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Old 04-18-2007, 12:50 PM   #1
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I am submitting this question because in our Holiday Rambler manual it says that the unit was manufactured by the Monaco Corp.

The coach is a 2002 HR vacationer; we have owned it for about 6 months....

Question 1. The AC in the main cabin runs but the air is not cold. After it runs for about 5 minutes I can hear the AC part kick in but the air is only slightly cold, possibly not even cold. Any ideas. The piece of foam in the grate is not clogged. Could the AC fluid have leaked out? Or what? Other possible defaults.

The AC in the bedroom throws out cold air so at least that part works.

Question 2. I thought that the two AC units would run independently. However, I found that if I switch off the AC breaker for the main cabin but leave bedroom breaker on to run the bedroom AC neither AC would run. This seems rather confusing to me.

Question 3. Dealing with the thermostat. When I use mode to select the AC unit I can't tell from the ˜blinking" number which unit the thermostat is referring to. For example, if on the thermostat the 1 stays on but 2 is blinking does that mean that AC unit 1 is on and AC unit 2 is off?

While I received a manual and other system information items, there is no specific discussion on specifically to select the AC unit.

Thanks, HEMI
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Old 04-18-2007, 12:50 PM   #2
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I am submitting this question because in our Holiday Rambler manual it says that the unit was manufactured by the Monaco Corp.

The coach is a 2002 HR vacationer; we have owned it for about 6 months....

Question 1. The AC in the main cabin runs but the air is not cold. After it runs for about 5 minutes I can hear the AC part kick in but the air is only slightly cold, possibly not even cold. Any ideas. The piece of foam in the grate is not clogged. Could the AC fluid have leaked out? Or what? Other possible defaults.

The AC in the bedroom throws out cold air so at least that part works.

Question 2. I thought that the two AC units would run independently. However, I found that if I switch off the AC breaker for the main cabin but leave bedroom breaker on to run the bedroom AC neither AC would run. This seems rather confusing to me.

Question 3. Dealing with the thermostat. When I use mode to select the AC unit I can't tell from the ˜blinking" number which unit the thermostat is referring to. For example, if on the thermostat the 1 stays on but 2 is blinking does that mean that AC unit 1 is on and AC unit 2 is off?

While I received a manual and other system information items, there is no specific discussion on specifically to select the AC unit.

Thanks, HEMI
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Old 04-18-2007, 02:21 PM   #3
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The "zone" number that is blinking after you select mode is the zone that you can change the settings on at that point. There is a description of the functions in the coach manual.

The A/C blower starts up then it waits for a bit before starting the compressor. This is normal. The wait is to allow the head pressure on the compressor to dissapate before restarting the compressor. Another idiosyncrasy is that the A/Cs will not start up if heat is selected in any of the three zones. I almost took the coach in for service once then discovered by reading the manual that no a/c with heat on anywhere is normal. At least that's the way our 04 Imperial works.
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Old 04-18-2007, 05:11 PM   #4
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Thanks, I will go to the RV tomorrow morning to make sure that heat is not selected anywhere on the thermostat. So to understand what you said, when I do mode and then to heat I need to make sure that the heat is not selected for either zone (my system has two zones). I am almost certain that the heat on either unit is not selected.

One other question. It seems that I have to have the circuit breakers on for both ACs to get the rear AC to work. I know that the rear AC provides cold air during the brief time it was on .... however the whole system shut down because at present I only have a 20 amp service from my house and thus after a few minutes the home circuit breaker clicked because both the front and rear ACs were running even though the front AC was not producing cold air.

Again, thanks, HEMI
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Old 04-18-2007, 07:24 PM   #5
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Hemi.....The two A/C's are connected together via the thermostat. You may be disabling both A/C's when you shut off power to one of them.

Go to your mode button and press it once to activate it. Whichever number is blinking is the one that you're setting. Make sure that you are setting it to cool, not heat pump. Once it's set to cool, set the temp and then set how you want the fan to run, High, Low, Auto.

Now switch to the other unit and set it. Give the units a few miutes to start and then a chance to cool. If one of them doesn't cool it may need service.

Good Luck
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Old 04-19-2007, 10:32 AM   #6
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Looking through HR archives, in order to have two AC's, you have to have the 50 Amp service and an Elect. Management System. If you are plugged into 20 amp circuit, it will not run both AC units at the same time. The EMS probably allowed you to run one of them and only the fan to operate on the other one at the same time. Zone 1, is the front/living area and zone two is the rear/sleeping area.
If the #1 is blinking, you are setting the system in the front of the coach. If #2 is blinking, you are setting the unit in the rear. Both MAY work on a 30 Amp, but the EMS will probably shed one unit and only allow fan to run on the one it cuts power to. Both will run at the same time with 50 amp if they are both in operating condition.

You may want to get any of the archived material you want/need now as the 2002 stuff will probably not be there (online) next year.
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Old 04-19-2007, 11:04 AM   #7
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To amplify what SacsTC said:

I just purchased my HR Endeavor 3 weeks ago, but I have had two different Class A's from Winnebago before. In my prior experience, two A/C's running at the same time pulled 22 amps according to my EMS unit, giving you 8 amps of extra capacity for a 30 amp service. There are many times when I ran both A/C's in Arizona, in the summertime, on 30 amp service, without any problem. The EMS unit would drop out one of the compressors if the demand exceeded 30 amps, like when DW used the microwave, and then restart the compressor when the demand dropped.

Now, I am getting conflicting views from my HR service people. They state that the "official" HR position is that you cannot run 2 A/C's off of 30 amp service. However, they also admitted that it was entirely possible run both off of 30 amp service and the EMS unit would perform like my Winnie's did. The other day, I checked and I was pulling 23 amps with both A/C's running, which indicates all should work okay. However, I did read somewhere (owner's manual??) that there is a voluntary RV industry adherence to an 80% rule, that is, the EMS unit will start shutting down systems when 80% of the capacity is reached - Which in the case of 30 amp service would be 24 amps. So, it is really borderline when trying to run both A/C's on 30 amp service. I'll let everyone know when I return to Arizona this June!
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Old 04-20-2007, 02:57 PM   #8
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Wayne and others, thanks for all your input.

I am pretty much convinced that my no. 1 AC unit (front unit) is faulty; my no 2 (bedroom) provides plenty of cold air. I had been running on my house 20 amp service and with both AC turned on the amp panel read 22-23 amp, the same as Waynelee mentioned.

Yet I thought possibly that the 20 amp from my house could still be cutting out my no. 1. So I started the generator which puts out 30 amp.

Still no. 1 would throw out cold air while I could hear the compressor come on (and possibly it was recycling on and off--I may have to get on the roof to confirm) but yet no cold air.

I guess I will have to take in the RV for AC service. I suppose in the worst case the unit will have to be replaced. Any ideas on the approximate cost? Or would I be lucky in that possibly a electronics board or similar has failed? The system is Duo Therm.

Thanks, HEMI
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Old 04-21-2007, 05:03 AM   #9
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Hi Hemi -

Welcome to irv2 We're really glad to have you here as a new member and are looking forward to reading your posts about your RVing experiences and adventures. You'll find a great bunch of folks on this site who are very knowledgeable of RVing, the rigs we use, and the places we go in them. Enjoy the forums and post often, and when you want to be a official member of the forum let me know.

Sounds like some good advise about what to check for not cooling. Is it a heatpump, and if so does AC #1 provide heat? Can you remove the grate and look up in there to see if there is a other blockage or insulation in the way? How about maybe some big airleaks?

Yes, you probably can run both AC's on 30amps at once. The problems arise when the compressor(s) kick in, they draw a lot of amps and if both AC's are running and compressors kick on at the same time, you will draw much more than the 30amps. All that said, I understand there are some EMS systems that will cycle the compressors independently, while still allowing both fans to run, which seems like a great idea to me.

Good luck and let us know how it goes.
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Old 05-22-2007, 08:29 PM   #10
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Well, to revive this thread and answer a few questions raised, here are my observations of the EMS and A/C question after taking my Endeavor out for a couple of 3 day weekends.

I was hooked up in a campground that only offered 30 amp service. Also, I use a 30 amp Autoformer to ensure good, clean power. Trying as hard as I could, I was not successful getting both A/C units to run at the same time.

According to my EMS panel, I was pulling 22 amps with the front A/C running. After I shut down the front A/C, the EMS registered a constant 7 amp load. So, the front A/C draws 15 amps under continuous running condition, a little more than my previous experiences with my two Winnebagos.

BUT, I could not determine where my coach was using the 7 amp constant load and it appeared that the load was spread out between all the items running including the satellite dish, TV, inverter, etc.

So, if these two weekends are indicator of my actual power usage, I cannot run both A/C units on 30 amp service. Even if I could curtail the items that were using the 7 amp load, the two A/C's running at 15 amps each, would exceed the 30 amp service level.

So, now I need to order a 50 amp Autoformer and look for 50 amp campground service in the hot areas I travel, like Arizona in the summer.
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Old 05-23-2007, 08:26 AM   #11
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The only time I can remember trying to run both units at the same time on a 30 amp service, we were running both heat pumps. They were both running and, not paying much attention, I realized a little later that the rear one had shut off and the rear furnace was running instead.
Evidently the EMS had shed the rear heat pump, so the furnace took over. Even after shutting off the front one in order to test whether the rear was defective, we could not get it to operate. When we got home, (also 30 amp), we decided to try it with generator on to see if rear was defective.
Apparently, by running generator, the EMS reset and both heat pumps were working fine. Have had no problem since.



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Old 05-23-2007, 11:58 AM   #12
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Hemi,

As stated in the above posts, your 20 amp service will run a single ac unit. Your generator will operate both.

Both are operated from the single thermostat, zone 1 is the front and zone 2 is the back. Pressing the zone button will switch between the two zones, and both need to be programmed to function independently of each other. You will need to select heat or a/c (for the vacationer) along with the temperature for both zones. A fan only mode (I think) is an available selection. Make sure you have selected a/c for this application for both.

I have experienced a similar situation with the delayed compressor startup, but always get cold air within that initial 5 minute period.

Check your power management panel. It should show that power is available to both a/c's, provided sufficient power is coming into the coach.

I would check one more time for power at the panel, verify both zones are set on a/c and the temperature is set where the air will kick on.

Good luck.
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Old 05-24-2007, 11:55 AM   #13
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try running ac with the gen. if thy work you will know there is nothing roung with the ac
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Old 05-26-2007, 03:03 PM   #14
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The EMS in our 04 Imperial will hold at 30a but if it goes over it will start shutting things off. I am able to hold both A/Cs on and draw 28a. This is contingent on the voltage remaining over 115, when it drops the amperage draw goes over 30a and stuff shuts down. My take is that if you have solid 30a that will hold 115-120v you should be able to run both A/Cs. You must have other A/Cs devices off and allow the inverter/converter to charge your batts first.
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