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Old 05-18-2005, 09:19 PM   #29
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I'm going to break ranks here and install Bridgestones or Firestones on our coach. I'll let everyone know how I like them. Memorial weekend we are out for two weeks, headed for So. Utah and Estes Park Co. traveling US 12 in Utah. This trip should be a good test.
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Old 05-29-2005, 08:24 AM   #30
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Does anyone have history with the M124Z? As a Tracks Wagonmaster, I run from Baja to Fairbanks. Got 60,000 from my first set of M120Z's. A Les Schwab dealer in Oregon convinced my to replace with the M124's. I now have 15k miles on them. They are definately wearing better than the M120's. But that was probably easy to accomplish by the jist of the other notes on this forum!
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Old 06-02-2005, 02:56 PM   #31
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Our 2006 Alpine came with M124Z's so it looks like WRV upgraded to them as well. WRV uses Les Schwab as their tire/wheel subcontractor.

It's an "multi-service, all wheel position" tire like the 120s, but it has 1/16 inch more tread and 5 steel belts instead of 4. Toyo refers to them as "top of the line" in their category.

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Old 06-04-2005, 07:57 AM   #32
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We recently upgraded from a 2005 Avalanche to a 2005 38' Limited and love the quality difference! Our coach came with the Toyo M120Z tires and I can see from the forum it has some problems. This is really our first motor home (we didn't have the Avalanche very long) and I'm wondering how often one normally rotates the tires. Also, if one puts "steering" tires on the front and "driving" tires on the rear, how are the tires effectively rotated? Our coach has about 5000 miles on it and it seems to handle beautifully but it sounds like I need to keep an eye on the front tire wear.
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Old 06-04-2005, 02:56 PM   #33
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Hello & Welcome Jerry & Shirley:

I would like to welcome you to the form and to the Alpine. As for your question regarding the Toyo 120's they are a good tire but the front ones scuff of the outside edge after a while. Since the tires are all the same rotate if you want, we as Motorhome owners probably will not wear them out and they will replaced because of age, not wear. Rotate them if you want but I do not think it is a necessity. The Toyo 120's are a all position tire so you can rotate them front to rear.

Some owners have changed to other brands and some like me upgraded when mine were over five years old. I went to the Toyo 147's and I think they are great. Some friends have changed to the Toyo 124's and they like them others have gone to Michelin tires. Since you have a 2005 I would not worry until about 2011 about tires unless you have a flat.

Safe Motorhoming

Dave
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Old 07-10-2005, 05:14 PM   #34
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Promised I'd come back with a report on my new front tires. At the dealer's recommendation, installed M147's. 5000 miles later, no sign of wear and they handle fine with the original M120's on the back. I'd recommend them.
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Old 07-11-2005, 08:17 PM   #35
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Since the original tires on my 2001 Alpine Coach 38FDDS are almost 5 years old, I am looking into replacements. I would appreciate any comments or recommendations for replacements.

The front axle tires are 2 year old Kumho KLS01 Longmark STEER tires (295/75R22.5). These Kumho tires now have about 15,000 miles on them. The rear tires are the original Toyo M120Z tires (295/75R22.5), with about 45,000 miles on them.

You might ask why the front tires are different and not the original. That is because the right, front tire blew out 2 years ago, when traveling 70mph about 10 miles east of Rawlins, WY on I80. Only 1 hour before, I stopped at a rest area and just happened to check the tire pressure on all tires, which was okay. This is a habit of mine to check tire pressures daily before starting on a trip, then I also sometimes check them again during the day. Since the tire was shredded by the time I safely pulled over to the shoulder, there was no clear evidence of what caused the blow-out. When I had Rip Griffin truck stop come out to replace the tire, they did not have Toyo tires, so they recommended the Kumho steer tire. The next day, after talking to both WRV and Les Schwab, I had the left front tire replaced with the same type Kumho tire.

I must say that since then, the coach has handled far superior to what it did with the original Toyo front tires. I no longer have the outside edges wearing unduly, which the Toyo tires did. Also, when there is a strong side wind, I do not have to "tack" into the wind as much as I did with the Toyo tires. Note that I said the Kumho tires are STEER tires, which Rip Griffin truck service insisted was necessary on the front of the motorhome, based on their many years of dealing with 18 wheelers.

I would like to point out that in November, 2003, Frank Aspeslagh has a note in the forum stating something similar to what I am saying about steer tires on the front axle. I realize that I am not able to rotate the tires with this mix, but why do I need to rotate? The original rear tires have almost the same tread depth at 45,000 miles as when they were new.

However, having said all this, I still would like to hear recommendations for replacement tires. I certainly would like to hear comments about STEER versus DRIVE tires.

Thanks,

Dale
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Old 07-11-2005, 09:30 PM   #36
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Dale,

First the difference between steer and drive tires. A steer tire "can" be used as a drive tire. A steer tire usually has around 16 to 18 32nds.
Drive tires on the other hand have upwards of 26/32 and are usually a block design with or without an open shoulder. Think of a drive tire as a mud and snow.
The Toyo 120 is an all-position tire. All position can be used in steer (usually higher scrub applications like a MH tire) or as a drive tire if the extra traction isn't necessary.
These are only my opinions..... the problem with a steer tire is the tendency of the small groove to the outside of the tire (equalizer rib, anti-erosion rib, decoupling groove) to tear under sharp turns, fill with dirt and rocks ect. This is why it works great on over-the-road trucks. Intersate traveling, long miles of straight roads. Trucks that run 8-14K miles a month, with few deliveries. A steer tire will definately have a better steeering response.
All position tires are found on shorter haul rigs, traveling up and down the freeways but with more frequent deliveries. Lots of turning (high scrub).
I chose to run an all position Bridgestone R260. One reason is the type of trip we just made to a campground just 75 miles from home. The last 17 miles was asphalt road with turns that required speeds of only 20 MPH. You should see my tires after this last trip. Maybe I'll post a picture of high scrub wear. We ran US 12 in Utah and highways 119,72, and county road 7 in Colorado during our 2 week vacation.
A steer tire would not hold up under these circumstances. Most of our driving will be of that type since we are not retired and our trips will be shorter. If you will be traveling mostly interstates and not taking many roads like US 12 in Utah, go for the steer up front and all position in the rear. Or steer all the way around would work with some manufactures.
Just MHO.
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Old 07-12-2005, 09:58 AM   #37
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Tom and Patty,

Thanks for the comments about steer versus drive tires.
I appreciate these comments, since I am trying to learn
more before I buy replacement tires soon. It might be
obvious that I currently lean toward having steer tires
on the front axle and drive (or all position) tires on
the rear axle, since I have had good experience with this
combination for the past 2 years. I'm still suspicious of
the all position tire that blew out on the right front,
although there is no way to determine the cause. By the
way, I had weighed the front axle before the start of the
trip and prior to the blow-out with a fully loaded coach,
and the front axle weight was within the limits by 1,080
pounds, although I did not have the individual left and
right side weights. Both front tires were inflated to
105 pounds cold.

However, I would be more than willing to switch to all
position tires for all 6 tires if I fully understood the
various pros/cons and concluded this is the best approach.
I would also like to hear which tires would be best:
Toyo, Goodyear, Michelin?

Dale
2001 Alpine Coach 38FDDS
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Old 07-12-2005, 12:00 PM   #38
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I'll be attending Homecoming this fall and going through Salt Lake. I've made the decision to switch out my Toyo 120's for 147's after speaking with Harold van der Meijden of Toyo tires (see Danny Gayhart's previous post on this topic-thanks, Danny).
I'm looking for any input regarding a dealer in the Salt Lake area that can determine the allowance of my present 120's as well as do an alignment.
Thanks
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Old 07-12-2005, 12:39 PM   #39
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Tom,
Are truck tires all CNC layup of materials these days? I think passenger tires are. Between my wife & myself we've had about 1 passenger tire blow out every 25 person-driving-years, one of which was a massive puncture w/the object embedded in the tire, and the other was upon hitting a thrown truck cap along I-5. Point being, random passenger tire blowouts are way rare w/out road hazard (even considering that I try to get full value out of at least the first two plies* ).
My suspicion is that truck tires are not yet (and may never be due to substantially lower mintages) up to passenger tire QC replicability. So internal stress redistribution may be spottier, heat buildup in localized areas of the tread/sidewall may be more uneven, etc. leading to random failures w/out road hazard interference. Also possible is that larger truck tires, servicing radically larger weight/contact-patch may suffer degredation in high impact pothole skipping and the like, that doesn't show from the outside but creates a weak spot leading to blowout.
Just my brain hitting some random potholes at high speed.

*Mighta exagerated a bit there about the second ply.
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Old 07-12-2005, 06:40 PM   #40
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Dale - I have Cooper CXMT 340A tires on the front of my coach. The rear are the original but the front ran low on air and were replaced. The Coopers are great as far as I am concerned. I couldn't ask for better handling and after about 8K mi there is no indication of wear.
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Old 07-12-2005, 08:32 PM   #41
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Steve,

What was your thought process in selecting the Cooper CXMT 340A tires on the front axle of your coach? How do they compare in wear and handling with the original Toyo M120Z tires? Are they steer tires or all position tires?

Thanks for the comments,

Dale
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Old 07-12-2005, 08:36 PM   #42
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OK, I've been outed, I'm a "tireman" .

Dale, I would only consider how and where you drive your Alpine or any coach. If you are not on many winding two lane roads, stay in RV parks that are mostly paved, I would not be afraid to put on a steer tire. The lower 32nd's help to eliminate the irregular wear, lower 32nds equals less tire squirm(come on Engineer Mike give me the technical term here ). The higher the 32nds the better chance for poor alingment, out of balance conditions, worn shocks ect. to cause uneven wear.

Engineer Mike, I'll claim ignorance as far as "CNC". Computer ?? You are right passenger tires are pretty much bullet proof. Now running down the to the first plys will only help you in the snow and ice. Even the Firestone re-call in 2000 was less than .5 in 100,000, if my memory is correct. But that's a subject I can talk about for hours, the campfire is out and everyone is in bed!! I 've never read stats on truck tire failures per thouusands of miles driven, I'll try to get some comparison numbers.

Any time a pothole is hit the tire should be removed from the rim and inspected.
There is a lot of money spent on research in building the correct tire for the application. Stick with a major brand and you won't go wrong.

I chose Bridgestone because of the relationships I have with representatives of the company, and of course the quality of the product.
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