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Old 03-28-2017, 04:37 PM   #1
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No electrical power at one lug (3) Left Front Electrical Center

As stated… I have no electrical power at one lug (3) Left Front Electrical Center.

Walked into coach hit the salesman switch and I hear the relay make noise as usual but only a few of the lights in the coach but not all that are suppose to come on ….such as all the switches at the entry door.
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I found that I have no power at the lower portion of the Left Front electrical center and also no power at the lug shown here (# 3) I have power at all the other lugs.
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If I jump from another lug, the lower portion of the electrical center lights up and functions properly

So my question is …what supplies power to lug #3 ?

I’m pretty sure the salesman switch is working properly as I can hear it make noise and watch many other lights in the coach turn on and off while turning the switch on and off.

I have no electrical diagram for the coach at this time, I tried to get one sometime back from Monaco / HR and they said they could only supply the circuit I was working on … I found that interesting.

So I'm hoping I can get by with a little help from my friends.
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Old 03-28-2017, 05:43 PM   #2
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Hi RobRoy; I don't have your coach, but I would like to take a stab in the dark at your problem. By the way, nice pictures and labels. I see that cable looks like the same size as the other three. They are red so I assume all 12V that look like they could carry a heavy load. On my 01 Windsor, some of that power to the front electric bay comes from my right rear electrical bay. Since yours is a Navigator, do you have a rear electric bay on the right rear outside of your coach, or is there some electric boxes in your engine compartment like on the Dynasty's? By the size of the cable, I am guessing that #3 lug gets it power through a solenoid, inverter fuse, or some other electric component in the back that powers that #3 lug. I know I get power to my salesmen switch through a solenoid in my right rear, outside electrical bay along with my inverter fuse etc. I don't know if this is any help or not since you are getting some response from your salesmen switch. This is just a thought since I don't have your coach. I am sure you will hear from someone soon. Don't know if this helps or not. Good luck in your troubleshooting.
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Old 03-28-2017, 05:51 PM   #3
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Hi RobRoy; Just one other thought. Could some part of your salesmen switch relay have failed and it is only carrying a partial load. Can you bypass the salesmen switch relay and see if you get power to everything??????? Just another thought!
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Old 03-28-2017, 09:15 PM   #4
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O.K. so I also suspect that the front power at that cable (3) that is dead is supplied from the right rear electrical center, seen here.


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I see an access door to the Big Boy relay.

However, I see no easy access to what I think is the salesman relay.

When I turn the two manual battery shut offs switches I also still see power at many places.

So I assume to kill all the power and be sure …disconnect the neg cables at the batteries on the coach? and AC shore power

To remove the panel that the Salesman relay appears to be behind looks a bit involved to take out and want to make sure that is the where the relay is located and probably the problem before I start my journey in behind there.

As I stated earlier when I turn the salesman switch I hear a loud click and I see many lights go on and off inside the coach when doing so, but do not see any power at the entry door switches like it worked before and as stated earlier no power in that (3) power lug in the left front.

Without a diagram, I'm trying to picture what that Salesman relay looks like and better understand it , such as how many terminals are on it? and how it’s wired?

Thanks in advance
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Old 03-28-2017, 09:20 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 8.3Oilbuner View Post
Hi RobRoy; Just one other thought. Could some part of your salesmen switch relay have failed and it is only carrying a partial load? Can you bypass the salesmen switch relay and see if you get power to everything??????? Just another thought!
I think you on to it...I'm just trying to get and an idea of what has to come apart to gain access to it and kill power so I don't burn the coach to the ground.

I'm sure this is a pattern failure and someone has had this issue and how to deal with it.

I could go on a fishing trip and dig in there I would just like a heads up from someone who has BTDT

Thanks for your input
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Old 03-29-2017, 06:11 AM   #6
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RobRoy-

Send me a private message that includes your e-mail address and I'll forward a copy of the 2007 Signature wiring diagram set I have. Although somewhat different than what's in your photos, there are some sheets that look similar. One of those shows a circuit breaker in the Rear Run Box that feed that Lug #3 in the front.
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Old 03-29-2017, 08:06 AM   #7
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Originally Posted by l1v3fr33ord1 View Post
RobRoy-

Send me a private message that includes your e-mail address and I'll forward a copy of the 2007 Signature wiring diagram set I have. Although somewhat different than what's in your photos, there are some sheets that look similar. One of those shows a circuit breaker in the Rear Run Box that feed that Lug #3 in the front.

Thank You
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Old 03-29-2017, 08:45 AM   #8
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On our '06 Dynasty, that lug is the "switched" domestic (coach) battery lug. It is sourced from the rear run box, and yes, it is also switched by the "salesman" switch relay(s). If you have +12V on lug #4 in your photo (always hot), but not on lug #3, either your battery disconnect switch (most likely in the battery compartment) is either open or faulty, or your relay in the rear run box that is operated by your salesman switch is open or faulty. Your rear run box photo shows a different configuration than ours, so I can't say which device is that salesman switch relay. I would expect it to be about the size of small lime or very large egg. It will have two large lugs and two small lugs on it. The small lugs are fed from the switch by your entry door, and the large lugs carry all of the DC loads that it powers.

At least that is how our coach was configured.
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Old 03-29-2017, 01:27 PM   #9
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Good afternoon RobRoy; I can't believe that the salesmen solenoid is located behind that circuit board. I have seen other owners of coaches, Signatures, and Dynasty's that have posted pictures of that solenoid out in the open. You asked what they look like. From pictures other owners have posted, that solenoid is usually a round silver unit that looks a lot like the old Ford starter solenoids on many older Ford products. Has the two big lugs on either side with other wires attached to control the activation of the solenoid. They are rated in so many amps and are continuous heavy duty design. I have seen pictures owners have posted with two of the solenoids almost right next to one another. If you have to get behind that circuit board, I would make sure you are unplugged from shore power and that no 12V power is present before disassembly. Hope this helps you get to the bottom of why there is no power at 3# terminal. My 01 Windsor has the Whitte Rogers solenoid that looks completely different that what I have described above.
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Old 03-29-2017, 03:45 PM   #10
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I had some time to play with this contraption today.
O.K. so here goes.

I was a bit unsure as to what was what? and iRV2 member l1v3fr33ord1 was kind enough to send me a complete wiring of his 2007 and it looked similar to my deal so I decided to dig in a bit. Here is a clip of that diagram.

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First of all, I disconnected all battery grounds and also 110VAC power ..remember the inverter sends power also


To gain access to the salesman relay is quite simple, there is a screw holding a hinged door as seen here.

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Once accessed and made sure all was clear of any possible shorting I hooked the battery grounds up and hit the salesman switch and the relay banged like a hammer and you would think by listening to it that all was well..... but not the case, no output.

To be sure that the circuit was complete I used a jumper from power to the output side of the relay and all functions as intended.

So now you guys need to find me a relay ( seen here ) …..reasonably priced I hope.

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Yes i know I can jump around the salesman switch ..... but I like it ...and find it convenient ...at least when it works.

How much doI like it?

Depend$$$$

Thanks again to all that contribute here at iRV2
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Old 03-29-2017, 05:08 PM   #11
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Hi RobRoy; Looks like you found it. Bad solenoid. Since you are on east coast time and I am in the west, I am sure you have done this already. I can see labels on the solenoid. Can you get any numbers off of the solenoid and Bing or Google the numbers. Has to be made by some electrical/solenoid MFG. You could try calling Monaco Parts, but since there have been changes there, I don't know how that will work out. Hope you could get some part numbers. I would think that those solenoids are still being used today by other coach manufactures. Wish you well in your search. Hopefully another owner of a coach in your series has replaced that solenoid and has a part number for you. Someone, somewhere, sum time has had to replace that same part. Good luck!
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Old 03-29-2017, 05:14 PM   #12
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Hi RobRoy; Just another late thought. Looks like the bottom part of relay is attached with screws???? Could it be dismantled and contacts cleaned up like on the Big Boy Relay???? I post before I think things all the way through!
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Old 03-29-2017, 05:31 PM   #13
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Hi RobRoy; I just Binged that numbers on the panel. Intellitec Relay,01-0005-002. At E-Bay and other RV parts suppliers. Around $48+ to $69+. I am sure you have found this already.
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Old 03-29-2017, 05:36 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 8.3Oilbuner View Post
Hi RobRoy; Just another late thought. Looks like the bottom part of relay is attached with screws???? Could it be dismantled and contacts cleaned up like on the Big Boy Relay???? I post before I think things all the way through!

Looks like a $ 60.00 Intellitec Battery Disconnect part so I may see if I can take it apart as suggested as I plan on taking the Big Boy apart also for service while I'm in there.

Yea I can afford $ 60.00 but $ 60.00 is dinner for me and my bride with drinks.....or beer for the Man Cave fridge. Being retired one thing I have is some time sooooo


Thanks again and I will keep you all posted as to the outcome.
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