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Old 09-25-2005, 08:34 AM   #1
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Jim & Mary Jo:

Need your help, Mike ( of Mike & Nancy ) was over yesterday, and we about went nuts trying to figure out the speaker wiring on his system. We had a great time visiting and TALKING Alpine, but a totally unproductive day.
The best I could figure is they have used the TV ( output )to transfer the audio signal to the switch on the dash. My 04 was a mess, but Mike's is a worse, apparently built earlier.
I was hoping to get his set up up and running before he heads off to homecoming. I have a pretty good understanding of his coach ( same as yours ), if you could give me a call with info on how you re-cabled yours....... It will be much appreciated.

Talk to you soon,

Walt
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Old 09-25-2005, 08:34 AM   #2
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Jim & Mary Jo:

Need your help, Mike ( of Mike & Nancy ) was over yesterday, and we about went nuts trying to figure out the speaker wiring on his system. We had a great time visiting and TALKING Alpine, but a totally unproductive day.
The best I could figure is they have used the TV ( output )to transfer the audio signal to the switch on the dash. My 04 was a mess, but Mike's is a worse, apparently built earlier.
I was hoping to get his set up up and running before he heads off to homecoming. I have a pretty good understanding of his coach ( same as yours ), if you could give me a call with info on how you re-cabled yours....... It will be much appreciated.

Talk to you soon,

Walt
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Old 09-25-2005, 10:26 AM   #3
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Walt....Thanks again for all your help . Great minds think alike ha!ha!ha! I e-mailed Jim this morning 0530 about my system and the problems we had. He called me and will FAX copy of his re-wired system. I will bring it by your place sometime next week. He also is eager to help solve the WRV wiring mystery. Apparently, the "RiverPark system is good you just need to change components and re-wire. I feel much better that we are going in right direction. Thanks to this WEB site and the people on it

Mike and Nancy
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Old 09-25-2005, 06:43 PM   #4
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Mike,

You had better get that fixed (I like this guy!) so we can watch "Second Hand Lions" at homecoming.
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Old 09-26-2005, 11:05 AM   #5
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Tom:

If you haven't seen Second Hand Lions, watch it........ it's not an awesome movie, but very worth the price of a ticket. I have watched it probably four times, and it still makes me feel good at the ending. Don't remember the kid actors' name, but catch him in "Pay It Forward"....... interestingly, I get the same "warm and fuzzy" feeling at the end on that movie.

Robert Duvall plays a perfect character in his roll. I have been a big fan of his since seeing him in Lonesome Dove........ which is a awesome movie.

Enjoy,

Walt
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Old 09-26-2005, 01:27 PM   #6
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Hi Walt,

Before I tackled the install and wiring of all my new components, I diagrammed it. But, I didn't expect it would be seen by anyone else . It's not a pretty drawing, but I Faxed it to Mike anyway.

The DHS system is pretty good, but it appears to pick up some ground loop noise and may need a filter. BTW, it takes it input from the TV speaker output and --of course-- takes another input via the dash radio with rca jacks.

ALSO BTW, I don't recommend enabling "surround sound" on the TV, it kinda "steps on" the DHS surround system.

I had considered posting my AV project, but after several issues and almost 20 hours of install time (mostly due to the increased depth of Dishnet receivers and short factory-bulit cabinet space), I just didn't want to set anyone up for such a difficult experience.

On the other hand, I now have DIshnet HD reception (1 satellite at a time)and Progressive scan DVD. It looks great and is a big improvement over the factory setup. The plasma TV is a pretty good unit and can display a much better picture.

I'm doing a "sanity check" on Mike's selected components to avoid in-compatibilities and sometime soon I offered to meet him at your place to get it all wired up.

Looking forward to seeing you again,

Jim
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Old 09-26-2005, 03:20 PM   #7
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Jim:
ThanX for the feedback. Looking forward to seeing your diagram. I concluded after getting Mikes' torn apart, that as with mine, WRV was using the VCR as the tuner. The only reson for it to be set up this way is an assumption that the owner would never activate the satelite system, and would only use Park Cable, or local TV. What I couldn't understand about the RiverPark system was routing the audio signal out of the VCR through the Plasma, then to the two way switch on the dash. Bad by design, and on top of that they have used the smallest wire possible for the speaker connection. It is no wonder the speakers hum and pop. The degradation from all the transfers / connections is inherent. If your sub-woofer in the back of the kitchen cabinet doesn't have adequate bass kick, check the enclosure. On Mikes', there is one inch gap between the enclosure box and the outer cabinet wall. Will not work, needs to be sealed and speaker batting material installed in order to trap enough air to get the speaker to work.

We are going to try to get this system to work, but Mike may not be happy as he has seen mine that performs like it should. My utilimate suggestion to him is to loose the RiverPark, and we will start from scratch.

ThanX fro you help........ and stop by

Walt
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Old 09-26-2005, 04:07 PM   #8
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All this collaboration makes me want to move back to L.A. Sort of.

On the 06's, the DVD is used as the tuner, sorta like the VCR used as tuner, but the TV has several modes to choose from that make that a decent choice (I think).

I had to de-tune my subwoofer (under the couch). I tried to find the electronic tuning for it, to no avail so far. Gave up and used the glass plate out of the microwave. Works like a charm. Cuts the bass to an amount where I can hear the other audio. Wife doesn't like it. Wants her kitchen back.
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Old 09-26-2005, 07:38 PM   #9
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Mike, you should be able to lower the DB of the Sub through the Kenwood setup menu.
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Old 09-27-2005, 11:15 AM   #10
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Wayne, I agree. If I keep poking around, I may even find the menu
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Old 09-27-2005, 11:26 AM   #11
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You probably have already figured it out. On mine I access the setup menu in DVD mode with the TV on input 1. Push setup on the Kenwood remote and go to 5.1 speaker setup.

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Old 09-27-2005, 01:36 PM   #12
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Wayne, you're a sweetie. I'da figgerd that out in another 2 or 3 months. Thanks
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Old 09-28-2005, 06:48 AM   #13
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Hi Walt,
I think the reason both DVD audio/video is routed through the "pass-thru" connection of the VCR is to ultimately connect to the Winegard. Once the Winegard gets this RCA video/audio connection, it "modulates" the signal so it can be routed to the bedroom TV and patio connection.

The factory was trying to enable connection through the Winegard of all inputs to all outputs (e.g. Ant, Sat, DVD or VCR can be switched to MainTV, BRTV or Patio)

Audio is another story. To enable "surround sound", there are many component choices. One could choose a dash amp with 5.1 output or a DVD player/amp with 5.1 output, etc.

In our 04 models, all components have stereo amps and the factory added the RP DHS unit to drive our speakers to achieve simulated surround sound. The DHS unit is pretty good IMHO and probably added significant component cost, compared to using a dash radio or DVD/Amp combo with 5.1 output.

The connection to the DHS is RCA jacks from the dash radio and shielded speaker pair from the TV. The switch on the dash selects between those inputs.

The noise problem is either RF (radio freq) or ground loop (common ground with power noise "seepage"). SInce the speaker pair is shielded as I recall, I'm guessing ground loop, but who knows. I plan to buy a ground loop isolators (cheap items) and try them.

I've observed that no noise is present when the audio switch is selected, only when video is on. The dash radio connects to the RPDHS with rca jacks. If it has open rca jacks for a second input, running rca audio-out cables from the TV could solve it too.

Anyway, between our experiences, we'll achieve an ideal audio/videophile's configuration.

Heading up to Zion next week and should have some time the following week. I'll e-mail Mike with some preparatory suggestions (back cabinet cutting to fit new component dimensions).
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Old 09-28-2005, 10:54 AM   #14
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Jim:

Got your diagram that Mike dropped off yesterday. I can understand it okay, and see you have routed two Component Video cables through a box to the TV. Knowing that the Panasonic has only one input, did you use the distribution block from SmartHome, and does it work okay? And by replacing the VCR and DVD with a combo, it looks like you have routed the audio through the Wineguard to the TV, instead of the VCR as before...... then using the outputs to go to the two way switch.
I'm sure this has enabled you to get it all operational, and a considerable improvement over what was delivered to you. Believe me, I know where the twenty hours labor went. I can appreciate you not wanting to post the the fix knowing the fabrication involved.
I have told Mike your set-up will work, and he understands what to aquire before us getting together. What I have a problem with is using the audio speaker output on the TV as a signal transfer to the dash switch........... it's against my religion to do this. I'm sure you racked the brain waves trying to figure a work-around on this........ yet with having the dash amp in conjuction with the RP system, there is no other way. My bet is, somewhere in this loop is your problem with the hum.

I love EngineerMikes' participation in our dialog regarding the Entertainment system. I think we finally have a subject that he does not know absolutely everything about.... or he is trying to humor us by pretending to show a little humility. He has his wife up-set that he is using her kitchen stuff to lower the volume on his sub-woofer........ love it. Mike, just kidding around........ appreciate all your post, and I find value in what you have to say, ThanX,

Walt
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