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Old 05-26-2009, 02:22 PM   #1
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WRV files Dissolution

Per this link:

WESTERN RECREATIONAL VEHICLES, INC. DBA WESTERN RECREATIONALVEHICLES DELAWARE, INC.
UBI Number 602676995
Category
REG
Profit/Nonprofit
Profit
Active/Inactive
Inactive
State Of Incorporation DE
Date of Incorporation
12/14/2006
Expiration Date
12/31/2008
Dissolution Date
04/01/2009
Registered Agent Information
Agent Name
CORPORATION SERVICE COMPANY
Address
6500 HARBOUR HEIGHTS PKWY SUITE 400
City MUKILTEO
State
WA
ZIP 98275
Special Address Information
Address
City
State
Zip

Governing Persons
Title Name Address
Vice President FISH , RICHARD, YAKIMA , WA
Secretary
CIPRIANI , ANDREA, NEW YORK , NY
President
PRESSER , STEPHEN, NEW YORK , NY
Vice President
VON BURG , PHILLIP, NEW YORK , NY
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Old 05-28-2009, 12:00 AM   #2
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EMike,

Forgive my ignorance on this topic, but does this filing have an impact on the potential for us to recover costs from Monomoy if we have future problems with our steering box brackets?

Thanks!
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Old 05-28-2009, 12:20 AM   #3
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Cost recovery is speculative only at this point and based on assumptions about facts not yet in evidence. The company is/was a DE corporation doing business in WA and presumably in compliance w/laws of various states with dealers. Presumably WRV had manufacturer's liability insurance. The big question in my mind is whether DE corp dissolutions are immediate & conclusively absolve shareholders of liability; that isn't the case in AZ unless dissolved under BK court order (in AZ the assets/liabilities flow to the shareholders and any claims are pursued against shareholders for a period of ~5 years). If Monomoy can close the door this way, then there is no reason to either maintain such insurance or to have purchased the liability "tail" policy on diminishing liability from manufactured/sold products. If the ongoing assets/liabilities flow thru to shareholders, as in AZ, then Monomoy would have been smartly advised to purchase that liability tail.

My understanding is IF there is a NHTSA finding of a safety problem w/the steering bracket, NHTSA has a legal department that will then figure out what can/should be done regarding funding a fix. They will dope out the actual facts about who is who in the liability zoo. And their representative is aprised of the above. Did I add clarity?
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Old 05-28-2009, 10:35 AM   #4
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HUH?!

No, I do understand what you are saying. It will be interesting to follow these goings on. I think...
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Old 10-09-2009, 04:03 PM   #5
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I very recently discovered daybrosrvsales.com which shows 3 AC's. I understand they were purchased at auction from a dealer in Dalton, GA. I believe I know of some history re these units. When I called Day Bros I was also told an AC owner in their area had rec'd a letter from Allegro inviting him to a show and also saying Allegro was in the process of purchasing AC Is this the show at Lazydaz and has anyone heard of the "purchase" I didn't know ther was anything left to purchase. Waterdog4315
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Old 10-10-2009, 01:42 AM   #6
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Hmmmmmm, since the company is gone, gone, and gone some more. I believe whatever information is on that site is old.

Allegro is owned by Tiffin Coach works, Red Bay, AL, and Bob Tiffin is way smarter than that. I don't think he would be caught dead in an alpine coach, nor would he want the company, because all its assets were sold at auction and are gone. The family who started the company still owns the buildings and currently rumor has them under lease to a company making Truck Camper RV's and it's a Canadian company. The family wants nothing to do with WRV or Alpine/Alpinlite RV at all, if they had/did, they would have worked harder at keeping it in business.

As I understand it, they wanted to play golf and fly their planes instead of running the RV Company. He/they should not show up at any rallies, as some redneck might take matters into their own hands, this especially would be true, based on the copper brake lines on the last 150 odd coaches, and the steering bracket being a potential killer. But this is only my opinion, and does not hold any weight, but someone should point them out if they show up, I would spit in his face I believe, hoping he might take a swing at me.
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Old 10-10-2009, 01:24 PM   #7
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Waterdog,

I am sure that the coaches purchased in Dalton, Ga were from RV Motors. Jimmy Doyle, a great guy and no relation to the WRV founders, had a lot of Alpines and was trying to close his business. See ad in the ACA newsletter here.
http://www.alpinecoachassociation.co...ws-feb2008.pdf

It has been said that Tiffin wants to help us, Alpine owners in some way. I don't think that Tiffin would be interested in buying Alpine, as they already have a chassis available like Alpines and they have a good following with their own coaches now.

As I understand it, all of the material assets were sold by the bank, but I am pretty sure that Monomy , still owns the proprietary rights. This is all of the designs, patents, etc., some of the information (electrical, hydraulic, etc. diagrams, parts suppliers) that us owners would really like to have available to assist in future repairs. This can also be sold at some date, which I hope happens, as then we will have a source for technical information.

Monty,

I understand your frustration after buying a coach as complex as an Apex, with no factory support. While I would have liked to have seen a lot of things done differently, I would like to point out another view of the players.
I had the chance to meet Ron Doyle Sr. while camped in the WRV parking lot after rescuing our coach, when WRV failed. I found him to be a very nice man, who was very concerned about the failure of the company that he founded. At the time of the initial problems he had retired and turned the company over to his son, Ron Doyle Jr.

While I do feel that Jr could have been a better manager and handled many things differently, I will always give him credit for forming the diesel coach devision of WRV. Having done much research, before buying my first Alpine and again before buying this one, I am very aware of the complexities of diesel coaches, from chassis to house and all of the in-between. In doing many repairs, on my less than perfect coach and helping others, I have again seen the complexity of these coaches. I also didn't want to purchase one of the first few year of coaches produced, due to the learning curve involved in changing from a trailer manufacture to a diesel coach manufacture (inc their own chassis.) As can be attested to by the posts in this forum, the early coaches are not bad at all. Even with all of his failings, I am very grateful to Ron Doyle Jr. for assembling the team that designed the coach most of us love. As a closing note on Jr, he did show up at the "Home coming" rally right after WRV closed.

At the time WRV failed, Monomy Capital Partners had been running the company for a while. They were very interested in curing the failures of the past and raising the quality of production and service. They even understood the problem of having no one in the company that owned or used on of their coaches to provide user feedback and had hired me as an "owner consultant." From everything that I have heard, the quality of manufacturing and service was very good at the end. I am afraid that I missed out on that, just like you Monty.

Hopefully I will be back home when you come thru Las Vegas and we can get together for dinner to talk about all things RV.
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Old 10-11-2009, 12:31 AM   #8
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Dale,
You are correct in everything you say, and yet, I wish someone from management had done what you were doing, and owned one, to see the major amount of defects on the final product. I guess I am still angry about the copper brake line, and the steering bracket. Those two things alone we should never had to worry with. However, it took the Workhorse folks three years using NHTSA to get the recall going, so even if Alpine was still around, it might have been an uphill fight. And again, your thoughts on the complexities is also right on target. For instance, just the amount of electrical wire alone must be 1000 miles of it. How many feet of water line? and all the rest of it. EM says we should read the Country Coach forum on yahoo. Anything this complex, regardless of builder, which actually works, well mostly, is a marvel of engineering and production, to come to market at a price which many can afford. We did some research on MH's, but most of research was on 5th wheels, but again, if it can be made, we can figure out how to fix it.


Dale, if Monomoy owns the drawings, etc, can anyone get them to sort of share that through the ACA? Has anyone contacted them to start working out those issues? What would our first step be in the process? Does the ACA have a legal department, or is anyone a lawyer who might help us in this regard?

Concerning the patents, engineering diagrams, etc, someone said Ron's Brother owns the smartbed idea and patents, and licensed them to WRV, if that is the case, then the family still has some things. I also believe Ron and family own the property both the old site and the new site. I would like them to come back, because, there really are not that many good RV builders left, due to going out of business, etc. WRV made great 5th wheel trailers, truck campers, and not too many of those are left. Arctic Fox, Lance, and few others, but Lance and WRV's were the best.

I feel bad for Ron Doyle Senior, as I know how sad he must feel over the dream he brought to life in WRV, watching it go down. I believe that had they stayed with 5th wheels they would still be in business, because I don't think anyone made a better unit, and we owned one, and loved it. In fact we were going to buy a new bigger one, when WRV went under, and the price we got the MH for was too good to pass up, at the time.

Having users like all of us, we as a group can figure out what needs to be done, and just do it. For instance today, I changed the kitchen faucet, as it was leaking, most likely just road vibration caused it failure. The Right Seat Driver wants to get Huntington Brass to replace it under warranty, and I suppose I will try. We like the Moen one we used as a replacement. I also installed a safe, and added a couple of screws to the drawer guides under the closet so the weight of the clothes won't stress them out. I need to check the steering wheel nut, and shaft to figure out why mine feels loose. I know where to look; time is not on my side however. Also the exhaust brackets for the HH and Genset are on the list. I do feel good when I fix something and I know it's done correctly, because it won't need to be fixed again. This was especially true when the genset connections issue came to light. I jumped right on that one, and also the transfer switch connections. I am positive that those repairs, done by me, have saved us thousands of dollars and maybe even a fire, which could mean our lives. This forum is the reason for that and for that “thank you” will never be enough.

The things that WRV did correct:
A: Large fresh water and holding tanks, so you can boondock for a long time.

B: The choice of floor plans was much better than many manufacturers, as we like the floor plan in ours better than any other unit by anyone we have seen. We must have walked through over a hundred Country Coaches, several Holiday Rambler ones as well as many Winnebago’s and never found a floor plan we liked, but this 40 MDTS to us is the best we have seen. It just flows so well, at least for us.

C: Aside from the copper brake line and the steering bracket, the peak chassis is very good, and I believe stronger than the freightliner one, and some others around.

D: The Company used good components in it, the door for instance is strong, the Stove is good, and aside from our HH unit not providing hot enough water, the theory of it is good. Once I learn how to do its maintenance, I will feel better. Having a place to do the work is another thorn in my side, but next year, that is going to change, or the driveway here will be filled with this unit, when I want to work on something.

And, I really have nothing much to complain about, I have never owned my own business nor had one survive for almost 40 years. If I remember correctly, Ron Senior started making Truck Canopies, and then truck campers. I wish I had been able to let him know we had been looking at his 5th wheel trailers for as long as I can remember before we got one. And we loved it, it was great, the best quality for the money, bar none.

As almost everyone on this forum knows, when they work fine, we are happy, when they don’t, the grumbles come out. And, having this forum, at least for me, has saved me thousands of dollars because I can be somewhat proactive in fixing things others report as a problem. And being somewhat handy, and such, I can do a lot of the maintenance on the rig. Now I don’t know as I want to try to change the hydraulic fluid, but if I read the procedure correctly, it’s something I most likely could do, given a place and the time.

For instance, and why doing your own work has its benefits, I changed the oil in both cars yesterday, and for the Jeep, the dealer gave me a free one right after purchase. So at 3150 the dealer did the oil change, and it was coming up to do at 5750, but the weather was good, and that won’t last, so while I had to do the Crown Victoria anyway, I did the jeep as well. What, when I went to take the filter off, it was only barely hand tight, and I changed it 500 miles early, if I had waited, it might have fallen off, so it really pays to do as much work on your cars as you can, because you have personal interest in making sure it’s done correctly. The motorhome is going to be the same thing, as it’s just too expensive to have them serviced at the dealer all the time. I will do as much of this stuff as I can, if not, I hope I can learn from one of you or assist you in some of it, so when it my turn I will know how.

OK, enough long winded reply. Dale I hope we can also hook up in Las Vegas, as I am really looking forward to it.

I will let you know once we leave, and somewhat how the trip is going, and/or will send you a PM when we are close.

Thank you.
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