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Old 12-13-2017, 04:11 PM   #1
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OAT coolant lab report.....panic mode

I just got my report from JG Lubricant labs on the sample of my OAT coolant. They say basically the stuff is shot, aluminum levels are severe (high), significant amount of magnetic precipitates. And, they say the flagged inhibitors are different that what should be present for coolant that is identified.

I had the drain, flush and fill with OAT done at a Cummins Coach Care shop. Actually, they did it twice since after the first effort, the coolant lost all its color within 1,000 miles. I suspected they did an incomplete flush and mixed the new OAT with the old PG coolant and it got diluted. So, they agreed to do it again with me paying for the new coolant. That was in January 2015 and less than 25,000 miles ago.

OAT should last longer than 3 years. We are leaving for a 3 month trip to Texas and beyond in two weeks so I guess I am going to try to get this stuff drained and redone. I know a coach is hard to do right so I am wondering if I can trust any Cummins shop to do a thorough flush and fill.
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Old 12-13-2017, 05:24 PM   #2
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Quote:
I know a coach is hard to do right so I am wondering if I can trust any Cummins shop to do a thorough flush and fill.
Why do you think it is hard to do? Any Competent service center should be able to do it if they take their time and follow the procedures outlined by the chassis and/or engine manufacturer. I've done two coaches, one a Cummins and the other a Caterpillar engine without problems. It does tank a lot of water to flush the system properly, and a procedure to ensure no air is trapped in the system.
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Old 12-13-2017, 05:45 PM   #3
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Hi Smlranger; By any chance was the OAT Coolant a Fleetguard product. I have read lots of Fleeetguards coolant spec. sheets that now I can't remember everything I read. This was sometime ago. I agree that the OAT should last at least 5 years. Have the Mopar OAT coolant in my Jeep Wrangles from the factory and they don't recommend changing in for 5 years or 100K miles. The new 2018 Jeep wrangler JL coolant recommendation is now up to 10 years or 100K or better. Had my coolant changed in my new to me 01 Windsor which has the ISC in it. I asked for the extended life coolant and they just put in the old H.D green stuff with no DCA added. Found out after 600 miles, I checked the coolant and the shop did not add one oz. of DCA. My engine was not protected. They gave me 5 pints of DCA to add for proper protection. I would contact Fleetguard if that is what was used and get some answers pronto! When I have my Windsor done next year I am going to use Fleetguard ES complete. A recommended coolant by Cummins. Sure hope you can get some answers. You, in my opinion, should not be footing the bill for this. Good luck!
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Old 12-13-2017, 07:21 PM   #4
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First I have heard an OAT going “bad”. Interesting but certainly concerning. Possibly a call to JG Lubricants (Tom?) for his take on the situation.

I will be following closely.

Brian

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Originally Posted by smlranger View Post
the flagged inhibitors are different that what should be present for coolant that is identified.
This is interesting - can they identify the inhibitors and types of coolants? There are two possible explanations - the coolant installed by the Cummins shop was "generic", or two the samples/results got mixed up at the lab. I lean towards the former....
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Old 12-13-2017, 07:42 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 8.3Oilbuner View Post
Hi Smlranger; By any chance was the OAT Coolant a Fleetguard product. I have read lots of Fleeetguards coolant spec. sheets that now I can't remember everything I read. This was sometime ago. I agree that the OAT should last at least 5 years. Have the Mopar OAT coolant in my Jeep Wrangles from the factory and they don't recommend changing in for 5 years or 100K miles. The new 2018 Jeep wrangler JL coolant recommendation is now up to 10 years or 100K or better. Had my coolant changed in my new to me 01 Windsor which has the ISC in it. I asked for the extended life coolant and they just put in the old H.D green stuff with no DCA added. Found out after 600 miles, I checked the coolant and the shop did not add one oz. of DCA. My engine was not protected. They gave me 5 pints of DCA to add for proper protection. I would contact Fleetguard if that is what was used and get some answers pronto! When I have my Windsor done next year I am going to use Fleetguard ES complete. A recommended coolant by Cummins. Sure hope you can get some answers. You, in my opinion, should not be footing the bill for this. Good luck!
The Cummins shop used Fleetguard Compleat ES OAT coolant. Now, when they did the first drain, flush and fill, the coolant turned amber color within the first 1,000 miles. I was concerned that they did not do a good flush and got the new OAT diluted with the old Fleetguard PG coolant. At the time, Fleetguard told me they had a problem with the red dye and that the coolant was OK. I had it tested and it tested weak so the Cummins shop agreed to drain it again, flush it, and refill with new OAT coolant. That was in Jan 2015.

I have been in touch with the Cummins shop who did the work and they are to get back to me.
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Old 12-13-2017, 10:15 PM   #6
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Interesting. I have had mine flushed and refilled with the EAS Compleat and the coolant color is bluish/greenish. If your changed colors, I'd think that they didn't get all the old stuff out.

You really can't depend on color to determine what coolant was used
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Old 12-14-2017, 04:38 AM   #7
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Coolant

I had the extended life put in my cat. Had to add to it in Canada and they had none of what was in there, so they put green.cat said it could cause gelling.had to flush again and went back with green.
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Old 12-14-2017, 12:34 PM   #8
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Unless Cummins is willing to change it out again for free, I would go somewhere else.

Fleetguards ES compleat has a great track record. Yep, you have to check your SCA’s every 10k miles. But not that difficult.

Good for you to have your fluids tested.
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Old 12-14-2017, 01:15 PM   #9
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I had the orange coolant changed to CAT red coolant this last spring. I think the tech said he had to run the engine for several hours to 'flush' the old coolant out. Not a DIY job for me!
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Old 12-14-2017, 01:19 PM   #10
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Originally Posted by BrianGlenn View Post
First I have heard an OAT going “bad”. Interesting but certainly concerning. Possibly a call to JG Lubricants (Tom?) for his take on the situation.

I will be following closely.

Brian

EDIT:


This is interesting - can they identify the inhibitors and types of coolants? There are two possible explanations - the coolant installed by the Cummins shop was "generic", or two the samples/results got mixed up at the lab. I lean towards the former....
I agree with Brian. My first call would be to the lab to discuss the report before jumping off the bridge.
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Old 12-15-2017, 09:41 AM   #11
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Does your coach have a Hydro Hot or an Aqua Hot? If so, it takes a lot of flushing to get all the old coolant out. On my Beaver I had to take the lines from the Hydro Hot off (both supply and return) and blow the old coolant out with low pressure air. I also did the same for the heater core that's all the way up front. I got all the old green stuff out and put in the new and the color (pink) has not changed in color at all. Marty
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Old 12-15-2017, 04:52 PM   #12
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I spoke to Tom Johnson at JG Labs. Tom says he is the oil expert and not the coolant but is going to have Emily (the coolant expert give me a call). His take on it is my best option is to drain, flush and refill. He even suggested that since the Fleetguard EG and PG coolants have such a great reputation, he might just have them go with one of those instead of using the OAT again. But, he said he is going to have Emily give me advice on that. Tom did suggest pulling a sample for analysis right after the refill to get a baseline then follow with another in a year.

As noted in the prior post, I know there is a lot of coolant in the loop to the Aqua Hot exchanger that is used for heating the Aqua Hot while underway and is also used as the engine block heater for cold weather starting. And, even more engine coolant in the long hoses to the front and the heater core. It would be great if I had the place and resources to do this myself but I don't so I have to rely on someone else. I am going to ask if they can disconnect one of the hoses that go to the front heater and use air to blow out the lines.

We are headed to Myrtle Beach, SC on 12/30 for a few days before we start toward Texas. I have an appointment at the Cummins shop in Loris, SC on Jan. 8 to do another drain, flush and fill. I used the last year for an issue with my DPF and I was impressed with their skill and diligence. They tell me they allow 6 hours to do a good flush and refill....more if there are issues.

As far as the high aluminum level (125 ppm) in the analysis, I do have one of the 'suspect' radiators used in CC's. However, I have seen no evidence of leaks in any of my cooling pack yet.
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Old 12-15-2017, 07:49 PM   #13
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OAT coolant lab report.....panic mode

When I flushed my 400ISL I removed the thermostat and reinstalled the housing. Each drain from the radiator only got about 5-6 gallons out. The first refill was with simply tap water and engine started and dash heater turned to full hot. Don’t forget to put passenger temp control to full hot as well. Redrain and fill with tap water. Engine run again with OTR heater in high. Redrain #2 and refill with distilled/RO (deionzed) water. Engine run again with heater in high. Final drain and fluid was simply water. Reinstalled new thermostat and filled with concentrated Fleetgaurd ES compleat EG. About 10 gallons concentrated should get you to about 55/45.

My manual stated entire system was about 26 gallons total capacity. I did originally add 13 gallons concentrated but the concentration was too high at 70/30 antifreeze. Drained 5 gallons out and put in 5 gallons water. Now about 55/45.

Aquahot circulation loop automatically circulates from high pressure to low pressure and is flushed with water each time engine is run.

Buy a refractometer.

Brian

EDIT. Correction. My last two refills were with deionized water. Forgot.
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Old 12-15-2017, 11:21 PM   #14
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I supposed I'm lucky, as the shop (Now closed.) I worked with on the change over to Final Charge, was more then willing to run up the shop hours following my instructions.

Drain. Add distilled water to full. Run engine with heater OT and HydroHot heaters on. Drain. And repeat three times. (I stopped at a grocery store, and bought all of the water they would need. 2 1/2 gallon bottles of distilled water for the process. We used 50/50 Final Charge, tested. And then topped of the radiator tank with just under 2 gallons of 100% Final Charge, based upon the testing.

While traveling, I carry 50/50 Final Charge, and will top off the radiator tank with this as needed.

Just had it tasted at OMC (Not a lab test, but using their normal testing gear.) and still looking good at this time.

If my memory is correct. This change over process I followed was posted by Brett Wolfe on RV.Net, several years ago.

And this has nothing to do with what SMLRANGER is working thru!!! Hope the next visit to Cummins works out well for you!! I posted it, in case it helps anyone els in the future.

Please keep us updated as you finish working thru this!!!

Note: I used Final Charge, after communicating with poster Spike45 on the Cummins section. Final Charge is readily available at most truck centers, such as Flying J. So if a problem occurs on the road, easy to come by.

Best to all,
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