't express that expectation to the dealer, or the dealer gave you bad information. Easily solved if you have room to add another battery or two. If the dealer misled you about the battery run time, I'd take it up with the dealer to add the batteries.

I agree. Easily fixed as you said. It's got a gen set, run it.

[Mike and Cha]

Originally Posted by VP Chianese

I agree. Easily fixed as you said. It's got a gen set, run it.

I agree, I would suppose that you could add the auto generator start system, to correct the issue. But we have run ours overnight without hookups a few times and have not had any problems. We usually don't set the temp very high as I don't like to run the furnace anyway, and just sleep with extra blankets. I think Newmar uses a furnace system and battery set up that a lot of manufacturers use, so it's kind of a stretch to say it's a quality issue, and say that Newmar is poor quality as a whole.

[FlyingDiver]

Hmm. One thing I would look into is the condition of the batteries. It's possible you got a bad one that's causing the really short run time. That would be a warranty issue if true.

[DavidP]

Something is wrong.

I just tried the furnace on my 2014 CS. When the fan is running it draws almost exactly 10 amps, as measured by my battery monitor.

In my CS I have 4 - 6 volt AGM batteries. Each has a capacity of 207 amp hours (20 hour discharge curve). So, in round numbers, I have 400 amp hours @ 12 volts. I don't want to discharge more than 50%, so I have 200 amp hours usable.

I don't know what your battery configuration is. Let's assume you have 2 x 12V batteries, which I think is standard for a CS. So, as a guess, I'll assume you have 100 amp hours available before you reach a 50% discharge.

That means the furnace can run about 10 hours, even at 100% duty cycle (that is, continuously running). I've never camped at the north pole, so I've never seen more than a 25% duty cycle on the coldest night.

So....it would seem that, either:

a) you got a bad battery
b) the batteries weren't totally charged at the outset
c) the batteries weren't totally discharged after 3 hours
d) you have some other load on the 12V system

A battery monitor that uses a shunt to accurately measure current into and out of the battery would help with (b), (c), and (d). It you're keen on boondocking, I highly recommend having one. I can't imagine trying to guesstimate battery charge state by voltage alone.

So, I wouldn't accept "that's just how it is". Something's wrong, you'll need to figure out what. Good luck, and let us know what you find!

[Romeo]

Originally Posted by rodz

...I bought it because I kept hearing about their quality. My first and last Newmar.

Oh well, maybe Newmar products are not for everyone. That's why SeeYa and Winnebago are out there...

[newmarpusher]

Originally Posted by rodz

I finally heard back from Newmar about the list of issues I had sent them. The only thing he would discuss is the furnace. With batteries fully charged and everything turned off, it will run for 3 hrs. and the batteries are completely dead. He tells me that's the way it was engineered. He said he's had several complaints from others with the same concern. He was told by the engineers that it is not an engineering flaw and that it was never designed to run without an external power source. I've owned several motorhomes both gas a diesel over the last 40 yrs. and have never had one that wouldn't run the furnace all night. I asked if they would do anything to help with the situation. Flat out no. It's working as designed and the dealer should have told me when I bought it that it needs to be plugged in to run the furnace. I bought it because I kept hearing about their quality. My first and last Newmar.

It's all about battery capacity and use patterns. Our first class C only had a single 12 volt house battery. It could not run all night with the furnace running. That is when I started doing research on boondocking, batteries etc. I replaced the single wet cell house battery in that MH with two AGM's, added an inverter and upgraded the charger to a smart charger. We enjoyed three years of blissful boondocking with that MH before trading it in for the next unit.

The average low - mid range MH has a basic battery system that suits average use patterns. If you expect to boondock, you will need to upgrade your battery capacity appropriately.

[zmotorsports]

Originally Posted by newmarpusher

It's all about battery capacity and use patterns. Our first class C only had a single 12 volt house battery. It could not run all night with the furnace running. That is when I started doing research on boondocking, batteries etc. I replaced the single wet cell house battery in that MH with two AGM's, added an inverter and upgraded the charger to a smart charger. We enjoyed three years of blissful boondocking with that MH before trading it in for the next unit.

The average low - mid range MH has a basic battery system that suits average use patterns. If you expect to boondock, you will need to upgrade your battery capacity appropriately.

This is exactly what we experienced, it is about capacity, usage and let me add in there maintenance. Keeping up on the system to take advantage of all that is available is also key.

Our first motorhome only had two 12 volt house batteries with a standard converter/charger. The charger only put out approx 6 or 7 amps when plugged into shore power or the genset running to charge the batteries. I installed a standalone battery charger that I could plug in when the generator was running to bring the batteries up properly.

We used our motorhome for snowmobiling in the winter months (boondocking). We also had a routine of running the generator, with the charger going, not just the converter, topping off the batteries while we had a video going or friends over for coffee late in the evenings as we were usually in a small group. The temps were routinely in the teens to twenties at night and the furnace ran A LOT. In the morning, I would simply get up and start the genset, put on the coffee, bump the temperature up and get the family up all while the generator was going to top off the batteries and supply power for the coach.

The coach furnace would be fine during the day while we were out riding and in the evening repeat the same routine. I contemplated adding more batteries but in that particular coach there really was not any additional room that was convenient. Our next coach had a four battery setup and it made a big difference having four 6-volt batteries wired in a series/parallel setup.

Don't get too frustrated, it is a learning curve and nothing really can be blamed on Newmar. Testing, using and maintaining batteries properly is simply a part of RVing.

Mike.

[rodz]

The Canyon Star is their top of the line Gasser. When I bought it I did question the salesman about the small inverter and the batteries. I even asked at that time about upgrading them. His response was I wouldn't need to do that and it will work good as is and although it could be done, it wouldn't be easy. So I guess the blame should be on me because I've had enough motorhomes to know better. Just frustrated with what I keep finding wrong. Then of coarse the more I find the more I look. I'll get over it and reengineer the foolish design flaws and install a better inverter and battery pack. I expected more from a coach in that price range. I use mine for traveling but not driving around looking for place to plug it in and to have to run the generator all night seems ridiculous. In California you most likely can go all night. That won't happen in Michigan. 3 hrs. and it's done.

[rodz]

I just got an email from the dealer where I bought it. He agreed with me and offered to upgrade the inverter and add more batteries at a good discount. Hats off to Kyle at Midway RV in Grand Rapids.