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Old 11-29-2019, 08:15 AM   #1
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No AC Power In Coach - Trouble Shooting Assistance Requested

Greetings all, Murphy bit us hard yesterday, we were just finishing up some food items to take to a friends home for Thanksgiving Dinner when all AC power in the coach died. I looked at the electrical control panel, the indicator showed 50 AMP power available, no circuit breakers were tripped and all were cool to the touch, but the inverter had shut off due to overload. I first thought we had lost power in the park, and that the indicator was lying but a check showed that we had power at the pedestal. I then did the following trouble shooting steps.

1, recycled the pedestal 50 amp breaker - no joy. Indicator showed AC power available after the 2+ minute delay for the surge protector and ATS to cycle.
2, disconnected shore power, turned on genset. Again the AC indicator showed 50 amp available but no AC power was available, i also noticed that the battery bank (4 large AGMs) was not charging.
3, next started engine, battery bank was charging at the normal level, 13.6/7 volts
4, did some research and suspicion focused on the surge protector and/or the transfer box. Opened bay door to gain access to both, on my 2005 Allure they are located side by side, cycled the shore power breakers and observed their operation. Every thing seemed normal, surge protector cycled as it should, transfer switch made no unusual sounds, both passed the nose test, no burnt electrical smell observed.
5, I pulled the cover off the circuit breaker panel inside the coach and checked the operation of the main 50 amp breaker,
it has power and supplied power to the sub breakers and when cycled off power was not observed at the sub breakers.

At this point I am out of ideas. Question:

1, does all of the AC power go through Inverter (Magnum 2812 installed by previous owner). After some research my DW suspects the inverter is the problem, my next step will be to go out to check its circuit breakers.
2,Given that I have power at the main 50 amp breaker does that eliminate the Surge Protector and ATS as the source of the problem?
3, as a stop gap does anyone see an issue with securing a large battery charger and keeping the house bank charged so we can run the hydro-hot heating system? We ran it all last night on our house batteries, they are now down to 12.2 volts, we are in N. VA and it will be below freezing tonight.


Howard
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Old 11-29-2019, 09:16 AM   #2
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If you have 120 volts at your main 50 amp breakers and you have 120 volts at your sub breakers then you will have power at your outlets. Your outlets are directly wired to your breakers.

Are both green LED's on your surge protector on and you hear the transfer switch when it switches to pedestal power? (I've had to jiggle my plug at the pedestal to get both phases connected properly with a worn out receptical) The pedestal power goes directly to your breaker panel after going through the transfer switch so a failed inverter/converter won't stop your AC power from reaching your breaker panel.
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Old 11-29-2019, 09:17 AM   #3
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How about the GFI'S?
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Old 11-29-2019, 09:21 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Guardsman View Post
Greetings all, Murphy bit us hard yesterday, we were just finishing up some food items to take to a friends home for Thanksgiving Dinner when all AC power in the coach died. I looked at the electrical control panel, the indicator showed 50 AMP power available, no circuit breakers were tripped and all were cool to the touch, but the inverter had shut off due to overload. I first thought we had lost power in the park, and that the indicator was lying but a check showed that we had power at the pedestal. I then did the following trouble shooting steps.

1, recycled the pedestal 50 amp breaker - no joy. Indicator showed AC power available after the 2+ minute delay for the surge protector and ATS to cycle.
2, disconnected shore power, turned on genset. Again the AC indicator showed 50 amp available but no AC power was available, i also noticed that the battery bank (4 large AGMs) was not charging.
3, next started engine, battery bank was charging at the normal level, 13.6/7 volts
4, did some research and suspicion focused on the surge protector and/or the transfer box. Opened bay door to gain access to both, on my 2005 Allure they are located side by side, cycled the shore power breakers and observed their operation. Every thing seemed normal, surge protector cycled as it should, transfer switch made no unusual sounds, both passed the nose test, no burnt electrical smell observed.
5, I pulled the cover off the circuit breaker panel inside the coach and checked the operation of the main 50 amp breaker,
it has power and supplied power to the sub breakers and when cycled off power was not observed at the sub breakers.

At this point I am out of ideas. Question:

1, does all of the AC power go through Inverter (Magnum 2812 installed by previous owner). After some research my DW suspects the inverter is the problem, my next step will be to go out to check its circuit breakers.
2,Given that I have power at the main 50 amp breaker does that eliminate the Surge Protector and ATS as the source of the problem?
3, as a stop gap does anyone see an issue with securing a large battery charger and keeping the house bank charged so we can run the hydro-hot heating system? We ran it all last night on our house batteries, they are now down to 12.2 volts, we are in N. VA and it will be below freezing tonight.


Howard

To answer your questions:


1. Yes. Check the inverter. From your description and the tests you've run, the inverter is the one common factor left that would account for your issue. Typically, AC from the post and generator go to the main panel (where you detect it), then to the inverter/converter and on to the sub panel. If you have no power at the sub panel main breaker, the interruption is at the inverter. There is likely a breaker in the sub panel labeled, "inverter." Be sure it has been cycled to ensure it is ON.


2. Yes.



3. Possibly. It's generally ok to use a separate charger to maintain the battery bank. Just be sure it provides enough charging amps to charge the bank and run the device drawing the amps. You are basically replacing your converter, which is part of the inverter combination, because the in-house one is not functioning. In addition, be sure the charger has a float or monitoring function so the batteries do not overcharge.


Before attempting the above, check out the inverter and look for tripped breakers on it.


You also have high amp 12v fuses/breakers from the battery bank. If one of those has tripped, the batteries will not charge from the inverter/converter but could still charge from the alternator. However, since you have no AC from shore or generator, the inverter is still the main suspect, IMO.
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Old 11-29-2019, 09:34 AM   #5
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How about the GFI'S?
x 2. Our GFCI will trip when the induction cooktop is turned off from 425 deg or higher cooking. We now work around by going from 425+ to 275 first, then shut it down.

Funny though, microwave has an equal max wattage but never trip it.
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Old 11-29-2019, 09:49 AM   #6
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You mentioned its cold. Did you happen to have a small electrical heater running? That and the microwave and some lighter draws will kick the inverter on some rigs. On mine it will. Check both the main button reset and the paddle breakers on the inverter. Best of luck
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Old 11-29-2019, 10:37 AM   #7
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Look for tripped breakers on the inverter. That's where you problem is.

Look hard on every side, they are lever type or push button type. They will be there.
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Old 11-29-2019, 12:04 PM   #8
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Thanks to all who responded so quickly to our request for trouble shooting assistance.

The inverter did have a tripped AC Input Circuit breaker. I reset it and life is good. My battery bank is recharging and the heat is on.

Reflecting on the event we realized that we had two 1KW Vornado heaters running, a 300 watt dehumidifier, a 300 watt air cleaner, and the convection oven all running at the same time, I believe the refrigerator kicked on and it was just too much for it to handle. The Magnum remote panel said " AC overload".

So once again the IRV2 Community saves the day or in our case the night as we will be warm this evening.


Howard
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Old 11-29-2019, 02:33 PM   #9
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On our Magnim 2800w inverter, when "AC Overload" happens, I have to do a master reset by pressing and holding down the little push button switch at the back for 15 seconds.
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Old 11-29-2019, 04:15 PM   #10
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Howard - Thanks for posting what you found out. Never know when a thread like this via search - will help another...

Best,
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Old 11-30-2019, 11:45 AM   #11
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When we have this problem it is either the GFCI in the bedroom or the circuit breakers located on the inverter behind that steel panel in the battery compartment.
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Old 11-30-2019, 11:59 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Guardsman View Post
Thanks to all who responded so quickly to our request for trouble shooting assistance.

The inverter did have a tripped AC Input Circuit breaker. I reset it and life is good. My battery bank is recharging and the heat is on.

Reflecting on the event we realized that we had two 1KW Vornado heaters running, a 300 watt dehumidifier, a 300 watt air cleaner, and the convection oven all running at the same time, I believe the refrigerator kicked on and it was just too much for it to handle. The Magnum remote panel said " AC overload".

So once again the IRV2 Community saves the day or in our case the night as we will be warm this evening.


Howard
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