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Old 05-13-2018, 08:38 AM   #1
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Country Coach questions

Greetings Country Coach folks.
I am a Monaco dweller and feel I know a fair amount about them, not everything though, that is for sure.

Our new to us Executive is awesome in so many ways but there are a couple issues that have me wondering about swapping out to another coach. Mostly paint and a longer couch.

Our short list is more or less Beaver, another Monaco, Country Coach or possibly American Heritage. All used, 2008 or older due to various reasons.

So we looked at several Country Coaches and love the outline, quality and paint quality, drivers seat, windshield, dash display, duel zone dash AC, front AC able to be ran with inverter... Getting a longer couch is easily found with many floor plans and obviously the Chassis is a high quality design.
We feel that CC did a nice job of many things but also wonder about other things.

One of my concerns is the commonly installed C13 Cat engine by comparison to our current DD feels way lethargic. I felt like my foot is pushing the power pedal through the floor to get it all rolling and even minor grades seem to challenge the power system a lot. Same gearing as our Monaco but with 10 more HP. Unloaded weight of the CC about 6000 lbs lighter than our loaded Monaco in the Intrigue and about the same weight unloaded in the Magna we drove.
Anyway, am I missing something here, should't more power, same gearing and about the same weight be zippier? Is it a get used to thing or just getting used to the smaller engine needing to spool the turbo longer to get results...? Once to highway speed (65-70) on level ground it was taking roughly 55%-65% power to maintain on flat ground, about 32PSI boost. Seems like a lot.
I also noticed the cooling fan runs faster and louder at idle than the DD or Cummins we had. I assume this is due to the increased turbo boost in the CAT needing more cooling air (about 45 PSI vrs about 27 PSI).

We also noticed MUCH more drumming or thumping over road bumps in the CC. I noticed the data plates require maximum tire inflation pressures in the CC vrs a loaded tire pressure. Can I assume that if we adjust the pressure to an actual loaded poundage/load chart that this ride would quite down a bunch? Running a 315 x 22.5 L tire at 130 PSI seems overkill to me.

We noticed very few AquaHot heater registers in the CC models. Curious how that works out when it is say 15 degrees out?
Our old Monaco had almost to many, the new one has not quite enough and the CC had fewer. Looking for input on that.

How does the fan heat system work in the bedroom while driving? I see a fan hi, off, low that blows air from under the bed but only runs when driving. How is that controlled and is it also part of the Aquahot system or totally independent?

2 of the 4 CC models we looked at had what looked like oil stains in the carpet mostly in the living room areas, is that indicative of engine work being done and just not being careful or more like, there is a lot of engine work going on...

My AquaHot experience has been with the larger tank models. The CC models have the smaller HydroHot systems. Anything to know between the two models other than the burner will obviously run more often but shorter duration?

I have read about the wet PTO issue so know to check for that.

I think to start off I would really like to hear from someone that has owned both a larger Cummins (550 or 600) or Series 60 Detroit and switched to the CAT C13 (or from the Cat to one of the others) to get a direct comparison in reality. Horsepower, road feel, fuel economy all tend to be very argumentative.

Sorry for the long read! I guess it is just my style
Thanks
Windecker
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Old 05-13-2018, 02:18 PM   #2
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I can't help with many of your questions but will offer some comments on the following:

Paint. CC used Sikkens paint and most of the CC's I have seen, the quality of their paint work was stellar. That said, they (like many manufacturers) got some fiberglass or filon that tended to develop checking, especially on darker colors. My coach has some of that.

Aqua Hot. While my Aqua Hot does well heating the coach, I do wonder why they did not add another heat exchanger in the living area. My coach is 42' and I have two registers in the back (one under bed and another under shower stall), and two up front....one near entry door and another under the galley. In really cold weather, we usually run a small electric heater up front to supplement.

From what I've read on various forums, your DD is heads above either a Cummins or CAT of that era. It really boils down to torque.
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Old 05-13-2018, 02:34 PM   #3
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As far as I know running the front roof air off the inverter/battery bank is an option. I don't have it. Needs a second 3000 watt inverter, larger or second alternator and 6 8D batteries rather than the 4 I have.
My ISX 650 at 60-62 runs about 35% power and 12psi boost (out of about 30 max) and gives me 7.6 mpg. Club members report lower mileage with their Cats. No idea about how they drive as I've never driven one with a Cat.
My CC owners manual cautions against running anything lower than what is on the Federal weight sticker and there is no reason to run anything less.
AquaHot 600D works OK but it does get cold in front with only two outlets in the front. I put a small electric heater there if needed.
What you are calling a "heater" in the bedroom is actually an OTR air conditioner for the bedroom.
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Old 05-14-2018, 11:29 AM   #4
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Perfect answers guys, thanks!
I was told that was a heater in the bedroom but AC makes more sense.

Yea curious about the heater registers also. I was hoping to add some in whatever we move to (if anything) rather than give some up. I think the 42 CC and 45 CC both had 3 less than our current Executive which is a lot IMO.

Not sure about the Series 60 being heads above the rest but am hoping to hear from someone that has owned both.

7.6 MPG is awesome, 1.6 better than my buddies Signature with the same engine and same driving speed. Wonder why so different? I know he uses cruise a lot, maybe that is the issue.

Thanks again.
Windecker
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Old 05-14-2018, 02:30 PM   #5
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I use cruise when ever I can which is most of the time. The 7.6 is over 49,500 miles although it did go down a little after the last top end job (dropped a valve in #6 for the second time). New ECM programming or new liners and pistons in 5 and 6 may have cost me a few .10's.
Last time out I reduced my tire pressure to actual weights and changed the SmartTire programming. Didn't notice any poor handling nor overheated tires so will probably leave it that way for now.
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Old 05-16-2018, 09:56 AM   #6
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Recently purchased our CC and the PO had the tire pressures set using loaded weights and the Smart Tire programmed for those pressures. No issues in ride or handling.

In my previous life (engineer) I designed heavy equipment and set tire pressures based on loaded vehicle weight.
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Old 05-16-2018, 12:41 PM   #7
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I recently left Henderson Line-Up which is what they did.
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Old 05-17-2018, 05:34 AM   #8
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I was thinking I read somewhere on this forum last year that Toyo and CC got into some trouble about some tire failure issues that were caused by a "miss" in the recommended pressures by one of them. Thinking it caused Toyo to get out of the "RV" industry so to speak.

If that is correct, I can totally see why CC recommends running at maximum pressure, it's a CYA policy.

My comfort zone is actual weights that I run, loaded, worst day case, use ref chart from tire manufacture, add roughly 5%, keep up with the weather changes with regards to pressures, check each trip.

But, I am no expert on truck tires!
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Old 05-17-2018, 08:41 AM   #9
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I was told by the service manager at Industrial Tires to buy temperate gun and to check the PSI. Optimal is 65 degrees.
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Old 05-17-2018, 08:49 AM   #10
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Tire temps will go way above 65 when driving. Maybe they meant 65 above ambient?
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Old 05-17-2018, 08:54 AM   #11
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For a while Toyo forbid it's dealers from putting their tires on a CC after there were more than several blowouts. As far as I can find out that letter is still in effect but dealers are ignoring it now. When I bought new tires in Nov 2016 the dealer offered Toyo 315/80's on my drive axle to save some money. Only Michelin makes the 365/70 tires my front and tag require.
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Old 05-17-2018, 12:26 PM   #12
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Had to be above ambient.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr_D View Post
Tire temps will go way above 65 when driving. Maybe they meant 65 above ambient?
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Old 05-17-2018, 12:36 PM   #13
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Regarding this CAT C13 performance question I started with, I will try this another way as it might appear offensive to those running the C13 and by no means did I mean it that way.

Every diesel engine I have owned has had a feel that you get used to and adapt to. Most of them felt sluggish till I learned how "that" particular engine responded.

My current new Ram with the Cummins 6.7 feels that way (sluggish) but when you step into it, the engine goes.

What I am asking is does this CAT C13 525 take time to get used to, does it actually "go" when you step on the pedal hard enough, or is is a bit "different" feeling than the Cummins and Detroit coaches I have owned and or driven?

I guess I had hoped someone who has owned both could chime in about the differences in performance.
It may be that the smaller engine just takes time to spool the turbo(s) thus has a bit more lag to it, not sure.

Thanks for any input.
Windecker
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Old 05-17-2018, 01:38 PM   #14
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Yes I understand more then 65 degrees when driving. I was thinking this would be about 7 AM. Thanks for making me a little more polished......
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