Community Forums

chillwill · 08-25-2015, 10:46 AM

Update. Just as I figured, my coach is still over at Cummins going on 2 weeks now. Went by then last week and did a test drive with one of the techs so he could see what it was doing. I went by there today and the tech still have no clue to what's causing the issue. He state's that everything is checking out normal. I gave the service manager every possible cause but nothing. I may end up taking it somewhere else if they can't figure it out.

chillwill · 08-27-2015, 08:42 AM

Okay folks I just found out what's going on with my coach and I'm not a happy camper right now. As I stated in my earlier post it has been sitting over at Cummins going to 2 weeks. After $3500 in repairs back in June that didn't fix the problem. With the help of your all, I have told the the service mgr on what to look for in as to what's maybe causing this issue like the exhaust brake sticking or intercooler (CAC). As I was in my bed last night the intercooler was on my mind and I got and went to my computer and did some research on my own. I found out a lot of things about it and I was going to relay it to the service mgr this morning. Just as I got him on the phone he mentioned that the tech found a hole in my intercooler. That was the issue all the time, but they should've of known that the black smoke was a air/fuel ratio issue. The fuel was there but the air wasn't. I'm so upset right now. Now they're complaining about they need a lift to do the work which they don't have. I'm awaiting a call back to figure out what they're going to do. Upon completion of this fix, I will be making a phone call to the manger or corporate.

spsm · 08-27-2015, 08:57 AM

THANKS for keeping us informed chillwill. Exactly what may have caused a hole to develop in your intercooler ?

Dave Fernandez · 08-27-2015, 09:49 AM

You do not need to lift the Alpine in order remove the CAC or the radiator on because it is a side radiator. I have seen the radiator and CAC removed without the use of a lift on a Alpine.

Good luck on your quest.

Jeff and Cheryl · 08-27-2015, 12:16 PM

As Dave has said, the CAC can be removed by removing the Radiator Grill. Absolutely no need for a lift. Another owner did the CAC replacement himself. A search on this forum will give you a wealth of information on this.

Birddog Pilot · 08-27-2015, 03:47 PM

Tell your Cummins shop to call Cummins Cal Pacific, El Cajon, CA and they will verify all that has been said about not needing a lift to remove and repair/replace an Alpine CAC. The entire radiator package removes directly from the side. Cal Pacific did my CAC a couple years ago; it is the model with the replaceable gaskets.

DrDaveMA · 08-27-2015, 08:33 PM

The panel covering the radiator unbolts and then it will swing up exposing the radiator and the muffler area.

Sent from my iPad using iRV2 - RV Forum
Dave, Bobbi and Fenway

chillwill · 08-28-2015, 06:33 AM

Everything u have mention is something I already known. But why they can't see it at the Cummins I have no idea. I still waiting for them to get back with me on how they're going to do it. If the lift thing comes up again, I will tell or show them how the side grill comes off. Remove the 3 or 4 under the bottom holding it in, lift and remove. Thank you all for your responses. I am mechanical incline, but don't think I want to tackle this job.

Pelledan · 08-28-2015, 07:04 AM

I'm not so sure the leak in the CAC is all of the problem but it all depends on the size of the hole or more typically, the crack. When the CAC develops a crack, pressurized air is allowed to escape which usually causes a high pitched squeal as it escapes through the opening under load. Did you hear any such sound while accelerating? Also if that opening was small, yes there would be a loss of boost pressure, but probably not significant enough to cause smoke without an accompanying loss of power. There is a boost pressure sensor somewhere on the pressure side of the air system. Information from that sensor is sent to the ECM along with inputs from a few other sensors that ultimately control engine fueling under a wide range of speed/load conditions. If the leak through the CAC is sufficient enough to cause a considerable boost loss, the boost pressure sensor would identify it and the fuel would have automatically been cut back to control smoke. That fuel reduction would have been a noticed in the form of power loss. Also if the boost loss is that bad, the turbo would not have been able to accommodate the boost demand on high load situations which would have triggered at least a momentary display of the check engine light until the high load subsided and boost supply was again in line with fueling demand.
Dan

Jake74 · 08-28-2015, 08:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pelledan

I'm not so sure the leak in the CAC is all of the problem but it all depends on the size of the hole or more typically, the crack. When the CAC develops a crack, pressurized air is allowed to escape which usually causes a high pitched squeal as it escapes through the opening under load. Did you hear any such sound while accelerating? Also if that opening was small, yes there would be a loss of boost pressure, but probably not significant enough to cause smoke without an accompanying loss of power. There is a boost pressure sensor somewhere on the pressure side of the air system. Information from that sensor is sent to the ECM along with inputs from a few other sensors that ultimately control engine fueling under a wide range of speed/load conditions. If the leak through the CAC is sufficient enough to cause a considerable boost loss, the boost pressure sensor would identify it and the fuel would have automatically been cut back to control smoke. That fuel reduction would have been a noticed in the form of power loss. Also if the boost loss is that bad, the turbo would not have been able to accommodate the boost demand on high load situations which would have triggered at least a momentary display of the check engine light until the high load subsided and boost supply was again in line with fueling demand.
Dan

A small leak will cause a black smoke issue. I had a small intake plenum cover bolt fall out on a 5.9 cummins and it caused a smoke issue. Size of the bolt was probably 6mm. The bolt was still laying on the intake and I just put it back in and all was good.

chillwill · 08-28-2015, 10:03 AM

Okay just got home from Cummins after showing how to remove the side grill and getting to the CAC. They stated that this was something new to them as far as removing the grill. After I showed them that it took about and hour to get the CAC out. There is a crack at the top of the CAC and a hose that was bad as well. They had a radiator specialist to come out to shop to look at it and he stated that the CAC had multiples issues and it would be cheaper to get a new one than fix it. So now Cummins is the process of trying to order one. I have a 2001 Alpine Coach with a ISC 350 so if anyone know of people I can get one please let me. During my 1700 mile trip out to Las vegas last month I only experience the black smoke when going up incline or hard acceleration and I did have a lost of power. Thanks again for the responses and feed back.

Mule Skinner · 08-28-2015, 10:30 AM

Glad you finally found the problem. Please let us know the sorce for the replacement part.

Dave Fernandez · 08-28-2015, 07:55 PM

Contact some of the radiator shops or other truck repair facilities in the area they should be able to tell you who can build one for you.

Fortunately here in San Bernardino County, So CA there are several shops that can build them.

chillwill · 08-29-2015, 07:56 AM

After 2 weeks of getting nowhere and anything coming to a head, I decided to call the Branch Mgr and got him involved. Now the ball is really starting to roll and folks getting off their ass and making things happen. It's unfortunately I had to go that route. The CAC is going to be built by Source Manufacturing in Oregon which will take about a week to complete and about 3 or 4 days to get it to the shop. Now 2 weeks will turn into a month of my coach sitting at Cummins. I only have to pay for part at cost with no mark-up and no labor charges. I guess that's good for what I have already gone through. Now I see why some folks have nothing good to say about most Cummins dealer. A true fact.