Community Forums

computerguy · 10-11-2018, 11:41 AM

My original post was on the 2016 Bounder thread here
http://www.irv2.com/forums/f107/2016...ml#post4444229
There are some more details and how to fix it also.

After getting some messages and a follow up from Fleetwood Customer Service I thought it was important enough for ALL Fleetwood owners to be aware of this issue.

Fleetwood does not take any responsibility for this so be aware of this problem. Chances are you will find it after your one year warranty is up.

The problem is two fold. The flush mount windows are generally a tight fit into the cut out. If they are not installed properly and the outside frame is not pressed up against the outside fiberglass there is a water leak hazard. The water will follow window frame all the way down to the bottom of the window where it comes in contact with the wood interior skin behind the wall covering. Over time the wood will rot and grow mold.

Furthermore, when I called to inquire about this, they (FW Technical Service) asked me about the caulking that is supposed to be applied at the top of the windows. Well folks, NONE of my windows have caulking on top of them! Do yours? After I told them that they said there should be AND we will not cover this under warranty as you should have caulked them.

Read that paragraph again folks. They didn't do it from the factory and then expected me to know they SHOULD have had caulking!

We all know Fleetwood quality really is subpar but this takes it to a new level IMO. Just want the rest of the good folks on here to be aware and to check your own windows. If you have any soft spots in the wood below the windows you have this problem.

RRR · 10-11-2018, 12:36 PM

I saw this in your original post. Big thanks. I'll be checking mine today as I got it at the house for cleaning and washing.

Is the window to be sealed internally also, between the frame and the fiberglass? Seems as though just caulking the outside is a soon to be failure point.

Hope your repairs turn out good and with minimal damage.

computerguy · 10-11-2018, 01:13 PM

I found a HEHR flush/awning service manual online. There is no note of internal sealing/caulking.
From the manual:
"(D) Is the window installed correctly?
Radius windows are usually installed with an inside clamp ring. This part is screwed together with the
window frame, clamping the wall between them. The clamp rings vary, depending on the wall thickness
specified by the manufacturer of the vehicle. This wall thickness must accommodate the actual wall
materials, plus whatever sealant is used under the outside window flange. If the clamp ring used is too
thick, the window will not clamp tightly to the wall. When this happens, the flange seal can be easily
breached and a leak occurs."

SarahW · 10-11-2018, 04:01 PM

I hope you can get the wall fixed without too much hassle. That's just disgusting. Our 2012 Bounder has sliding windows that have not leaked so far (knock on woodgrained plastic). Of course the dual pane seals are starting to fail so some of them are cloudy.

Thanks for bringing this to the attention of other Bounder owners.

computerguy · 10-11-2018, 04:16 PM

Sarah,
The problem with this is is applies to ALL Fleetwood made RVs. It's the frameless awning type windows if not installed correctly could end up like this. That is is the main reason I made a whole new thread of it.
Sad. Even sadder was the reply from CS say I should have found it earlier.

RRR · 10-11-2018, 11:21 PM

Well there is no sign of any caulking on mine. Guess I'll ad it to the TDL and bump it towards the top.

How the heck is one to get caulking on the top of the seal with the metal hinge like piece maybe 3/16" from the wall? Just fill the gap up with caulk and keep doing such every time it shrinks?

So I'm guessing that the clamping ring should be checked for tightness all the way around too. Do you have the right voodoo chant to take the window valance off?

Your assessment of FW's CS is about the same as Ford. The only difference is the phone number you call and how they answer the phone.

Arizona · 10-12-2018, 01:50 AM

Complete failure to build an RV. The water that made it down the walls to the floor will start molding and rotting down there followed by dry rotting. I’d sell it within 5 years if in the meantime your not allergic to mold. I bought a new one in 1996 that was a POS, and another new one in 2006 that was great. If your not jaded by this experience try again.
Sorry to see those pics on a 2016!

Chief Alen · 10-12-2018, 02:22 AM

Mine has silly cone across the entire top of each window ... was wondering about that, not down the entire sides, just a inch or 2 around the edge .

computerguy · 10-12-2018, 12:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chief Alen

Mine has silly cone across the entire top of each window ... was wondering about that, not down the entire sides, just a inch or 2 around the edge .

Sounds like yours is done correctly. But, on a Newmar I would expect nothing but that.

computerguy · 10-12-2018, 12:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RRR

Well there is no sign of any caulking on mine. Guess I'll ad it to the TDL and bump it towards the top.

How the heck is one to get caulking on the top of the seal with the metal hinge like piece maybe 3/16" from the wall? Just fill the gap up with caulk and keep doing such every time it shrinks?

So I'm guessing that the clamping ring should be checked for tightness all the way around too. Do you have the right voodoo chant to take the window valance off?

Your assessment of FW's CS is about the same as Ford. The only difference is the phone number you call and how they answer the phone.

The valance on mine was easy. Keep in mind I had already removed the sides of the valance as I just didn't like the look. If I recall the sides had 2 or 3 screws on each side. Then the top is really easy to remove. There are 2 screws holding it to the cabinet above. Don't confuse the 2 screws with the 4 screws holding the shades to the valance. Those can be left alone.

The caulking may not be as much of an issue IF the window is installed correctly. If the flange on the outside is flush against the fiberglass on the outside you may be ok. Certainly wouldn't hurt to apply it.

I am still pretty angry with Fleetwood/REV Group that they would not offer to fix such a utter failure in the installation. But cest la vie. I will certainly let all that I can know about how this occurred and their failure to even offer to correct it. I'll be at the Tampa show in January and will voice my experience to any prospective customers.

RRR · 10-12-2018, 01:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by computerguy

The valance on mine was easy. Keep in mind I had already removed the sides of the valance as I just didn't like the look. If I recall the sides had 2 or 3 screws on each side. Then the top is really easy to remove. There are 2 screws holding it to the cabinet above. Don't confuse the 2 screws with the 4 screws holding the shades to the valance. Those can be left alone.

The caulking may not be as much of an issue IF the window is installed correctly. If the flange on the outside is flush against the fiberglass on the outside you may be ok. Certainly wouldn't hurt to apply it.

I am still pretty angry with Fleetwood/REV Group that they would not offer to fix such a utter failure in the installation. But cest la vie. I will certainly let all that I can know about how this occurred and their failure to even offer to correct it. I'll be at the Tampa show in January and will voice my experience to any prospective customers.

Thanks. Near as I can tell everything looks right. I'll play around with trying to get some caulk in the space on the top. Me and a caulking gun have a love-hate relationship. The harder I try to make it look good, the worse it gets.

Try not to get tossed at the show.

computerguy · 10-12-2018, 01:53 PM

LOL, no, would never get tossed out of anywhere. Just talking about my honest experience. If the customer decides NOT to buy a product based on honesty well then score one for honesty. I tell it the way it is. Remember Joe Friday from Dragnet, "Just the facts ma'am".

RRR · 10-13-2018, 09:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by computerguy

I found a HEHR flush/awning service manual online. There is no note of internal sealing/caulking.
From the manual:
"(D) Is the window installed correctly?
Radius windows are usually installed with an inside clamp ring. This part is screwed together with the
window frame, clamping the wall between them. The clamp rings vary, depending on the wall thickness
specified by the manufacturer of the vehicle. This wall thickness must accommodate the actual wall
materials, plus whatever sealant is used under the outside window flange. If the clamp ring used is too
thick, the window will not clamp tightly to the wall. When this happens, the flange seal can be easily
breached and a leak occurs."

Did you notice the part about the rough opening being 3/8 larger than the window? Wonder what you will find when you get the window out? Maybe FW will tell you that you should have caught that along with the missing caulk. Maybe if the rough opening is larger than spec that will force their hand on covering repairs. One can wish.

computerguy · 10-19-2018, 09:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RRR

Did you notice the part about the rough opening being 3/8 larger than the window? Wonder what you will find when you get the window out? Maybe FW will tell you that you should have caught that along with the missing caulk. Maybe if the rough opening is larger than spec that will force their hand on covering repairs. One can wish.

Mine does not have any gap like that. Chalk it up to just more incompetence in REV/Fleetwood construction practices.
They did send me another email today saying they are NOT covering this damage.
Luckily I am handy enough to fix it myself and it is no longer leaking. I will have the wood repaired and determine to paint or try and use the wall covering again. Looks like the wall covering is acting as a vapor barrier too. The insulation behind the wood is pretty lacking but I guess I should have known that anyway considering how warm that wall gets when facing the sun.