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Old 10-06-2011, 06:59 PM   #1
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DHS Sound System

We're dry camping for the first time and discovered some unexpected behavior from the DHS sound system behind the front TV. We turned off the main chassis power in the rear PS compartment to avoid unnecessary chassis battery drain and discovered that we lost TV sound but not the TV. I have a 3 - part question:

1. I would have expected that the DHS sound system gets its power from the house batteries not the chassis batteries. Am I right or wrong?

2. Does anyone know where exactly the DHS system connects to its power source (probably a fuse behind the PS front cover?)?

3. Assuming that the DHS sound system normally gets its power from the chassis batteries, does anyone have a suggestion where to connect it to a fuse for the house batteries?

Thanks for any information!
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Old 10-06-2011, 11:04 PM   #2
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Yup--the old DHS system is 12v and is tied to the chassis bats--as is all of the dash. Not sure if the system gets a separate feed or is powered thru the DHS "audio/video/off" button there on the dash. If is powered thru the switch, it will be easier to rewire. Think there is/are house bat terminals under the dash, behind the panel in front of the passenger's seat--if not, you can drop a fused link off the main house bat cut-off switch there at the front door [not sure how you get access to the back of that switch as our 03 is a MD].

Frankly, I dont see going thru the effort to disconnect the chassis bats while dry camping. Assume you are running yr genset one or more times a day to re-charge your house bats. If so, the echo charger on yr 03 is charging the chassis bats as your house bats are charged [echo charger carries over to chassis bat once house bat reach like 13.7 volts, or there abouts].

Last thought--if you suddenly needed to start and move the coach for some reason, having the chassis switch off would slow things down a bunch.
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Old 10-06-2011, 11:19 PM   #3
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Bob:

OS is correct. 12v from chassis. Signal from dash radio (12v) or TV (120v reduced). Echo Charger will maintain chassis batteries, unless (like mine), the house batteries decline to the point they never achieve the needed level of charge to switch over to charging the chassis. Your chassis power is accessible at the panel in front of the passenger seat. It is also available in the upper cabinets if you have satellite.
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Old 10-07-2011, 10:50 PM   #4
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Thanks for the responnses. I got the same info from folks here at the ACA Heritage rally in Albq. My bats are only 2 years old and do appear to hold a charge thru the night with just the Res Frig running. I left the engine battery source on which didn't seem to affect the drain. We get about 9 - hours until the voltage drops to 11.5.

I would like to know why does the AGS not start the generator after displaying 11.5 volts for more than 15 - seconds as the manual indicates. What does it really take for the generator to start automatically?

FWIW - My laptop crapped out so I'm using my Droid phone to post. The typing SUCKS! Wah!?
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Old 10-08-2011, 01:41 AM   #5
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Bob:

Verify that your Quiet Time parameters are not keeping the AGS from starting, your Genset Type is set to 2, and that you set the AGS Mode to automatic (not manual).

Here is the AGS Manual:
Attached Files
File Type: pdf Xantrex AutoGenStart Manual.pdf (2.53 MB, 22 views)
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Old 10-08-2011, 05:39 PM   #6
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Takepride - I have a small AGS Control System manual. It does indicate a "Type" setting of any kind. I set the LOCAL TIME (Hour), BEGIN (Hour), and END (Hour) to the appropriate hours. I then used the ON/OFF button to select AUTO & then QUIET TIME. The AUTO light is red & the QUIET TIME light is amber. The QUIET TIME light starts flashing when it enters the QUIET TIME parameters at which time I'm running the generator manually.

What am I missing? I'm thinking about letting the voltage display drop to 11.0 volts to see if it ever starts the generator but it makes me very nervous. I guess it's the ony way to know for sure!?
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Old 10-08-2011, 08:54 PM   #7
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Hmm. Sounds like it may take some experimenting. Try adjusting the voltage levels and the time at voltage levels.

First you need to verify that the AGS will start the genset. Use the ManualOn setting. Then work on the AutoOn settings.

The Genset Type is set at the same menu level as configuring the Quiet Times (see page 3-16). Type 2 is for Onan diesel gensets. The premise is to verify the system even "can" start the genset.
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Old 10-09-2011, 09:55 PM   #8
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Takepride - My AGS manual doesn't have any instructions for setting the genset type on any page. The only manual On/Off is on the separate Onan panel.
One test I'll perform will be to determine if the thermostat settings can start the genset on demand. I may also try to allow the bats to drop to 11.5 - 11.0 with just "Auto" on without the Quiet Time. Other than that, I might call Xantrex to determine if my settings are correct and how to determine why the genset doesn't start automatically. Hopefully, they'll provide some means of simulating low voltage rather than having to repeatedly load & charge the bats.
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Old 10-10-2011, 01:10 AM   #9
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Are you sure you have the AGS module installed? Many EMS systems have the settings for AGS but they do not have the AGS module.
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Old 10-10-2011, 07:42 AM   #10
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Rarely [never] use the AGS on my 03 but are you sure we are talking "apples to apples" here? Not sure the separate Onan genset AGS panel on my 03 is configuarable--not like the new Xantrex control panel anyway. Is there an online source for the Onan AGS ops manual?
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Old 10-10-2011, 08:43 PM   #11
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I have the AGS System comprised of an AGS Remote Panel & AGS Controller as depicted here: Power Accessories | Automatic Generator Start | Xantrex.

I still have the original Freedom 458 Inverter/Charger with a Freedom Remote Control Panel which monitors battery voltage as well as control the Inverter/Charger. I observed that the voltage status stays at 12.0 with the bottom 5 - lights all green and the "Battery State" lights the middle symbol with an amber light. Eventually, the voltage status drops to 11.5 with the bottom 4 - lights all amber and the "Battery Status" then lights the left symbol with a red light indicating the need for charging. I've waited somewhere between 15 - 30 minutes for the generator to start but it doesn't.

I suppose it's possible that the voltage status change from 12.0 to 11.5 could actually equate to 11.6 or 11.7 or ?. So even though the status is supposedly 11.5 the AGS knows that it's not really 11.5 just yet. I simply don't have the "guts" to simply sit and wait while the batteries drop even further without being "confident" that the generator will start.

I would like to know if anyone has used the AGS to automatically start the generator while observing the voltage status as I described above. Does it just take a while for the AGS to detect a low voltage condition even though the status is 11.5?
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Old 10-11-2011, 12:39 AM   #12
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Bob:

It sounds like you may have the Heart Interface Freedom 458 20-12 inverter (made by Xantrex). Here is an owner's manual for their "Combi" version. A search of the Internet ought to turn up the original manual. This one does show how to set the genset type using the inverter button on the unit itself.

My original inverter was the Heart. I think I have the original (non-Combi) paper manual in my coach. Let me know if it is what you have. I can scan and send it. I notice it is not in the ACA Tech section.
Attached Files
File Type: pdf FREEDOM_ 458 Series_COMBI_Inverter_ Manual.pdf (327.4 KB, 16 views)
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Old 10-11-2011, 11:43 AM   #13
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Takepride - Thanks for that electronic copy of the Freedom 458 Combi manual! I did find an original paper copy in my documents but it's always convenient to have it on my PC for quick reference.

I just used the Duo Therm thermostat to turn on the AGS (Zone 3) based upon the temperature setting, set the AGS to On, and the generator did start automatically as expected. I believe this now proves that the AGS Controller can start the generator.

I called Xantrex to get further information concerning my questions. The Tecnical Support person (Jeff) verified that even though the Freedom Remote Control Panel displays 11.5 volts does not mean that the AGS is reading 11.5 volts because they're obviously not directly connected. They're both monitoring the battery voltage but the Freedom panel drops from 12.0 to 11.5 when the voltage is "CLOSER" to 11.5 but could actually be 11.6 or 11.7. The AGS will only start the generator if IT reads 11.5 volts for atleast 15 - seconds.

The only means of testing it is to let the voltage drop further than the 11.5 volts displayed on the Freedom panel or use a digital volt meter on the house batteries to determine their actual voltage level. I guess I'll have to remain more patient during the next dry camping experience and let it drop.

Thanks for the help!!!
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Old 10-11-2011, 09:50 PM   #14
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Bob:

Fear not. I have two meters for my batteries, one on the Xantrex and one on the SeeLevel II panel. Both read differently and don't match a direct reading at the battery bank. It would be nice to actually know the correct reading without using my multimeter.
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