Go Back   iRV2 Forums > THE OWNER'S CORNER FORUMS > Alpine Coach Owner's Forum
Click Here to Login
Join iRV2 Today

Mission Statement: Supporting thoughtful exchange of knowledge, values and experience among RV enthusiasts.
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 12-16-2007, 10:25 AM   #1
Senior Member
 
Dale777's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: TX
Posts: 495
I have no alternating current (AC) power from EITHER the generator or shore power connection. AC from the inverter is okay.

When I pulled the cover off the Surgeguard 40250 transfer switch and checked with a voltmeter, there was both shore power and generator power INPUT at 125 volts. A voltmeter check on the OUTPUT side of the transfer switch showed no voltage. When I pushed in on the button in the middle of the Cutler Hammer breaker/solenoid, I got 125 volts on the OUTPUT side of the switch and everything AC in the coach worked as long as held that button in. However, the breaker button would not hold in. The Cutler Hammer breaker/solenoid is labeled C65FNF360 Series A1.

Any ideas?
__________________

__________________
Dale & Karin
2006 Alpine Coach Limited 36FDTS
Watercolor Artist: http://www.cindydaunis.com/
Dale777 is offline   Reply With Quote
Join the #1 RV Forum Today - It's Totally Free!

iRV2.com RV Community - Are you about to start a new improvement on your RV or need some help with some maintenance? Do you need advice on what products to buy? Or maybe you can give others some advice? No matter where you fit in you'll find that iRV2 is a great community to join. Best of all it's totally FREE!

You are currently viewing our boards as a guest so you have limited access to our community. Please take the time to register and you will gain a lot of great new features including; the ability to participate in discussions, network with other RV owners, see fewer ads, upload photographs, create an RV blog, send private messages and so much, much more!

Old 12-16-2007, 10:25 AM   #2
Senior Member
 
Dale777's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: TX
Posts: 495
I have no alternating current (AC) power from EITHER the generator or shore power connection. AC from the inverter is okay.

When I pulled the cover off the Surgeguard 40250 transfer switch and checked with a voltmeter, there was both shore power and generator power INPUT at 125 volts. A voltmeter check on the OUTPUT side of the transfer switch showed no voltage. When I pushed in on the button in the middle of the Cutler Hammer breaker/solenoid, I got 125 volts on the OUTPUT side of the switch and everything AC in the coach worked as long as held that button in. However, the breaker button would not hold in. The Cutler Hammer breaker/solenoid is labeled C65FNF360 Series A1.

Any ideas?
__________________

__________________
Dale & Karin
2006 Alpine Coach Limited 36FDTS
Watercolor Artist: http://www.cindydaunis.com/
Dale777 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-16-2007, 11:20 AM   #3
Senior Member
 
Alpine Owners Club
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 133
Dale,

Well, my friend, it looks as though we both have problems! If you make it to NC, we may still be in the area due to our Hydro-Hot problem. Will keep in touch and good luck.

Jim & Ingrid
__________________
2005 40' Limited FDTS

Brandywine
Jim & Ingrid McIntosh is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-16-2007, 02:34 PM   #4
Senior Member
 
Alpine Owners Club
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Las Vegas, NV
Posts: 1,100
Dale,

I haven't been into mine, so without being there, I can't be much assistance. Does the read out say anything? Can you tell if the "Cutler Hammer breaker/solenoid" is just a breaker or solenoid? My best guess is that the unit with the button is a contactor (solenoid) there should be no need for a breaker. There is probably a circuit board that monitors the voltage and amps that powers the contactor, holding it closed. There could be a problem with the circuit board or the coil on the contactor. A contactor usually has two heavy wires attached to each end of the unit and a small wire connection on each of the other sides for the coil. You can check to see if the contactor is getting voltage on the 2 small terminals. It there is no voltage there, then the circuit board is probably bad. There is a troubleshooting guide here. I am not sure if it tells much or not. Doesn't show any internal diagrams.

http://www.surgeguard.com/40250.html

Hope this helps.

the other Dale
__________________
Dale Gerstel
AMG GTS
Las Vegas, NV
Had: 2007 Limited SE 40fdts
dgerstel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-16-2007, 03:30 PM   #5
Senior Member
 
Dale777's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: TX
Posts: 495
Dale Gerstel,

Thanks for the suggestions. The remote monitor inside the coach for the Surgeguard transfer switch is blank. I did not check voltage to the small wire connection to the contactor that you mention. I will check that on Monday. I already checked the troubleshooting guide you reference; if I followed it correctly, it leads me to the box that says, "If good AC power is available to the input with no output or error messages REPLACE THE ATS". The problem now is getting a replacement ATS within 1-2 days.

Jim & Ingrid,

We will be NC regardless of the coach problems, even if we have to just drive the Jeep. Sorry to hear that you are having Hydro-Hot problems; I hope you are able to stay warm in the cold weather. Keep in touch.
__________________
Dale & Karin
2006 Alpine Coach Limited 36FDTS
Watercolor Artist: http://www.cindydaunis.com/
Dale777 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-16-2007, 03:39 PM   #6
Senior Member
 
Alpine Owners Club
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Las Vegas, NV
Posts: 1,100
Dale,

If the monitor is blank then I would think that a control circuit board would be the problem. It reads like that they want you to replace the whole unit. Good luck.

Dale
__________________
Dale Gerstel
AMG GTS
Las Vegas, NV
Had: 2007 Limited SE 40fdts
dgerstel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-16-2007, 06:10 PM   #7
Senior Member
 
bigfish's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 214
Have had this same problem crop up a couple of times where there is no AC from shore or generator source, just AC from inverter. Had to disconnect AC shore power and disconnect all DC to the Onan 2000W inverter. Left it off for a couple of minutes and inverter lost it's fault memory & reset when DC & AC sources were reapplied. This method restored AC power from the shore & generator sources.
BTF
__________________
bigfish is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-16-2007, 06:54 PM   #8
Senior Member
 
Dale777's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: TX
Posts: 495
bigfish,

Thanks for the suggestion about shutting off all DC to the inverter, which I will try on Monday. However, you mention an Onan 2000W inverter, but my coach has a Xantrex RS2000W inverter/charger, not Onan. See this link: Xantrex RS2000 web site

Is this the same thing that you are referring to? Also, where exactly do you shut off all DC to the inverter/charger?
__________________
Dale & Karin
2006 Alpine Coach Limited 36FDTS
Watercolor Artist: http://www.cindydaunis.com/
Dale777 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-17-2007, 03:49 AM   #9
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Abington, PA
Posts: 1,103
Dale, I believe if you shut the coach battery switch and all DC breakers you should have all DC off. Are you referring to the solenoid that is in the battery area? Possible our 2005 is dfferent than your o6 but I do not think so. Tha solenoid as such could be the culprit. You also have a transfer switch attached to the ceiling of your basement. It is a black box App/ 8" X 12". I have both go bad at different times and they definitely affected the power. As I think about it the solenoid only affected the DC power. The contactor which is on the ceiling of the basement, as I mentioned a black box. I believe this had control of the AC power. Poorly on my part is that I had a problem, identified it and corrected it. I know the correction but I never documented the actual problem that I had.I will make certain that does not happen in the future. In either case WRV next day aired to me both parts. I would check with WRV or Engineer Mike or Bob Mahon. In Bob Mahon's case his coach is older and may not use the setup as we do. Certainly Mike E's 06 did. Hope you understand all this jibberish.
__________________
Ted & Carol Ulmer
2005 Alpine 34', 34FDDS
2006 PT Turbo pusher
Ted III is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-17-2007, 06:30 AM   #10
Senior Member
 
bigfish's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 214
Dale,
My 05 40FDQS has the Onan Equinox 2000W inverter, a different brand of inverter than the XANTREX.
The only way I could get the Onan inverter to reset was to shut off the AC shore power and then lift the negative lead off of the battery bank terminal leading to the J-Box on the battery compartment wall. On my coach, it's the terminal on the the chassis battery that has 3 cables, 1 cable jumping to house battery bank, 1 cable jumping to the other 12VDC chassis battery, remaining cable jumping to the J-Box on battery compartment wall. Simply opening the house & chassis battery disconnects will not shut down the DC to the Onan inverter on my coach, appears to be some sort of sneak circuit feeding the inverter.
The Xantrex may be more sophisticated and have a circuit breaker on the inverter housing that can be shut off and allow the inverter to reset the fault memory. It may be worth the while to give WRV or Xantrex support a call and see if they have suggestions as this appears to be a common problem.
BTF
765-589-9015
__________________
bigfish is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-17-2007, 06:49 AM   #11
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Summer Rowlett TX (Why?)/Winter Palm Springs CA Two Springs RV Resort http://www.twospringsrv.com/
Posts: 521
Dale, from the symptoms you describe, here is my take on your problem:
1) The inverter is way downstream and should have nothing to do with your problem.
2) The "Fat Boy" relay in the battery compartment connects the two battery banks together and should have nothing to do with your AC power problem.
3) Looking at the Surge Guard ATS Troubleshooting Guide,if you have good power inputs from the park and also the generator and there is no output to the coach, then the Surge Guard box is bad and must be replaced.
4) Regarding your blank display, I would try disconnecting the data line from the Surge Guard (should look like a phone line)and reconnect to fix a bad connection or reset the monitor system. If this fails, try doing the same thing at the monitor panel.
5) This doesn't happen every day, but I learned something today. The Surge Guard not only protects you from bad shore power but also replaces the transfer switch hanging on the basement ceiling.
Surge Guard
__________________
Basil & Sue Shannon
Former Apex owner (Gary & Renee have it now)
Was Traveling Circus (2 clowns/Sage the Wonder Dog) Tent rotted. Circus folded.
Basil Shannon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-17-2007, 07:26 PM   #12
Senior Member
 
bigfish's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 214
In my situation the inverter was the problem. The Cutler-Hammer contactors in the Surge Guard would not energize, but once the fault code "65" on the inverter display panel was cleared by removing all power to the inverter for a few minutes the fault code disappeared and I again had AC from shore & generator sources once AC & DC was was restored to the inverter.
Did have a similar but different problem one time @ Blazing Star rv park in San Antonio. Shore power contactor dropped out, message center indicated open ground. Checked gnd @ shore pedestal & in surge protector with v.o.m. but ground checked o.k. Worked around this problem to restore AC and then next day everything returned to normal.
BTF
__________________
bigfish is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-17-2007, 08:43 PM   #13
Junior Member
 
Russ Carr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: San Martin, CA
Posts: 9
I also have had the no AC power problem. I checked the SurgeGard box and noticed the wires were not tight. I removed all power (shore power AC and also disconnected both house and chassis 12 volt switches. I tightened the wire connections inside the box and then reapplied power. I also "reset" the Xantrex inverter/charger. After this all worked fine, however I'm not sure which action cured the problem.
__________________
Russ and Marilyn Carr with yorkie Emma
2006 36' FDTS with 2008 CR-V toad
Russ Carr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-18-2007, 09:29 AM   #14
Senior Member
 
Dale777's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: TX
Posts: 495
Thanks to everyone for all the quick and helpful suggestions.

I've tried them all now to no avail:
a. checking for loose connections in the transfer switch,
b. pushing the red reset button on the Xantrex inverter/charger,
c. disconnecting all DC to the inverter/charger (it does have DC power that seems to bypass the coach and chassis battery shutoff switches),
d. reconnecting the RJ45 jack to the remote transfer switch monitor (blank monitor)
e. checking voltage (good) on the house and genset inputs to the transfer switch
f. checking voltage (none) on the output of the transfer switch
g. holding in the button on the Cutler Hammer contactor, which causes good voltage on the output of the transfer switch, but the contactor will not hold when I let up on the button.

After talking to WRV Monday morning, they are UPS overnighting a replacement transfer switch, but unfortunately it is stuck in Seattle due to bad weather in the Northwest. However, I really do appreciate the quick response from WRV! They are doing the right thing and quickly!
__________________

__________________
Dale & Karin
2006 Alpine Coach Limited 36FDTS
Watercolor Artist: http://www.cindydaunis.com/
Dale777 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply



Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Using Generator with Shore Power Tom & Diane Damon 7 09-19-2008 11:55 AM
No 120 30amp shore power after accidental generator start yankinva Winnebago Industries Owner's Forum 7 07-23-2008 03:56 PM
Loss of Shore/Generator Power RVersOnline Alpine Coach Owner's Forum 6 06-26-2008 08:59 PM
A/C w/shore power, but NO A/C w/generator ON peppermintpj1 RV Systems & Appliances 2 03-02-2006 10:35 PM
No Eletrical Power from Power Tech Generator Field Trip Newmar Owner's Forum 5 09-27-2005 06:23 PM

» Virginia Campgrounds

Reviews provided by


Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 07:18 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.