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Old 01-13-2017, 07:47 AM   #1
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Smoked my 02 Gulf Stream Country Club

Hoping there is someone out there with the same rig to help in identifying the 110 volt circuits on my new to me rig.

Yesterday was the first time on shore power, and when I reset a couple of tripped breakers, looking to get microwave working, huge amount of smoke came out from under the bed.

Of course I killed all the breakers and pulled the cable, opened the windows and vents to get the smoke and smell out of her.
First look at ATS and breaker panel show no visible damage, but I know there is something burnt. Only pulled cover on ATS, not panel yet.

It was working ok, on generator but unsure if the tripped breakers were off at the time.

So as my 110 panel has lots of breakers and a limited circuit map, I am hoping there is someone who knows what each of the breakers are suppose to control. If I have to try and track/trace every wire in the rig, that would be a very long time.
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Old 01-13-2017, 08:13 AM   #2
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First things first. Do you have a 30 amp or a 50 amp MH?

Did you use a volt meter to check the outlet you are plugging into?

If you plugged your unit into 240 volt socket, there is the problem that produced the smoke. Now the problem becomes how much damage was done and how to repair it.
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Old 01-13-2017, 08:54 AM   #3
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Sorry, it has the 50 amp shore power cord.
The outlet is my "old" 30 amp 220 plug, that I used with an adaptor to plug in the 50 amp.

Just to give an update. I went out pulled the panel cover, no signs of over heating in there or in the ATS. Started the main engine, to make sure I did not somehow fry the electronics, it started fine. Started the generator ( both are diesel ) with all breakers off. I could see a green light on the control board of the ATS, and pretty sure I heard a click about 20 seconds after startup. I shut everything down. Checked the bay where the convertor is, no sign of heat or smoke, the plug in "monitor" was showing a green light.

So as of right now, no "Smokin Gun ", but something made all that smoke.

Just checking is the 50 amp service not a 220 line split into two 110 circuits ?
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Old 01-13-2017, 09:23 AM   #4
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[QUOTE=TollerDP;3414779]Sorry, it has the 50 amp shore power cord.
The outlet is my "old" 30 amp 220 plug, that I used with an adaptor to plug in the 50 amp.

[QUOTE]

The second sentence above is your likely issue. A 30 amp RV outlet is not the same as a 30 amp 220V outlet for a clothes dryer or maybe a welder. A properly wired 30 amp RV outlet is 30 amp 110V...a hot, a neutral and a ground. Your 30 amp 220V outlet is a hot, hot and a ground. Using your 50 amp plug to a 30 amp adaptor basically put 110 volts on both the hot and the neutral wire going to the coach.

A 50 amp RV set up is two hot 110v lines, a neutral and a ground.
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Old 01-13-2017, 10:22 AM   #5
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Well, I feel completely like a fool. I pulled the panel off the shop panel to verify the wiring of the service plug. To my great surprise, my 30 amp 110 plug was wired to a 220 volt 20 amp breaker. Looks like I am off to Lowes to buy the proper setup for the new girl. Still no sign of what was actually doing the smoking, once I get the proper box and breaker installed I will go back to see what works and what does not.
THanks for making me stop, and look at the source power.
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Old 01-13-2017, 11:00 AM   #6
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If you plugged it into 220 the odds are you did a substantial amount of damage. any AC appliance that was plugged in has a good chance of being fried. Don't know where yours is located but possibly the smoke was from your inverter. This is probably not going to be cheap! Good luck.
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Old 01-13-2017, 03:07 PM   #7
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Nobody had the correct plug or breaker to put in my shop for the 50 amp service, but I did get the right 30 amp breaker to fit my panel.
With the proper wiring this time, I put the power onto the cord then went in and tried the breakers. None of the breakers tripped into a reset, a quick once around showed correct power, with my little plug in tester, at all the plugs I could reach.
The fridge responded to the power button, the micro wave did not.
Turned off shore power started the generator. All breakers held, and the green light came on at the ATS, which did not show while on shore power. PLugs all tested good again, fridge responded, micro did not.

So it looks like my little adventure put the micro wave out of comission and perhaps the auto switch. TO check that though I guess I have to be on shore power then start the genny and see if it switches.

The invertor seems to be working as while on generator I checked the coach batteries and they showed higher than with the generator off.

I still can not find anything burnt.
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Old 01-13-2017, 03:24 PM   #8
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microwaves have a fuse inside you might get lucky we had a microwave failed 1 year
and a 1 day
but they checked it and it was the fuse
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Old 01-13-2017, 04:54 PM   #9
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I would take the cover off the auto transfer switch and inspect the contacts and wires carefully. If all you fried was the ATS and maybe a fuse in the microwave, you got lucky.

Lowes sells a Swan 50 amp weather proof box with breakers and receptacle. You also need a 50 amp double pole breaker for the circuit panel feeding the box and the appropriate size wire.
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Old 01-14-2017, 03:42 AM   #10
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The 50 amp receptacle you need is the same as a 50 amp four wire range receptacle. You will need to install a neutral conductor to the receptacle from the distribution panel that will go to the flat blade terminal opposite side of the round equipment ground terminal.
Once you get power restored into the coach you should be able to better trouble shoot all the items killed. I have not seen any electrical conductors damaged from this mistake only all the components and appliances.
Good luck and keep us posted.
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Old 01-14-2017, 04:47 AM   #11
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I suspect the transfer switch is OK. Most, not all, will only become active when power is available from the generator. In other words the default de-energized state is closed contacts supplying shore power to the coach while power for the controller and the relay coils is taken from a hot leg coming from the generator.

Check the AC to DC converter/charger a bit deeper. Some generators have a DC charging output voltage to keep the starting battery charged which I think you might have been measuring. If the converter is working properly, with the generator off and on shore power, you should have in excess of 13VDC at the batteries which will indicate the converter is attempting to charge the batteries. Anything less and you will have problems maintaining a full battery charge. If the converter is under the bed near the AC breaker panel high probability the smoke you had came from it.

Other items that were not mentioned is the coach entertainment equipment. TV's, DVD players, satellite receiver and such. If any of these items were plugged in they may now be dead. With the situation you encountered, 120VAC on the AC neutral line, anything that was plugged in, microwave, converter, tv's and other electric/electronic devices, even if the device was turned off, might have sustained damaged. Many times beyond economic repair.

Next RV shopping trip pick up a surge suppressor that also checks for correct voltage, neutral and ground connections. If it doesn't like what it senses it will not apply power to the coach. They come in two general types, power cord end or hard wired.

What is also a concern is replacing the shop panel breaker and outlet but no mention of the wire between the two. Going from a 20 amp service to 50 you will need to also change the wire from the normal 12 gage for 20 amps to 8 or maybe 6 gage depending on the distance. If the day comes that you load up the circuit with a high amp demand there is some risk of overheating the wiring and the hazards associated with such.
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Old 01-14-2017, 05:07 AM   #12
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Both Lowes and Home Depot offer a 50 amp box with RV receptacle, some stores stock them or you can order and pick them up.

Sounds like you got lucky if you old fried your microwave. Good Luck
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Old 01-14-2017, 05:56 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TollerDP View Post

Sorry, it has the 50 amp shore power cord.

The outlet is my "old" 30 amp 220 plug, that I used with an adapter to plug in the 50 amp.

Just checking is the 50 amp service not a 220 line split into two 110 circuits ?
Quote:
Originally Posted by TollerDP View Post

Well, I feel completely like a fool. I pulled the panel off the shop panel to verify the wiring of the service plug. To my great surprise, my 30 amp 110 plug was wired to a 220 volt 20 amp breaker.
The two posts above that you made are confusing, conflicting and make NO sense to me.



Can your or someone on this thread explain exactly what has happened?

The top posts states that the outlet you had plugged into was a 220 VAC supply (which you wanted) and by using an adapter you were able to plug in your 50 amp shore cord.

The second posts states that after removing the panel, "To my great surprise, my 30 amp 110 plug was wired to a 220 volt 20 amp breaker.

Also, I don't think your microwave is located under your bed where ALL of the smoke was coming from so I'd be looking for some other damage besides the microwave not working.

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Old 01-14-2017, 06:41 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr4Film View Post
The two posts above that you made are confusing, conflicting and make NO sense to me.



Can your or someone on this thread explain exactly what has happened?

The top posts states that the outlet you had plugged into was a 220 VAC supply (which you wanted) and by using an adapter you were able to plug in your 50 amp shore cord.

The second posts states that after removing the panel, "To my great surprise, my 30 amp 110 plug was wired to a 220 volt 20 amp breaker.

Also, I don't think your microwave is located under your bed where ALL of the smoke was coming from so I'd be looking for some other damage besides the microwave not working.

Dr4Film ----- Richard

The OP's description was a bit confusing on first read but basically what occurred was the original setup might have looked like a standard camp site 30 amp outlet but unfortunately rather than a hot-neutral-ground configuration it had a hot-hot-ground which basically changed all the outlets from 120VAC to 220VAC. What isn't mentioned was the breaker is probably a double pole common trip which is the more common distribution setup 220VAC from standard USA residential utility service such as this example -



With an industrial application it is certainly possible to have a 220VAC single phase configuration but that will require really big transformer that will provide 220 single phase power such as this portable one -



Had a bunch of them when I was living in Australia which has 220VAC single phase residential power that I need to step down to 120VAC for all my USA made stuff. Regardless of the breaker size, 20 or 30 amp, the outcome would not have changed if the circuit was wired as I suspect, hot-hot-neutral. I am making a couple of presumptions based on filling in the blanks but it sure reads like an over volt situation.
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