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Old 02-14-2009, 10:14 AM   #29
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We have an 01 Executive that had this very issue. The coach was re-skinned in 2006 at the Monaco plant in Oregon. Cracks are now appearing again but very lightly as of yet and only in the very dark brown color. Also, interestingly, only on the sides and not on either front or rear cap area.

Rich

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Old 02-14-2009, 11:17 AM   #30
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There could be more than one cause of paint cracking issues in fiberglass sidewalls. What type of sidewalls do you have? If your coach is 3-4+ years old, the sidewalls are very likely composed of a fiberglass/luan wood backing substrate, made by multiple sidewall suppliers. Many rv manufacturers have experienced, to various degrees, an unforeseen issue when utilizing this type of sidewall with dark color full body paint coaches. Notice how most of these paint cracking complaints involve dark color paints. Apparently, the issue has to do with the different thermal expansion/contraction properties of the fiberglass and wood luan materials. Typically, under extreme tempurature conditions, this difference is significant enough to cause stress between the material layers to transfer to the gelcoat, resulting in various cracking or snake skinning issues to appear in the paint. Completely sanding the gelcoat, and repainting the sidewalls does not solve the core issue.

All major manufacturers that I know of, switched to using an all composite fiberglass sidewalls 2-3 years ago. You'll even find these new sidewalls in the most entry level coaches. This switch has appeared to solved the issue, as the composite layers making up the sidewalls have similar if not identical thermal expansion properties. I believe Monaco and American Coach use CTec sidewalls made by Fabwell, now owned by Crane.

These composite sidewalls also have added benefits, including better thermal insulation properties, are lighter weight, and stronger than their previous fiberglass/wood substrate sidewalls. They do tend to be thinner, and may appear slightly wavy when viewed a the right angle.

Unfortunately, if paint cracking issues can be attributed to the use of fiberglass/luan sidewalls, there is not much that can be done other than a complete sidewall replacement/repaint, utilizing new all composite sidewalls. That's what American Coach has done, replaced sidewalls with these cracking issue using Ctec panels. Not an inexpensive proposition by any means.

Take note that just because you have fiberglass/luan sidewalls and dark color full body paint, does not automatically mean you will experience these problem. However, if your coach is typically subjected to extreme temperature conditions, you are at a higher risk of developing this paint cracking issue.
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Old 02-14-2009, 12:56 PM   #31
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Quote:
Originally posted by mohotravelers:
We have an 01 Executive that had this very issue. The coach was re-skinned in 2006 at the Monaco plant in Oregon. Cracks are now appearing again but very lightly as of yet and only in the very dark brown color. Also, interestingly, only on the sides and not on either front or rear cap area.

Rich

PS. Hey MM, Can I get some Karma??
Welcome to iRV2& Monaco FOrum... you have your Karma!!

MM



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Old 06-29-2009, 09:50 AM   #32
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We have an 02 Holiday Rambler. Lots of cracks in the dark paint. Talked with a company in Southern Calif. They will grind off most of the fiber glass then re glass it and paint it. Only seems to be the side walls that need the work. Any one ever had it done. Lots of money but the coach looks pretty bad. The Paint Dept. They advertise in the FMCA mag. Takes about 2 months to do the whole thing.
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Old 06-29-2009, 10:44 AM   #33
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We have an 02 Holiday Rambler. Lots of cracks in the dark paint. Talked with a company in Southern Calif. They will grind off most of the fiber glass then re glass it and paint it. Only seems to be the side walls that need the work. Any one ever had it done. Lots of money but the coach looks pretty bad. The Paint Dept. They advertise in the FMCA mag. Takes about 2 months to do the whole thing.
When I spoke with the Monaco paint guys back in March when they repaired a hit to one of the sidewalls they said that simply grinding down and repainting the sidewalls would not prevent a recurrance. The fiberglss material is at fault not the paint. I would question closely the people who would sand/grind and repaint about that and perhaps see what guarantee they offer that a recurrance won't happen.

Our 04 HR Imperial is doing it on the driver side black which recieves most of the direct sunlight.
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Old 06-29-2009, 11:50 AM   #34
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When I spoke with the Monaco paint guys back in March when they repaired a hit to one of the sidewalls they said that simply grinding down and repainting the sidewalls would not prevent a recurrance. The fiberglss material is at fault not the paint. I would question closely the people who would sand/grind and repaint about that and perhaps see what guarantee they offer that a recurrance won't happen.

Our 04 HR Imperial is doing it on the driver side black which recieves most of the direct sunlight.
Back when Monaco was dealing with the problem, in my visits to the three factory service centers (RIP) I saw them initially grinding down the sidewalls then, later, completely replacing them. I would infer that replacement turned out to be the only real fix.

I wonder what they did differently with the replacement sidewalls, compared to the originals.
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Old 06-29-2009, 01:47 PM   #35
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Back when Monaco was dealing with the problem, in my visits to the three factory service centers (RIP) I saw them initially grinding down the sidewalls then, later, completely replacing them. I would infer that replacement turned out to be the only real fix.

I wonder what they did differently with the replacement sidewalls, compared to the originals.
According to MOHOTRAVELERS it would appear that they simply reskinned the coaches with the same fiberglass they used before since the problem recurred.
Our coach didn't start showing symptoms till it was out of warranty and Monaco just blew me off. They were reskinning coaches for a bit then stopped Monaco won a suit against Owens Corning ( think it was them) butr failed to pass the benefit thru to their customers. Also there was a story that Monaco was offering a discount to owners with defective paint if they traded to a new Monaco product.
I was going to sue but now it appears it would have been a futile exercise.
Ron
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Old 06-30-2009, 08:07 AM   #36
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I guess I left out a little on how they repair the side walls. Still not sure about the warranty. The fiberglass starts to crack at about 160 degrees. The dark colors get there really fast. After they grind most of the glass off the coach they put it into a paint booth and bake it at 220 degrees to make what is left of the fiberglass react. Then new fiberglass mat is put on and then several coats of resin and then re paint. They have been doing it for 10 years and it seems to work. I know some one else must have have it done. The web site is thepaintdepartment.com. At one time Monaco did offer us a discount on a new coach. I don't remember how much but I think it was around $5000.00

I think the killer was 4 months in Phoenix last year facing north south. Got the morning sun and afternoon sun on the sides. (April.-July)
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Old 10-03-2009, 09:23 PM   #37
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I would be interested in a class action lawsuit against Monaco. The paint problems I am having
are the same as you have taked about. Did not
get any satisfaction from Monaco when I presented the problem to them.

I own a 2002 Monaco Windsor PBT. I purchased the coach from the original owners and they pointed out this defect to me when I asked about the small cracking in some of the areas on the coach. They claimed at the time that Monaco said it was a fiberglass problem and the original owners never took it back to the factory to have it corrected as they were on the road for 18 months right out of the factory. Once I purchased the coach, the warranty stopped. Because I wanted specifically a 2002 Windsor PBT and this coach was setup pretty much how I wanted it with wood floors throughout and lots of storage, this defect didn't stop me from purchasing the rig. However, since I live in Southern CA, and I am a full-timer, the defect has gotten much worse. It was only noticeable in the darker colors, black & mauve, at first, however it was definitely apparent in the lighter colors too, you just had to look closer.



I would DEFINITELY be up for a class action suit against the fiberglass suppliers much like what Coachman achieved against Crane Composites. There is no way I can afford to have my coach re-skinned and painted. So in the meantime, I just put up with the shoddy workmanship that was done back in 2001 on my 2002 Monaco Windsor coach. Where can we find a good lawyer to start our class action suit?
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Old 10-04-2009, 06:30 AM   #38
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Good luck. Not sure but I think about everything has been tried? Since Monaco is not Monaco anymore that would be out. Anyway let me know if you find out anything. Good luck
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Old 10-04-2009, 08:41 AM   #39
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Gary,

There can be all kinds of issues with paint. The particular one you were told about was a fiberglass problem not a paint problem and it affected all coach manufacturers who uses fiberglass construction. The problem is caused by "out gassing" of the fiberglass after the paint was applied. At this age any coach that was going to have this problem would be showing the defect. It is true that dark colors have more problems than lighter colors because of the heat absorbed. Any manufacturing defects involving the paint should be evident by now in a coach older than '04.

You are faced with a buyers market that may never be repeated. If you want to up grade your ride now is the time. Do your research, like you are doing now & go for the gusto.

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Old 10-09-2009, 08:08 PM   #40
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Gel coat

The problem is the fiberglass.had to have mine reskined and repainted .mine was under warranty.had to take my coach to Oregon factory.This took serveral
months If you fine a company that paints RVs they should know about this by now,It will be pricey,also there are a number years& manufactures involed.
Dow corning was the manufacture of these panels


this is my first post

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Old 10-09-2009, 10:23 PM   #41
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So do we have any real good lawyers on this forum that would like to handle a class action suit for the coach owners who have been swindled out of millions of dollars by the fiberglass suppliers?

I think it would be the only way to get the attention of the people that were ultimately responsible for this problem. Even though there have been some attempts and possible settlements, the vast majority of the people who were directly affected still have their less than beautiful motor coach plagued with this disease.

There must be a way to obtain justice for everyone instead of just rolling over and accepting it.

Help ----- Please Help!

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Old 11-02-2009, 09:24 AM   #42
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Unhappy

MtRoamer: This is exactly what ours looked like, only ours was 1000 times worse.

1. Monaco advertised that their coach bodies were covered with paint only.

2. All speculation aside. Our 1995 Dynasty was covered with dark vinyl graphics, then several coats of clear coat to smooth it out.

The dark vinyl graphics deteriorated, causing an unsightly mess.

It's unsettling to think you can believe what someone tells you, only to find out later that they've been cutting corners and lying to you about it all along.
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