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Old 05-27-2008, 01:05 PM   #1
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Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: South Carolina
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I have been carrying on a hot discussion with Cummins, Cummins Bridgeway and Spartan concerning coolant in my 2005 engine (2006 DSDP)for some time. I'm not sure anyone else will be as concerned as I was regarding the use of ELC coolant prior to switch to Final Charge but JIC I will expound on the subject here.

Upon taking delivery of my motor home on April 6th 2006, I asked Spartan to provide me with information concerning all fluids. The information was sent to me on April 12th and included a statement that the coolant was a 50/50 mix of water and Texaco ELC. I accepted that until some months later I was looking at rear of my coach and noted a label on coolant tank saying it was Shell Rotella ELC. I called Spartan and they advised that yes it was Shell Rotella ELC. I let the information slide until recently when I was perusing some Cummins documents regarding coolant and one triggered an old memory circa 2000 of problems with N14 engines failing when using Texaco/Shell ELC. The fix was to add a critical measure of silicate at initial fill. I asked Spartan to verify the information regarding actual coolant used at time of my build and if Texaco/Shell ELC (TELC) then to verify that silicate was added per Cummins directions. This set off a series of responses where Cummins Bridgeway and Spartan responded that units were filled with Final Charge. I knew that this wasn't true from the April 12th 2006 e-mail from Spartan. Further, one of the Spartan reps had sent me a pdf of my units Build Card with an Engineering Drawing included which showed that the coolant part number on Build Card was in fact TELC. We went back and forth without resolution and I finally went to Shell and asked the question. Here is their response.

______________________________________________


Leo,

Regarding your inquiry on compliance of Shell ROTELLA ELC against Cummins Engineering Standard (CES) 14603, Shell ROTELLA ELC is the exact same formulation as the Texaco Extended Life Coolant referenced in the attached March 2001 Global Customer Bulletin issued by Cummins, Equilon, and Texaco. As described in the Bulletin and summarized below, Shell ROTELLA ELC is approved and may be used in Cummins engines.

1) ROTELLA ELC Extended Life Coolant is approved for factory-fill in ISB, ISC and ISL engines.
2) ROTELLA ELC Extended Life Coolant with a one-time silicate addition is approved for factory-fill in N14, Signature, ISM and ISX engines.
3) ROTELLA ELC Extended Life Coolant is approved in aftermarket (service fill) applications in all Cummins engines without the addition of silicates.

Therefore, ROTELLA ELC may be used in Cummins engines in accordance with the March 2001 Global Customer Bulletin. Regarding CES 14603, CES 14603 represents Cummins latest specifications for engine coolants and has no direct relation to the above recommendations. Cummins states that CES 14603 describes coolants as sold for use in all Cummins engines in both factory-fill and aftermarket service. Since ROTELLA ELC requires a one-time application of silicate for factory-fill in three currently produced engines, ROTELLA ELC, and other identical extended life coolant technologies, are not formally approved by Cummins against CES 14603. Shell continues to recommend ROTELLA ELC Extended Life Coolant as sold in aftermarket applications in all Cummins engines.

Further information for Shell ROTELLA ELC may be found at http://www.shellusserver.com/product...RotellaELC.pdf.

Thank you for your interest in Shell Rotella Products!

Regards,
Edward Calcote
Staff Chemist, Shell Lubricants US Technical Information Center
__________________________________________________ __________________________________________________ __________________________________________________ _______________

Bottom line I was relieved to see that the ISL was/is approved without the addition of silicate and can be used to top off as well. I do not know whether Newmar made any models with the ISM engine prior to Spartan change to Final Charge.

I hope this may help some one else.
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Old 05-27-2008, 01:05 PM   #2
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Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: South Carolina
Posts: 770
I have been carrying on a hot discussion with Cummins, Cummins Bridgeway and Spartan concerning coolant in my 2005 engine (2006 DSDP)for some time. I'm not sure anyone else will be as concerned as I was regarding the use of ELC coolant prior to switch to Final Charge but JIC I will expound on the subject here.

Upon taking delivery of my motor home on April 6th 2006, I asked Spartan to provide me with information concerning all fluids. The information was sent to me on April 12th and included a statement that the coolant was a 50/50 mix of water and Texaco ELC. I accepted that until some months later I was looking at rear of my coach and noted a label on coolant tank saying it was Shell Rotella ELC. I called Spartan and they advised that yes it was Shell Rotella ELC. I let the information slide until recently when I was perusing some Cummins documents regarding coolant and one triggered an old memory circa 2000 of problems with N14 engines failing when using Texaco/Shell ELC. The fix was to add a critical measure of silicate at initial fill. I asked Spartan to verify the information regarding actual coolant used at time of my build and if Texaco/Shell ELC (TELC) then to verify that silicate was added per Cummins directions. This set off a series of responses where Cummins Bridgeway and Spartan responded that units were filled with Final Charge. I knew that this wasn't true from the April 12th 2006 e-mail from Spartan. Further, one of the Spartan reps had sent me a pdf of my units Build Card with an Engineering Drawing included which showed that the coolant part number on Build Card was in fact TELC. We went back and forth without resolution and I finally went to Shell and asked the question. Here is their response.

______________________________________________


Leo,

Regarding your inquiry on compliance of Shell ROTELLA ELC against Cummins Engineering Standard (CES) 14603, Shell ROTELLA ELC is the exact same formulation as the Texaco Extended Life Coolant referenced in the attached March 2001 Global Customer Bulletin issued by Cummins, Equilon, and Texaco. As described in the Bulletin and summarized below, Shell ROTELLA ELC is approved and may be used in Cummins engines.

1) ROTELLA ELC Extended Life Coolant is approved for factory-fill in ISB, ISC and ISL engines.
2) ROTELLA ELC Extended Life Coolant with a one-time silicate addition is approved for factory-fill in N14, Signature, ISM and ISX engines.
3) ROTELLA ELC Extended Life Coolant is approved in aftermarket (service fill) applications in all Cummins engines without the addition of silicates.

Therefore, ROTELLA ELC may be used in Cummins engines in accordance with the March 2001 Global Customer Bulletin. Regarding CES 14603, CES 14603 represents Cummins latest specifications for engine coolants and has no direct relation to the above recommendations. Cummins states that CES 14603 describes coolants as sold for use in all Cummins engines in both factory-fill and aftermarket service. Since ROTELLA ELC requires a one-time application of silicate for factory-fill in three currently produced engines, ROTELLA ELC, and other identical extended life coolant technologies, are not formally approved by Cummins against CES 14603. Shell continues to recommend ROTELLA ELC Extended Life Coolant as sold in aftermarket applications in all Cummins engines.

Further information for Shell ROTELLA ELC may be found at http://www.shellusserver.com/product...RotellaELC.pdf.

Thank you for your interest in Shell Rotella Products!

Regards,
Edward Calcote
Staff Chemist, Shell Lubricants US Technical Information Center
__________________________________________________ __________________________________________________ __________________________________________________ _______________

Bottom line I was relieved to see that the ISL was/is approved without the addition of silicate and can be used to top off as well. I do not know whether Newmar made any models with the ISM engine prior to Spartan change to Final Charge.

I hope this may help some one else.
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Old 05-27-2008, 04:25 PM   #3
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Hi Leo! It sounds like you did a lot of Homework! Great Post! Paul
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