bought it as a 1998 but coming up as 1999 how do I find out?

[JAFORV2012]

got the VIN how do I find out what year MY PA vision is?

[emoney]

8th digit/letter from the right of the VIN shows the year.....at least of the chassis

[BFlinn181]

It is not unusual for the model year to be different than the VIN. Manufacturers buy chassis and then build the coach on as needed. Often a '03 will be on an '02 chassis. You can register it as the age of the coach, not the chassis. You will need the age of the chassis when ordering suspension and engine parts. Use the VIN of the chassis and the VIN of the manufacturer to find out for sure. It is unusual for the VIN to show as NEWER than the registration.

[Cat320]

In my state, the year on the title is the only one that matters.

[Old Bounder]

Originally Posted by JAFORV2012

got the VIN how do I find out what year MY PA vision is?

It's very simple on your Fleetwood PA. If you have the 460 V8 engine, it's a '98. If you have the V10, it's a '99.

Not many years would be that easily resolved.

[Mr_D]

Q & A’s on Split Model Years for Motorhomes

How is the manufacturing of motorhomes different from cars?

Motorhomes are “multi-stage vehicles.” This means that, unlike cars, they generally are built in two separate stages by two different manufacturers.

How is motorhome manufacturing divided into different stages?

The first-stage manufacturer, also called the “incomplete vehicle manufacturer,” assembles the motorhome chassis. This typically includes such components as the chassis frame, engine, fuel system, transmission, drive train, suspension, wheels, brakes and vehicular electrical system. These “incomplete vehicles” are then sold by the chassis manufacturer to final stage motorhome manufacturers, also called “completed vehicle manufacturers.” The motorhome manufacturers take the chassis and build the coach body, all of the “household” systems, install the appliances, cabinets, furnishings, plumbing, lighting fixtures and a multitude of various amenities, resulting in a completed vehicle.

How do first stage manufacturers identify their vehicles?

According to federal law, at 49 CFR 565.13(a), a vehicle manufactured in more than one stage must have a Vehicle Identification Number (“VIN”) assigned to it by the incomplete vehicle manufacturer. One character position in the VIN sequence identifies the model year of the incomplete vehicle. Once it is assigned, this VIN stays with the incomplete vehicle when it is sold to the motorhome manufacturer. The incomplete vehicle manufacturer may also ship the chassis with
“Manufacturer’s Certificate of Origin (“MCO”). This MCO document provides information about each particular chassis.

How do final stage manufacturers identify their vehicles?

Final stage motorhome manufacturers continue to use the VIN assigned by the incomplete vehicle manufacturer. Motorhome manufacturers also provide MCO documents with their motorhomes when they are shipped to dealers. The model year of the completed motorhome, which is determined by the motorhome manufacturer, appears on this MCO document.

Why do some chassis have a different model year than the completed motorhome?

An incomplete vehicle chassis is manufactured before a completed motorhome is built on it. Motorhome manufacturers may buy hundreds, even thousands, of chassis each year. Because of variations in advance purchases of incomplete vehicle chassis, the flow of new product orders, market conditions and new model roll-outs, the model year of the incomplete vehicle chassis is frequently different from the model year of the completed motorhome.

What are some examples of model year differences?

A group of fifty chassis could be built at the end of a calendar year and assigned that year’s model year by the incomplete vehicle manufacturer. A few weeks later, those chassis could be sold to a motorhome manufacturer. The motorhome manufacturer may use half of them to finish production of one motorhome make, assigning those motorhomes the motorhome manufacturer’s current model year on their final MCO’s. These completed motorhomes would have a model year one year greater than the model year of the chassis. The motorhome manufacturer may later use the other half of the chassis in manufacturing a new motorhome design, assigning those motorhomes the next model year. As a result, their final MCO’s would have a model year designation that is two years greater than the chassis model year. In another example, a chassis manufacturer may decide to skip a model year entirely and designate its chassis one year ahead of the then current calendar year. This could result in motorhomes having a model year one year less than the chassis model year.

Who decides what the “official” model year of the vehicle is?

The final stage motorhome manufacturer has authority to designate on the completed vehicle MCO the model year of the completed motorhome. See Federal Trade Commission Staff Opinion (March 5, 2001).

Is it permissible to have different model years for the chassis and completed motorhome?

Yes, it is permissible. The United States Federal Trade Commission (“FTC”) has directly addressed this very issue and determined in a formal staff opinion that it is NOT an unfair or deceptive trade practice for the completed motorhome and its chassis to have different model years. In recognition of the fact that the final stage motorhome manufacturer has the authority to designate the model year for motorhomes, the FTC has stated that the incomplete vehicle chassis manufacturer may use the phrase, “Model Year – Not Applicable” on the MCO’s for the incomplete vehicles it sends to final stage motorhome manufacturers, if
it so chooses. See Federal Trade Commission Staff Opinion (March 5, 2001).

Is the motorhome manufacturer required to disclose the difference between the model year of the incomplete vehicle and the model year of the incomplete chassis?

No. However, four states (California, Maryland, Michigan and Wisconsin) require dealers to inform purchasers of multi-stage vehicles of the difference between the model year of the incomplete vehicle chassis and the model year of the final stage motorhome.

What information is used by state DMV offices to register motorhomes?

When a consumer has a new motorhome registered for the first time, the state DMV will use both the VIN
assigned by the incomplete vehicle manufacturer and the model year and make assigned by the final stage
motorhome manufacturer for the vehicle registration. All states should title motorhomes using the model
year assigned by the final stage motorhome manufacturer.

What should I do if a state DMV registers a new motorhome with the chassis model year?

If a DMV employee insists on using the incomplete chassis model year, please call the Recreation Vehicle Industry Association at 703-620-6003 for assistance. Ask for the Government Affairs Department.

[Mr_D]

Originally Posted by loulong

It's very simple on your Fleetwood PA. If you have the 460 V8 engine, it's a '98. If you have the V10, it's a '99.

Not many years would be that easily resolved.

Unless ALL '98's were built on a the Ford chassis with 460 and ALL the '99's were built with the V-10 then it's not true.
I'm betting some '99's were built on the '98 chassis so they would be registered as '99's per the manufacturers MCO.

[Old Bounder]

Originally Posted by Mr_D

Unless ALL '98's were built on a the Ford chassis with 460 and ALL the '99's were built with the V-10 then it's not true.
I'm betting some '99's were built on the '98 chassis so they would be registered as '99's per the manufacturers MCO.

Another bet lost...... NO Fleetwood '99 coaches were made on the older F53-460-V8 Chassis. However, it is possible that the '98s might have been a mixed bag, but not the '99s.

If it's a V8, it's definitely a '98. If it's a V10, it could be a '98 or a '99.

[bob_5297]

I have a 98 p30 chassis and a 99 Fleetwood 34j. I was wondering the same thing till I watch a show explaining how motor homes were made in two different places and times.

[ga traveler]

Ford did not make a 1998 chassis. The 1997 chassis used the 460 engine. The 1998 year chassis was designated a 1999. I have a 1998 Pace Arrow motorhome. It was tag applied for as a 1998. When the tag and title came back it was reg. as a 1999. When I went to the Dealer show in Louisville, I asked Ford's head engineer why this happened. He said all There was no 1998 chassis. Ford decided to jump ahead to to a 1999 designated year in 98.

[Gary RVRoamer]

The 1998 year chassis was designated a 1999. I have a 1998 Pace Arrow motorhome. It was tag applied for as a 1998. When the tag and title came back it was reg. as a 1999.

Your tag/title is probably wrong, then. The chassis VIN year is NOT the controlling document. The original Manufacturers Certificate of Origin (MCO) sets the model year of the completed vehicle. No exceptions - it's federal law and all states comply (even though DMV clerks often get it wrong).

Call the coach manufacturer with the VIN handy. They will tell you what model year coach was built on that chassis. If necessary, they can issue a letter testifying to the correct model year so that you can get a tile corrected at the DMV.

[ga traveler]

Originally Posted by JAFORV2012

got the VIN how do I find out what year MY PA vision is?

The tenth digit of the VIN is the year. If you have a X in the tenth digit you have a 1999 chassis. You can go to the web and check Ford Vin numbers and see that this is correct. Remember this for the F53 chassis.

[ga traveler]

Originally Posted by Gary RVRoamer

Your tag/title is probably wrong, then. The chassis VIN year is NOT the controlling document. The original Manufacturers Certificate of Origin (MCO) sets the model year of the completed vehicle. No exceptions - it's federal law and all states comply (even though DMV clerks often get it wrong).

Call the coach manufacturer with the VIN handy. They will tell you what model year coach was built on that chassis. If necessary, they can issue a letter testifying to the correct model year so that you can get a tile corrected at the DMV.

Gary: You are correct. But so am I. Most of the time the problem we had with our customers was the so called split year. The chassis was a year older than the home. The MCO is the controlling document. However the state goes by the VIN automatically. You are right I could spend a day at the tag office and stand in three or four different lines and get it done. But every customer I had with the 98 Ford chassis just let it slide. It is not worth the trouble to change it. My insurance card does say 1998. When I started to explain to them They said they had already run into this dozens of times and knew all about it. I can tell you now his tenth digit is a X and they are going to tell him it is a 1999.

[Gary RVRoamer]

Whatever suits you, I guess. I would be concerned if my vehicle title was in error, but I guess in this case the error is in your favor, making the rig a year newer than it actually is. And when you sell it, is the title fraudulent because it describes a vehicle that is different than what you actually have?

My dog ain't in this fight, so do whatever you think is best.