Community Forums

dennis46c · 04-10-2014, 05:38 AM

I have a HR Endeavor 40' SKQ with a 400hp ISL engine. I changes both filters, primed it by turning the part way about 15 times but nothing. The engine turns over but no indication it will start. This is the 3rd year we've changed them ourselves and the first year with a problem.

We do pre-fill the filters using a center plug on the secondary. After the first attempt, I redid everything using my back-up filters, I noticed on the secondary the filter was filled all the way, I believe in the past the fuel flowed into the center. THis time I made sure there the entire filter was full. Still no luck.

I have Cummins mobile service coming out tomorrow morning but I'm still hoping to get it to start up to save a big expense. Any ideas? Can I "over-prime" it, meaning turn the key to the first position, listen for the clicks and after 10 seconds or so, turn it off and repeat? Will it damage anything if I do it too many times?

Thanks,

Dennis

Mike Canter · 04-10-2014, 08:08 AM

The only way you can hurt anything is to overheat the starter. Normally you can turn the starter for twenty seconds at a time then stop for thirty seconds. You can do that for about three times then you need to let it cool down for about ten minutes before trying it again. Are you turning the motor over long enough. Try holding the key to start for twenty seconds. Check the old filters and make sure the old rubber oring gaskets came off with the old filter. Sometimes they stay on the motor and cause an air leak when you screw on the new filter. If that is all good and trying to start it while cranking for twenty seconds several times then wait until the mobile service comes. Let us know what he finds and how he starts it.

walt2137 · 04-10-2014, 10:49 AM

Dennis one thing you might try the next filter change is change one filter at a time then start the engine run a couple minutes then change the other, you are not going to hurt the fuel pump by cycling it.

brobox · 04-10-2014, 10:53 AM

I had the same thing happen once. Walked away for about 1/2 an hour came back, did all the primes again and it fired up. Make sure your filter are tight and not sucking air. Did you oil the gaskets before you put the filters on? If they are dry they could be sucking air instead of fuel.

Philliec · 04-10-2014, 11:13 AM

We had the same problem with the mechanic and he said that was normal. As stated we cranked 20 seconds and then off for the rest of the minute. After about 10-15 minutes it cranked over. Our mechanic does not believe in pre filling. He feels that the chance to introduce dirt and contaminants outweighs the extra trouble to start.

chboone · 04-10-2014, 11:15 AM

Use to do this on large CAT and Cummins generators when we serviced them. Have someone crank the engine while pumping the priming pump as fast as you can. If it doesn't start the first time let the starter cool for a little while. Do the same routine again, should start the first time sometimes it takes twice. Always worked on CAT 12 cylinder and Cummins 6 and 12 cylinder engines.

Chuck

YC1 · 04-10-2014, 03:41 PM

No priming pump on this model I believe.

Pour some filtered fuel into a clean container.
Clean the top of the filter that is in the right rear. Clean it spotless with soap and water. Remove the Allen screws in the top of the mount and fill with your turkey baster or whatever works for you.

I have had a devil of a time getting mine to start without pre-filling. I always do one at a time now as well.

96 Wideglide · 04-10-2014, 07:23 PM

Mine fired right up after pre-filling each of the filters, one at a time, so dont know if this works or not, but was the method I was going to use if it did'nt.
Read on this forum that turning the key from off to on, runs the fuel pump for about 5-10 seconds. Crank the engine for a few seconds, then just return the key to the on position, and the fuel pump runs for about 30 seconds. Sounds like the second method has a better chance of purging any air out of your system.

walt2137 · 04-10-2014, 07:32 PM

I pre fill my primary filters by putting a plug in the middle threaded part of the filter with a nipple then fill through the outside holes only ( that filters the fuel) install start the engine run for a couple minutes, with the secondary i could pre fill or use the fuel pump to fill the filter. Works for me.

ardbark · 04-11-2014, 09:03 AM

Last time I changed filters mine wouldn't fire either. I had a friend crank the engine while I cracked open one of the injector lines, essentially bleeding the system. A small mist of fuel will port out, along with whatever air is in the system. When the engine catches tighten the B-Nut back up and away you go.

Maybe a bit messy, but it works.

Good luck

dennis46c · 04-13-2014, 05:17 PM

Thanks for all the great input. The tech showed up, he dropped both filters and they were low, he topped them off and after priming and cranking for around 10 to 15 seconds 4-5 times, heard a strange sound from the engine and then it came to life. I had also dropped the filters and topped them off before calling for service but guess I wasn't cranking long enough. He said it appeared some fuel was sucked in but not enough. He had actually given up and was going to call the shop to see if the rail should be field serviced when he decided to crank it over one more time. He even said he was ready to turn it off just before it started up. He did suggest the next time I have it in a shop to have them check the lift pressure, his guess is it may be a little low resulting in a hard time overcoming the little air that entered the system.

Again, thanks to everyone that took the time to respond, great suggestions and I learn more every time I read the responses to questions in this forum.

Dennis

YC1 · 04-13-2014, 06:09 PM

Dennis, there has been several long threads on this subject. We have the exact same model. IF you took your time getting the new filters on, especially if you removed both at the same time, then fuel could have run back to the tank and really let a lot of air in the line. Next time try filling the new filter and place it close by in something to hold it upright. Then do a quick R&R and the cycling of the key before trying to start. Do one filter at a time.

JDL · 04-13-2014, 06:26 PM

I do one filter at a time, however I do not prefill. I put the controls on rear, and cycle the electric lift pump four or five times before I start the crank cycle. I haven't had to use more than two crank cycles for filter changes so far. I have done this 5 times with no issues.