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04-28-2017, 11:21 PM
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#1
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Member
Join Date: Apr 2017
Posts: 52
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Fuel Filters to fill or not to fill?
Going to change the primary and secondary fuel filters on the old2000 Windsor (1999 engine) in the morning, and am finding conflicting opinions to fill or not to fill the filters with clean fuel before installation. I have always filled the filters on most other diesel engines so why not the 8.3 isc? Oh by the way what order would you change then primary first or vise a versa?
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04-28-2017, 11:36 PM
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#2
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Senior Member
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 2,947
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I do it
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Perry & Julie: 2008 Monaco Camelot 40PDQ, 400ISL, Toad; 2015 Chevy Equinox.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
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04-29-2017, 12:10 AM
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#3
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Senior Member
Tiffin Owners Club Freightliner Owners Club
Join Date: May 2015
Posts: 115
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Fill um up.
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04-29-2017, 01:51 AM
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#4
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Senior Member
Monaco Owners Club Vintage RV Owners Club
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: anywhere U.S.A, Currently back home in Thailand!
Posts: 4,245
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I have never understood why, other than the filter sitting sideways, you would not fill it up? Why would you make your lift pump do it when it is so easy to fill and screw it on? Fill it! Rail!
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Retired, and "Always on Holiday!"
1996 Monaco Windsor 38PB, "Mona" 275 HP., 8.3 Cummins, 3060 Allison 6 speed, 2001 PT Cruiser, "Bailey"
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04-29-2017, 04:25 AM
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#5
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2014
Posts: 35,317
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Quote:
Originally Posted by guardrail53
I have never understood why, other than the filter sitting sideways, you would not fill it up? Why would you make your lift pump do it when it is so easy to fill and screw it on? Fill it! Rail!
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To help you understand, the manufactures don't recommend filling them, because they don't want unfiltered fuel poured in them.
I suppose there has been instances where someone got some dirty fuel, or container, and filled the filter. The dirt went directly to the injectors and ruined them.
I once watched a mechanic, in our shop, fill the new filter with the fuel from the old one. Ugggh.
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04-29-2017, 05:29 AM
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#6
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2016
Posts: 2,186
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You can fill them , just us clean diesel and pour it into the small holes
not the center hole this way it still gets filtered .
To make it a little easier get a threaded plastic pipe nipple that will screw
into the center hole then pour away .
Some people and shops fill them with transmission oil , its clean and quick .
Ray
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04-29-2017, 05:43 AM
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#7
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: FL
Posts: 11,385
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I don't car what my manual says. Mine will not run without filling them. I think the routing of my hoses lets so much fuel drain back into the tank that it cannot overcome that. Just my humble opinion. I have considered installing a check valve but it is easy to pr-fill them and then they take right off.
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Certified Senior Electronic Technician, Telecommunications Engineer, Telecommunications repair Service Center Owner, Original owner HR 2008
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04-29-2017, 05:53 AM
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#8
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Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Ottawa Ontario Canada
Posts: 1,260
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The lift pump, also called the transfer pump, (12 volt pump, now mostly located in the fuel tank) runs for about 15 seconds when you turn the key to pump the fuel up to the filters. When you start to crank the engine, then the mechanical fuel pump takes over and the electric lift pump is no longer running.
Change your (one or two) filters and then turn your key on and off five times then you can check your second fuel filter should be mostly full. (That is how you test your lift pump is working) You can actually hear that pump.. This way, no fuel goes into injectors unfiltered. Engine should then start normally, (with maybe more cranking than usual).
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DanielB
Looking for small Class C, sold Newmar MADP
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04-29-2017, 05:57 AM
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#9
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Senior Member
Monaco Owners Club
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 1,496
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Fill it up
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Del & Lori 2007 Diplomat 40PDQ - 2020 Grand Cherokee TrailHawk Hemi Toad, M&G Brake System, Blue Ox.
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04-29-2017, 06:02 AM
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#10
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2014
Posts: 35,317
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Do as you have been doing, but if your system can not fill the filters with the lift pump, there is an air leak in the plumbing before the pump or the pump is weak.
It's simple science. The pump creates a negative pressure. Something has to move towards it. Air is easier to move then fuel. Lift height can effect it but not distance.
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04-29-2017, 06:55 AM
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#11
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Senior Member
Monaco Owners Club
Join Date: Feb 2016
Posts: 1,051
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HHIDan
The lift pump, also called the transfer pump, (12 volt pump, now mostly located in the fuel tank) runs for about 15 seconds when you turn the key to pump the fuel up to the filters. When you start to crank the engine, then the mechanical fuel pump takes over and the electric lift pump is no longer running.
Change your (one or two) filters and then turn your key on and off five times then you can check your second fuel filter should be mostly full. (That is how you test your lift pump is working) You can actually hear that pump.. This way, no fuel goes into injectors unfiltered. Engine should then start normally, (with maybe more cranking than usual).
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I am fairly certain your lift pump runs continuously after the engine starts. It is my understanding that if the lift pump malfunctions and the injection pump has to draw the fuel itself it can cause significant damage. I understand that some lift pumps may cycle off when the engine is not running and the key in is the run position. Mine runs continuously regardless of whether the engine is running or not.
I always fill my filters with diesel. I have read where some just cycle the key and let the lift pump fill the filters but there is air in the filters. Where does this air go? If you leave the filter loose so the air can bleed off while the filter fills with fuel then that would make more sense to me. I just did not want that air traveling though my injector pump. I was a heavy equipment mechanic for 12 years and have changed hundreds of fuel filters and I always filled them first unless they had a hand/primer pump on the filter housing. All the ones that had a hand/primer pump also had an air bleed at the top.
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04-29-2017, 06:58 AM
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#12
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Moderator Emeritus
Newmar Owners Club
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Southern Indiana
Posts: 19,417
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Fuel Filters to fill or not to fill?
I follow the manual which states to install dry. Our ISL has the electric lift pump so just cycle the key a few times (per the manual) and filter is filled. So far I have not had any problems doing this.
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Steve
2002 Newmar Mountain Aire 4095
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04-29-2017, 07:56 AM
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#13
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Moderator Emeritus
Monaco Owners Club Texas Boomers Club
Join Date: Nov 2015
Location: Central Texas
Posts: 13,426
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I don't prefill. I turn the key on and let the lift pump run several times before starting the coach. It always starts right up after that.
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Dennis and Katherine
2000 Monaco Dynasty
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04-29-2017, 08:15 AM
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#14
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Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 7,383
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Chicken or egg--don't know whether lift pump runs continuously or not, but it does shut-off after approx. 15 seconds if you don't start engine. I only have one filter on my 03 ISL 400. My filter mount has a set-screw vent on top so I can vent trapped air. Once pressure to injector pump is attained, lift pump recirculates fuel back to tank so any trapped air is simply returned to tank. IMHO--prefilling a filter creates opportunity for contamination--14 years and 170,000 miles, never had an issue with using lift pump to fill filter.
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Old Scout
2015 IH45 Foretravel
2003 Alpine 40' MDTS [Sold]
New Braunfels, Texas
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