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Old 10-10-2009, 10:24 AM   #1
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Temperature readings

My 2006 Apex FDQS has a hydro hot system as well as two roof heatpumps. I am using the heat for the first time in this coach sitting in Amarillo TX where it will be 24 tonight. Both systems work fine except that the thermostat indicates the temp is 58 when it appears it is actually 70 by the thermometer and the back zone is even worse. Last night I set them at 57 and it kept it 65 in the bedroom zone and 68 in the front zone. Does anyone have any idea where the sensors are in each zone that reads the temp.? Since the thermostat seems to work fine my guess is it is the sensors. I also finally found my lower heat unit but can not find any thermostat connected to it. It is located above the back drivers side smartbed mounted behind the frame rail on the basement ceiling. Two fans but no thermostat anywhere to be found. Two small wires which appear to go into the large bundle of wires going back to the utilities compartment but no luck isolating them there.
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Old 10-10-2009, 02:04 PM   #2
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Jerry,

I think that you will find the sensor locations on the ceiling under a small plastic grill. Mine are quite close to the AC grills, but they could be anywhere in the front and bedroom areas. At very low temperatures, they are probably being affected by cold coming thru the ceiling. I find that I have to compensate what I set my thermostat to by a small amount, by how cold it will get at night.

You should find a small mechanical thermostat, with a small plastic knob, on the ceiling of one of your rear smart beds, probably center or drivers side of the coach.
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Old 10-10-2009, 02:08 PM   #3
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Jerry- the basement thermostat usually consisted of a Dayton t-stat w/a knob, and a looped copper line w/a long copper bulb at the end. If you can find the copper bulb, follow the line.
Wild chance the Apexes didn't use that Dayton t-stat, in favor of some higher line sensor to interface w/Silverleaf.
Apexers?
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Old 10-10-2009, 03:54 PM   #4
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Thanks for the pointers. I have two sensors in my ceiling each next to my AC units. The front one is just a cover with two screws and no opening under it. The back one has a very small opening punched in the ceiling material about the size of the end of a ball point pin. I punch a small hole in the fabric in the front zone so we will see what that does.
Mike, since the wind is blowing from that side at about 30 mile and hour and the temp is about 35 I thought I would leave well enough alone right now. I know it is not in the second smartbed where the heating unit and two fans are or at least it is not anything like the two of you described. Opened the other side and there is warmth in the basement so I will look tomorrow after the wind calms down. Other than that the hydro heat is getting a work out.
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Old 10-10-2009, 04:44 PM   #5
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Jerry,

Mine is between the frame rail and the outside wall of the coach, in front of the back living room slide ram. Here is a photo that shows mine (not real well.)



It is in the top left of the photo. Photo is taken from the drivers side in, inside the rear smart bed
Here is the best photo that I could fine, with a quick search, that shows the type of unit you are looking for.
Thermostat,Remote Bulb - Line Voltage Thermostats - Controls - HVACR : Grainger Industrial Supply
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Old 10-10-2009, 05:59 PM   #6
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I was trying to find this the other day to post on the Monaco forum. Monaco used small discs they refer to as snap discs, which snap closed when they reach a specified temp. Of course the discs are the cheapest thing known to man for the chore, and if bought in bulk are probably less than a couple dollars each. The dial-adjustable unit WRV was using was way spendy by comparison, and a better unit for an owner. Hence I wanted to show Monaco'rs the option. All I could find were 120V units, no 12V (Dale's link is 120V, but I waded thru pages of Grainger and other suppliers).
I guess Tis the Season to check on basement heating.
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Old 10-10-2009, 06:19 PM   #7
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Jerry,
Had same question as I am a new owner of 08' 36' and quite often find ourselves in cold climates. Was told by reliable source that thermostat next to water pump drivers side. Haven't had time to confirm. Previous coach was Dynasty with Aqua-Hot and thermostat very visible inside a bay.
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Old 10-11-2009, 01:18 AM   #8
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Dale & EM & All, I have seen the thermostat in the ceiling of the large slide where I have access to water pump, etc. I am not aware what that does, so like grandmother told me, if you don't know what it is, don't mess with it.

Concerning the heat, our thermostat is on the hall side of the galley slide toward the back. We set the front to 62-63 and the bedroom 60 for those evenings when we will need heat from the HH. We have a medium weight down conforter on the bed, so we don't want the BR to warm. As some are aware, we have hot water issues, but the heating side of the system is good. Our temp sensors are in the ceiling near each A/C unit, both seem to have a grill so the temp is read. When on shore power in some parks when the power is low, the A/C units don't seem to cool the coach down correctly, fire up the genset and it works perfect. When we are on good 30/50A shore power, everything works perfectly, both A/C's, microwave, all of it.

We have never had any issue with the heat, it seems to do its job the way it should. I did have the HH Authorized tech test my boiler fluid for proper thermal transfer ability and he found it low in its ability to transfer heat. He recommended we add about a quart of boiler concentrate to the overflow tank, which we have done. I believe this has made the heat part of the system work better. I believe he used a thermal sensor/reader on it, but won't swear to that.

My only concern is if it's real cold already, the HH unit takes a while to warm up the whole coach, as I believe the fans don't move the air fast enough or with enough CFM's of air movement. There are aftermarket fans that can be installed which are quieter and move more air, and I believe Dale or EM has installed them. If I’m wrong sorry, if you have, what was the result.

Now what does that thermostat do which is in the basement? Does it just call for heat for that area when it's cold? If so, I'm leaving it alone, if it does something else or in combination, I think I will still leave it alone, as it seems to do what is supposed to do.

The picture Dale posted, looks like what is in my APEX, but in a differnt location but the same area.

As an aside, since I cannot spell, or cannot type, or a combination of both and bad grammar as well, I always cut the post out of the forum, and paste into MS Word, and do a grammar and spell check. So hopefully, I have fixed most of my mistakes.
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Old 10-11-2009, 11:30 AM   #9
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Monty,

Have you sealed the AC ducting in the ceiling at the AC's, there generally many leaks, allowing a recirculation of cool air, causing a loss in performance.
Do a search on Aqua Hot and Hydro Hot, I did a few posts about fixes I did to make my system work better.
Thermostat in the basement is for freeze protection for the tanks. It will heat that area as ness, as long as the HH has some heat source.
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Old 10-11-2009, 10:06 PM   #10
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Dale, thank you for the information on the ac ducts. All I have done to the a/c's was to make sure they were tight, found some of the hold down bolts very loose. I Was careful to not over tighten them as that can warp the gasket material. I have not done the sealing you are talking about, as I am not sure what needs to be sealed. Once we are on the road, I will take a look at it since we can then identify easier those areas which need attention. I will do a search on the HH/AH system to read your modifications and improvements. One thing I would like to do is participate in an "annual service" session for that unit. One caution I am aware of are the lugs which hold the combustion chamber to the main unit, you don't want to over tighten those bolts/nuts as you can break off the lugs, and that is bad and expensive.
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Old 10-12-2009, 10:12 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jerry Burns View Post
My 2006 Apex FDQS has a hydro hot system as well as two roof heatpumps. I am using the heat for the first time in this coach sitting in Amarillo TX where it will be 24 tonight.

Heat pump should NOT work at 24 F.
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Old 10-12-2009, 10:37 PM   #12
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Will not?

OR

Ought not?

My understanding is that the heat pumps can only change the temperature of the air by about 20 degrees and is therefore not effective as a heater when it is too cold. I believe it does still function, just not effectively.

Either way, I really dislike all the noise. When plugged in, I use ceramic heaters. When boondocking, I use propane. When it's really cold and plugged in, I use both. If I had HH, I'd use it.
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Old 10-14-2009, 08:47 AM   #13
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Thanks to all who responded. I have not used the heat pumps at all other than to turn them on to see if they work. The HH works great. The colder it is outside the more spread between the temp setting and the temp readout on the thermostat. If it is in the mid to upper 30's the spread is approx. 12 degrees. So when the thermostat reads 55 it is really 67 in the coach. When it is in the mid 20's the spread is about 16 degrees so I just have to adjust the temp setting to compenstate for the spread. My lower bay temp controller is still a mystery. It is not the same place as Dale's in his picture but does go up or down with my number one zone which is the living room. All I care about right now is that it works.
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Old 10-14-2009, 01:15 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jerry Burns View Post
My lower bay temp controller is still a mystery. It is not the same place as Dale's in his picture but does go up or down with my number one zone which is the living room. All I care about right now is that it works.
On my 2006 Apex, the basement thermostat is mounted on the same piece of wood as the water pump. Of course, as Bob Kapp & I say, no two Apex's are alike.
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