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Old 07-11-2018, 03:51 PM   #15
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This is the cheat sheet I made for testing 50 amp shore power: Attachment 210539
Bingo - looks like the winner - test then proceed -

If we had a Picture of the plug and the wires - you might get the correct answer. - - -

IMHO - when we start talking RV electric - it gets really entertaining.

- - -

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Old 07-12-2018, 08:34 AM   #16
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220 plug

Thanks Everyone. My brother in-law had his electrician come out and hook up a 50 amp service direct to the breaker box. He told me the 220 in the garage is 3 pole and I need a 4 pole, so the idea we had would not work. All set now with my very own 50A.
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Old 07-12-2018, 08:44 AM   #17
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CooperHawk----so help me understand--tell me the difference between your 220 volt "welder plug" and 220volt with two 120v legs for a 50 amp RV?
3-Wire 240 Volt Wiring

Most of today’s common appliances and fixtures operate off 120 volt wiring and circuits. Connections to this equipment is done through three wires. The hot wire (typically blue or black), carries the electrical current to the appliance. The white wire is neutral, which completes the circuit. This wire can be traced back to the electrical panel where it is connected to the neutral busbar. The green wire, or bare copper wire, is the ground, which is there for electrical safety.
240 volt wiring, on the other hand, may not need a neutral white wire. Instead there is an additional hot wire which is usually red or blue in color. The two hot wires complete the circuit. This wiring must be connected to a two-pole breaker at the circuit panel to account for the two leads. In essence, a two-pole breaker is 2 single-pole breakers that have been wired together. This type of 240 volt wiring is most commonly used for providing power to electric water heaters, boilers, or condensing units. These appliances do not require 120 volt power.

4-Wire 240 Volt Wiring

Another type of 240 volt wiring is used to power appliances such as stoves and dryers. These devices require 240 volts to power their main function but use 120 volts to power accessory equipment such as clocks and timers. In addition to the two hot wires, this type also contains a white neutral wire to complete the circuit for the accessories that require a 120 volt circuit. As with any type of electrical wiring, a bare copper wire or green wire is also used as the ground wire. Similar to 3-wire 240 volt wiring, the use of 4-wire 240 volt wiring will require the installation of a two-pole breaker in the circuit panel. Changes to the National Electrical Code (NEC) now require that this type of wiring be used predominantly in residential home construction. That is why most of today’s dryers and oven ranges come equipped with a 4-prong plug.





I am assuming your post was meant as sarcasm.



My welders are three prong plugs.
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Old 07-12-2018, 09:15 AM   #18
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3-Wire 240 Volt Wiring

Most of today’s common appliances and fixtures operate off 120 volt wiring and circuits. Connections to this equipment is done through three wires. The hot wire (typically blue or black), carries the electrical current to the appliance. The white wire is neutral, which completes the circuit. This wire can be traced back to the electrical panel where it is connected to the neutral busbar. The green wire, or bare copper wire, is the ground, which is there for electrical safety.
240 volt wiring, on the other hand, may not need a neutral white wire. Instead there is an additional hot wire which is usually red or blue in color. The two hot wires complete the circuit. This wiring must be connected to a two-pole breaker at the circuit panel to account for the two leads. In essence, a two-pole breaker is 2 single-pole breakers that have been wired together. This type of 240 volt wiring is most commonly used for providing power to electric water heaters, boilers, or condensing units. These appliances do not require 120 volt power.

4-Wire 240 Volt Wiring

Another type of 240 volt wiring is used to power appliances such as stoves and dryers. These devices require 240 volts to power their main function but use 120 volts to power accessory equipment such as clocks and timers. In addition to the two hot wires, this type also contains a white neutral wire to complete the circuit for the accessories that require a 120 volt circuit. As with any type of electrical wiring, a bare copper wire or green wire is also used as the ground wire. Similar to 3-wire 240 volt wiring, the use of 4-wire 240 volt wiring will require the installation of a two-pole breaker in the circuit panel. Changes to the National Electrical Code (NEC) now require that this type of wiring be used predominantly in residential home construction. That is why most of today’s dryers and oven ranges come equipped with a 4-prong plug.





I am assuming your post was meant as sarcasm.



My welders are three prong plugs.
You say RV power is not 220 volts and then offer proof that it is.

To be clear, if the outlet is labeled 125/250 volts, its good to use.

Read the fine print on the receptcal.Click image for larger version

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Old 07-12-2018, 09:20 AM   #19
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You say RV power is not 220 volts and then offer proof that it is.

To be clear, if the outlet is labeled 125/250 volts, its good to use.

Read the fine print on the receptcal.Attachment 210635
No, if I said that I misspoke. Of course there are two 110 volt lines. The difference is how it's wired and whether or not it has a neutral wire.
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Old 07-12-2018, 09:25 AM   #20
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Wise move to have a licensed electrician hook up the correct service you needed.
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Old 07-12-2018, 09:54 AM   #21
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Hey guys - in 1984 the NEC changed the national standard for household voltage from 110 volts to 120 volts plus or minus 5%. Anywhere in the US and most of NA is 120/240 volts. There is no more 90 DC, 100 DC, 100 AC, 110 AC, or 117 AC volt to the house. Since the max supplied voltage to the home can be 125/250 volt that the way all are rated. The guys that climb the power poles work hard to see you get exactly 120/240 volts at your power center (circuit breaker box) and the guys at the power plant make sure it exactly 60 cycles. Anything other voltage is considered commercial power.
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Old 07-12-2018, 10:55 AM   #22
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Hey guys - in 1984 the NEC changed the national standard for household voltage from 110 volts to 120 volts plus or minus 5%. Anywhere in the US and most of NA is 120/240 volts. There is no more 90 DC, 100 DC, 100 AC, 110 AC, or 117 AC volt to the house. Since the max supplied voltage to the home can be 125/250 volt that the way all are rated. The guys that climb the power poles work hard to see you get exactly 120/240 volts at your power center (circuit breaker box) and the guys at the power plant make sure it exactly 60 cycles. Anything other voltage is considered commercial power.
'


As an ex-power plant guy the 60 cycles is a product of generator wiring....so at 3600 rpm or 1800 rpm 60 hertz is produced and as soon as I synchronized the unit to the grid I spent the majority of my time maintaining the boiler/auxiliaries and steam flow.


AGC took care of 60 hertz and it's accuracy
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Old 07-12-2018, 07:54 PM   #23
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The 50A plug/socket is a universal 120 and/or 240v device, as noted above. That is, the appliance (or RV) decides whether to use it for two 120v, or one 240v, or a combination of the two. RV's are wired for two 120 volt, and ignore the 240v. There indeed is 240v present in the RV on SHORE POWER, IF you were to test between the two 'hot' wires. However, I've never seen an RV with anything wired for 240v. Furthermore, if there were 240v devices, they wouldn't work on Generator or Inverter, as those both output 120v only. Bottom line, for 50a RV service, you require 4 wires.


Interestingly, 30a RV service is 3-wire. Difference being there is only one 'hot' wire. The 'dog bone' we all use to convert our 50a plug to a 30a, combines the two 'hot' wires from the RV. If you think about it, in the 30a situation you are sharing the 30a between the two inputs on your RV (so with equal load, you would only have 15a per side). When plugged into 50a however, you have 50a available on EACH line. That's 100 amps of 120v power. A 50a service is dramatically more power than a 30a service.
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Old 07-12-2018, 11:59 PM   #24
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While we're on the subject of power cables and connections; does any one have experience with the adapter that combines a 30 amp circuit/plug and a 15 amp/circuit plug to provide 45 amps through the 4 wire 50 amp cable plugged into the coach?

The info card attached to the device on the sales rack says that it will not work if connected to a GFCI protected circuit. I have also read complaints about this issue on line.

The sales clerk in an RV parts store told me today that they have sold many of them to people who use them in RV parks and have never had a return or complaint.

I believe that most modern RV parks have GFCI receptacles on their 15 amp circuits.

So is this a problem or not?

Feedback appreciated.

Gene
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Old 07-13-2018, 12:32 AM   #25
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By definition of how a GFCI circuit works, these devices can't work with a 15 or 20 amp GFCI outlet. A GFCI works by detecting the difference in power going out over the hot line connection and returning over the neutral wire. If they don't balance the GFCI trips. With these dual outlet adapters some of that current flow will return on the neutral for the other outlet, the exact amount depends on a number of factors, wire size, length, amount of corrosion, temperature, etc. Though given that GFCI's are very sensitive devices even a tiny imbalance of return will trip them.
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Old 07-13-2018, 07:04 PM   #26
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While we're on the subject of power cables and connections; does any one have experience with the adapter that combines a 30 amp circuit/plug and a 15 amp/circuit plug to provide 45 amps through the 4 wire 50 amp cable plugged into the coach?

The info card attached to the device on the sales rack says that it will not work if connected to a GFCI protected circuit. I have also read complaints about this issue on line.

The sales clerk in an RV parts store told me today that they have sold many of them to people who use them in RV parks and have never had a return or complaint.

I believe that most modern RV parks have GFCI receptacles on their 15 amp circuits.

So is this a problem or not?

Feedback appreciated.

Gene

Gene, I've carried one of these for years, but only used it once, which was at a rally. There were no GFCI receptacles on the temp power boxes set out in the field where we parked. I was able to run both A/C units without problem. I do agree with the above poster, that a GFCI could trip due to load imbalance. However, it won't hurt to experiment. Worst case is you lose one leg of power if it blows, and then you go back to the 30a dog bone.
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Old 07-13-2018, 07:17 PM   #27
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The 50A plug/socket is a universal 120 and/or 240v device, as noted above. That is, the appliance (or RV) decides whether to use it for two 120v, or one 240v, or a combination of the two. RV's are wired for two 120 volt, and ignore the 240v. There indeed is 240v present in the RV on SHORE POWER, IF you were to test between the two 'hot' wires. However, I've never seen an RV with anything wired for 240v. Furthermore, if there were 240v devices, they wouldn't work on Generator or Inverter, as those both output 120v only. Bottom line, for 50a RV service, you require 4 wires.


Interestingly, 30a RV service is 3-wire. Difference being there is only one 'hot' wire. The 'dog bone' we all use to convert our 50a plug to a 30a, combines the two 'hot' wires from the RV. If you think about it, in the 30a situation you are sharing the 30a between the two inputs on your RV (so with equal load, you would only have 15a per side). When plugged into 50a however, you have 50a available on EACH line. That's 100 amps of 120v power. A 50a service is dramatically more power than a 30a service.
There are a few BIG RVs with 240 volt dryers and 240 volt generators to run them.

Mr D, a frequent poster has one.
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Old 07-13-2018, 07:33 PM   #28
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You say RV power is not 220 volts and then offer proof that it is.

To be clear, if the outlet is labeled 125/250 volts, its good to use.

Read the fine print on the receptcal.Attachment 210635

Again the NEC voltage standard for household use is 120 volts plus of minus 5%. Doesn't how meany legs come into the house, but all must fit into the standard. If you add two 120 volt legs together, you get 240 volts. No where is there 110 volts or 220 volts as they are out of NEC tolerances. As 125 volts is greater than the nominal single line standard voltage of 120 volts of course that electrical receptacle can be used. You just shouldn't use a old receptacle rated at just 220 volts.
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