Community Forums

LeRoi2 · 05-09-2016, 12:52 AM

I saw the same ad you mention on Craigslist for 6 Trojan GC batteries, supposedly brand new, marked 2/16, for $520.

The lowest price I have seen these in this market is $140 each, or about $840, for 6. When something is that much different in price, my suspicion is that it is not an apples to oranges comparison.

Those batteries may have been manufactured in 2/16, but if they were installed or maintained incorrectly, over discharged, or allowed to totally discharge, there lifetime use has been dramatically shortened. Why would anyone sell Trojan Batteries in this market, 60% less?

If you bought them, let us know how they work out.

ereadingrv · 05-09-2016, 01:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LeRoi2

I saw the same ad you mention on Craigslist for 6 Trojan GC batteries, supposedly brand new, marked 2/16, for $520.

The lowest price I have seen these in this market is $140 each, or about $840, for 6. When something is that much different in price, my suspicion is that it is not an apples to oranges comparison.

Those batteries may have been manufactured in 2/16, but if they were installed or maintained incorrectly, over discharged, or allowed to totally discharge, there lifetime use has been dramatically shortened. Why would anyone sell Trojan Batteries in this market, 60% less?

If you bought them, let us know how they work out.

I've actually found them for about $105 each at one store here locally, but they weren't advertising them. The place with the $520 set is a reputable battery store in the Inland Empire here in SoCal, and they buy pallets of these batteries. For the record, we have not bought them...but that has to do mostly with the 2-hour one-way drive. We haven't had time, as the coach is being towed in about 6 hours to Cummins for engine repair and we've been busy getting everything ready for days--both for the repair and for where we'll be staying while it's in the shop.

nodine · 05-09-2016, 03:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ereadingrv

Bob:

What is the difference between regular deep cycle 6-volt batteries and AGM batteries? I know that our two 12 volt chassis batteries are "maintenance free" batteries, and are completely sealed. Are those considered "AGM" versus our regular 6 volt Interstate batteries that take distilled water?

AGM batteries are considered maintenance free and you cannot add or check the electrolyte.

Bob

trimacon · 05-09-2016, 04:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nodine

Have you checked to see if any other 12 volt systems in the coach also loose power when the lights go off. The lights and many of the 12 volt powered components of your coach receive their power through the infamous "Salesman Relay" that is controlled by the so called "Salesman Switch" near the entry door. That contactor is in the front run bay and looks like an old Ford starter contactor. It is very common for these contactors to be intermittent and cause just the symptoms you describe. Most everyone, my self included, have bypassed that contactor. The easiest way is to remove the two battery size cables and connect them together with a bolt. Then tape up the bolt. Do a search on "Salesman Switch" and you will find days of reading.

Bob

I just had to have the "salesman switch" replaced at $60. I was intermittently losing 12V (noticed lights at first) and then finally it just died.

RamiDav · 05-09-2016, 09:42 AM

Looks like you have found that batteries are not what is actually
causing the lights etc to go off .

While you may need house batteries at some point , as long as
you are plugged in and your converter / charger is charging then
12 volts will be supplied to operate the lights etc provided some
other problem is not causing them to go off .
Seems like many problems turn out to be poor ground connections .

I personally would not go buy new batteries until the problem is
located .
Unless you are going to be dry camping those old batteries may
serve you for a long time .

Maybe I missed it but do you know if there is something you have
found that causes the lights to go off ?
Something like slamming the door , turning something on or off .

Good luck at Cummins hope they find a cheaper repair .

BTW did they say what they were looking for that may not require
an overhaul ?

Please keep us posted I'm sure I speak for everyone here in
hoping for the best outcome .

Ray

YC1 · 05-10-2016, 06:15 AM

Banks of batteries do NOT just cut off. If you do not get a voltmeter out and take at least two measurements you are just wasting a lot of time guessing.

Go to the front run panel and in the bottom left there is a large lug. Pull the pile of wires away and shoot a picture of that area. On later models this is where the salesman solenoid lives. Yours does not appear to have one there but the wire could easily be loose. Get a voltage measurement there and then tighten that lug. If there are any other large wires coming in the compartment then write those voltages down too. Do not rely on your memory. Leave the voltmeter in the compartment and with the cover off so you can gingerly take measurements when it acts up.

When the lights go off, how long do they stay off? You may have a 12 volt thermal breaker on the fritz.

YC1 · 05-10-2016, 06:28 AM

http://www.metrotrekkers.org/utility/electrical.htm

This is a fun site to play with various setups and should help you visualize how these systems work together.

MikeandJan · 05-10-2016, 06:55 AM

You mentioned that rooftop A/C's quit when the lights went out - I would bet the TV did also if it was plugged into the original TV outlet. Both those items operate on AC power but the control circuits for the rooftop units is DC (the thermostats and communication wiring) and the outlet for the TV is DC controlled to keep the TV from working when the engine is running. My vote is intermittent battery cutoff solenoid or the switch (salesman solenoid and switch.) Happened to us ('03 Camelot) and when the coach was completely powered down and repowered, the solenoid would work - for a while. In mine, you can look at the DC electrical panel in the bedroom to see all that is powered through the cut off solenoid.

RamiDav · 05-10-2016, 10:32 AM

I think everyone following this thread felt like we knew for sure
the problem was the " Salesman switch " but Richard
was adamant that he does not have one .
Well he has pretty much convinced me that he actually does not have
a salesman sw , at least not one like most of us have .
He provided a picture on page 3 of this thread that shows 3 switches
by the door but he did not identify them .
They have had a lot of grief with this coach and hopefully are on the
right path to get some relief

Surely someone has a 99 Diplomat coach and could help with his
12 volt electrical issues .

Ray

barmcd · 05-10-2016, 12:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nodine

AGM batteries are considered maintenance free and you cannot add or check the electrolyte.

Bob

And they all seem to cost 40% more than wet cell batteries.

barmcd · 05-10-2016, 02:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ereadingrv

Well, tonight (just prior to our tow to Cummins for engine repair), they started cutting off for no apparent reason. According to the power panel in the coach, we have full voltage. So I'm at a total loss.

That sounds like a relay or switch issue. Was the coach moving at the time?

ereadingrv · 05-21-2016, 02:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by barmcd

That sounds like a relay or switch issue. Was the coach moving at the time?

No, the coach was not moving at the time.

On a related note, we have yet to locate any kind of salesman's switch inside the living area of the coach (1999 Monaco Diplomat, for those who don't know what we own). The closest thing we've located thus far is the master power switch (more of a dial, really) in the battery compartment.

RamiDav · 05-21-2016, 04:53 PM

Richard '
That master switch is a source of trouble sometime .
They can look good but actually be burned inside
and burn can usually be seen from the back side .
When you have access to the coach and someone
to observe try moving that knob on the sw and
tugging on the wires to see if the lights act up .
If that is the problem you can get a good replacement
at West Marine .

Ray

ereadingrv · 05-26-2016, 06:44 AM

Okay, I don't know what this means exactly, but...

We haven't gotten the new batteries yet, mainly because we haven't had time. We plan to in the next few days. But I AM wondering if maybe what I'm about to describe is an indicator of a bigger problem.

The lights have gone off intermittently the past 12 hours, after working fine for two days. When we power off the generator, then turn it back on, using the Aux Start button, the lights come back on.

Any thoughts what this might mean?