Prep for digital satellite

[UK_Steve]

Hi Guys,

Any help much appreciated…

07 Monaco Cayman 36PDQ.

Have been on the roof recently cleaning – what a job that is! There is a label that says something to do with prep for digital satellite; I want to fit a digital satellite dome, any idea how I discover exactly what the prep is and what it consist of. Also where under the roof skin I can find it? As I was typing this, just looked up at the ceiling, could the connectors be above the internal strip light, or even the middle speaker of the surround sound? As they seem to be more or less where the label is on the outside.

Many thanks

[Diplomat Don]

On many of the Monaco coaches you'll be able to see the wiring if you remove the flourescent light inside that is closest to where the roof label is located. There should be one or two coax leads and a 12 volt power wire.

[UK_Steve]

Hi Don, I have spent the last two hours with various bits of the coach removed and tracing cables… Here is what I found, above the strip light is what I presume to be the steel plate that you bolt the satellite the dome to, in the plate there is a hole for I presume again passing cable up to the dome.

But no cables except the power to the lights. I then removed the front speakers from the surround sound just in case they were up there, all I could find is the speaker cables, the power to the strip lights passing by, coax for the TV antenna, nothing else visible. So using the camera on my cell phone I pushed the phone up and took many pictures covering all directions, nothing except the cables noted.

I worked forward in the directions of the cables noted and nothing else found, removing access panels, high level cupboard backs etc as I find them.

However in the AV cupboard above the drivers seat I found a coax all connected up and marked “Roof DSS” which I take to be Roof Digital Satellite System which disappears behind the TV box and goes roof wise but can’t find where without removing the TV.

Any other ideas where I may find these coax and or power cables?

Many thanks for any help anywhere.

Kind regards

[Diplomat Don]

Steve.......When I bought our coach new, I thought satellite installation was going to be a mysterious thing and had Camping World do it. I had located the label on the roof and I pulled my flourescent light and found the cables. When CW did the install, they didn't use the cables and drilled though my front cap. I was livid and asked why they didn't use the cables in the roof. They told me that usually they aren't there. I never let CW do any work again.

Maybe on yours they were correct. If you're going with a dome, I would keep looking and maybe call Monaco for some hints as to where it's at. If you're going with one of the HD open air satellites, the cables won't help because there is a control cable that has to be run and there is no compatible cable run by Monaco.

[UK_Steve]

Hello Don,

Interestingly we have spoken to the three major (well the ones I would trust anyway) system installers here in the UK and they all run new cables anyway to the dish/dome from the front cap and along the roof and just ignore the DSS Prep but won’t say why. As I plan to do the install myself I am coming to the conclusion based on your help that the answer is run new cables anyway to the dish/dome from the front cap along the roof and use external grade self adhesive mini trunking to hold them down.

But before the final decision I will drop Monaco a line and see if they can shed any light on the issue, maybe they are tucked away somewhere…..? I think not but worth a try.

Many thanks for the input.

Regards
Steve

[HD4Mark]

Although it was not a Monaco, we installed the crank up satellite dish on our first Winnebago. Up on the roof there was a label marking where the coax was buried. You might want to climb up and see if Monaco does it the same way if the AV switch has a coax connected to the satellite input. We did have to find a way to fish the control wire for the elevation readout since the wire I assumed was supposed to be for it turned out to be about three inches long and pulled right out.

[Bob (WA0MQE)]

Also, depending on the dish you mount. Meaning will it just require one cable or two. On many of the brand new coaches they might install two cables, because of the DVR and HD receivers that are available. But more then likely on anything but the newest coaches there may only be one cable. If this is the case then you'll need to run a second cable if you do decide to go with DVR and/or HD.

[ShapeShifter]

Quote:

Originally Posted by UK_Steve I want to fit a digital satellite dome, any idea how I discover exactly what the prep is and what it consist of.

Odds are, if you can find it, there will be a single coax cable run from the pre-wire connector you found in the A/V cabinet to an area in the vicinity of that label. But as you have found out, the trick is in finding that end of the cable. On my rig (different model but same year) the cable runs from that point off to the right side (as you are facing the front of the coach) and then runs up to the cabinet -- it doesn't necessarily run straight to the A/V cabinet.

If you are putting up a single output dome that gets its power and communications through the coax cable, then you will be all set (if you can find the cable.) But if you need two or more coax cables, or if your dome needs an extra control cable, then you will have to run them yourself. The standard prep is usually just a single cable.

Good luck!

[Diplomat Don]

UK_Steve......Generally, the front cap from the forward most roof seam to the 2' that roll over toward the windshield are just fiberglass with nothing under it. If you can get access to the front cap and drill from the inside out, you'll make sure that you have a good spot for the cable routing.

Camping World just used cable clamps to screw the cable down to the roof about every 6" and then used a self leveling sealant on them. When I replaced the dome with the open sat, I secured the new cables the same way. I also used a small amount of sealant along the length of the cabling to keep it from moving in the wind.

If you end up working in the front cap, get some fiberglass insulation and stuff the front cap full before you close everything up. These coaches are well insulated in the roof, but have nothing insulating the front cap.

[UK_Steve]

I have looked everywhere now and come to the conclusion it must be between the outer skins, i.e. under the fibreglass top coat and in the insulation layers before it gets to the void you can see above the strip light. Contacted Monaco LLC and this is what I received as a reply “Go up on the roof in front of the A/C half that distance you will find a sticker with an X that is where the cable is“

I am now considering a dual LNB version so will need two cables anyway, and as I can only find one at the AV cupboard end that all be decides it, it’s a new install from scratch.

Don,
I note you have changed from a Dome to an Open Dish, may I ask why? We had an open dish on the last two coaches, the first was damaged and the second (a slightly larger dish) therefore spent a vast amount of the time down due to the high winds we experience in the winter months in fear of dish or roof damage, hence looking towards a dome, but would really like to understand why you have gone the other way, am I missing something?

I will consider the extra insulation as you say, but I wonder if that is the right thing to do, I say this as I had the backs of the overhead lockers out of my last coach tracking a major electrical fault, no original insulation so I stuffed it full. Three years later had to have the TV and the back of the TV mounting box out due to strange things going on within the audio, and found the insulation I put in was soaking wet (creating poor electrical connections), so pulled it out again, assumed it was trapping condensation and soaking it up.

Many thanks

[Diplomat Don]

Steve......I like my TV in the evenings and went with an HD satellite by Winegard. I rewired everything in the front cabinets and tossed the switchbox. I get HD on my front TV and digital on my rear out of one DirecTV box.

[UK_Steve]

Don, now I understand. We currently have a digital terrestrial TV decoder (via the TV antenna) with hard disk recording and integrated DVD/CD players. I too rewired the cabinets, left the switch box in as it powers the roof antenna, we are able to play DVD’s or recordings from the hard disk from the one machine on either or both TV’s simultaneously and the same digital TV channel on either or both TV’s simultaneously, or a mixture there of (DVD on one TV on the other etc), and sound via the full Monaco installed surround sound system.
The satellite will augment this with the benefits of TV available when it is windy and a mixture of digital terrestrial on one and satellite on the other etc.
All done by using the output of the digital terrestrial TV decoder, a SCART socket, don’t plug it in to the TV but plug it into a SCART to Analogue converter and distribute around the coach on the coax. With the audio output plugged into the surround sound system.
Now advanced planning - the satellite may have HD, in which case use the analogue output of the satellite decoder as an analogue input to the digital terrestrial TV decoder to enable record ability and the HMI directly into the front TV… HD on the front, and or any combination as above including satellite (not HD) to the rear… Now that should work!
Urm feels like full rip out and start again job including the satellite wired from scratch not using the DSS prep, then I can us fresh hi-grade coax.
Mind doing overtime now, bits of paper with wiring sketches on…........

[ShapeShifter]

Quote:

Originally Posted by UK_Steve I note you have changed from a Dome to an Open Dish, may I ask why?

I also switched from a dome (top-end KingDome 9762-LP) to an open dish (Winegard Trav'ler SK-1000)

I spent a year arguing with the dome trying to get it to work properly, then gave up and put in the open dish and it's worked flawlessly (assuming I don't have trees in the way!) My big problem with the dome is that it can only "see" one satellite at a time, and for my Dish Network HD service, I need to be able to see three of them. When changing channels, the dome has to re-point to a different satellite, which takes time, and was not reliable. Furthermore, while it has two LNB outputs, since there is only one LNB that moves from satellite to satellite, the second receiver output doesn't work if it wants a different satellite than the main receiver output.

On the other hand, the open dish has multiple LNBs and the dish can see all of the required satellites at once. There is no re-aiming when changing channels, and the three receiver outputs can simultaneously tune in channels from different satellites. It just plain works, and works just like it does at home.

The other problem I had with the dome is that the actual dish inside the dome is much smaller than an open dish. That means that it often did not get a very strong signal and was susceptible to rain fade. Furthermore, the dome itself collected rain drops on the surface which also tended to degrade the signal. With the open dish, I haven't yet experienced rain fade.

If you only need to see one satellite for the service you have, the limitations of a dome may not be a real problem for you. But if you need to see more than one orbital location to get all of your channels, then you might not be as pleased with it. And if you are trying to use more than one receiver with those multiple satellite locations, you are bound to run into conflicts with the dome.

On the other hand, if in-motion operation is important to you, then a dome is the only way to go.

[Diplomat Don]

GEESH......UK_Steve.......you out geeked me in a couple of paragraphs. By the time I got to SCART....I needed some aspirin. It sounds like you know what you're doing and will get everything working well.

I hated the switchbox and made a decision to eliminate the roof top antenna, hooking the park cable directly to the coax connection on my main TV. The switchbox almost cost me the ability to watch a DVD on the rear TV. I replaced the rear TV with a larger flat panel and included DVD.