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Old 08-31-2017, 12:10 PM   #1
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Replacing Sheppard M100 PS GearBox?

I read thru the excellent threads about swapping-out a Sheppard for a TRW and the 'Wandering...Oh My'. Very enlightening and educational to say the least.

My question centers around simply replacing one M100 with another M100 (eBay-sourced) in my '06 Endeavor. Right now, I am grounded in the FL Keys with a leaking sector-shaft seal, and can't find anyone that will work on the coach. I'd have to somehow get the coach back to the mainland (Miami-area), either by towing or by stopping every little while and refilling the PS reservoir. It's definitely the shaft seal, not something simple like a loose hose etc (never my luck ).

Is it as tough as it looks to be able to access everything and remove the box, and then get it indexed back together? I can get the $250 Pittman shaft tool and big wrenches to remove the bolts, but what about getting to the steering shaft at the top of the box? I can't even see what's up there.

I've run the gamut of dirty fingernails, everything from rebuilding/restoring British sports cars to overhauling aircraft engines, but right now I'm stumped.

Helpful push in the right direction, please?
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Old 08-31-2017, 01:55 PM   #2
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Hello,

A few months ago I had to have the same steering gear replaced, same reason, leaking shaft seal. I got a replacement from Weller Truck Parts. Sheppard could also supply a rebuild. Sheppard could have it built and tested in a few days then shipped. Weller had a rebuild ready and shipped the next day. Weller was also a bit lower cost. Core charge was high. They really want the core returned. J

I closely watched the mechanic so if down the road something went sideways I might be able to handle.

As to the remove/replace, my coach has a generator in front that slides out. Sliding out the generator provided easy access to the top of the gear and the three large bolts attaching the gear to the frame.

It took the mechanic 1.5 hours to get it out. It is heavy. Shipping label had 120 lbs. I think it was a bit less but, still not easy to move about.

After he got it out the single snag occurred. He tried many different ways to get the Pitman arm off the gear. He had a Pitman puller but it was not large enough. We ended up finding a guy with a large three prong puller that had an additional adjustable brace that applied downward pressure on the prongs. Tighten prongs, (pulling up force) tighten brace, (force holding prongs together/down) repeat and 3 mins later the arm was off the gear.

It took the mechanic 1.5 hours to put the gear on and all back together.

After filling the oil reservoir, the rebuilt gear was full of oil (transmission fluid), next, lower the front level jack. When the tires are off the ground and the engine running, move the steering wheel, fully, to the left and right. That sets the valves in the gear.

The gear shaft and pitman arm had clear alignment marks. If not clearly marked, make sure to mark it before disassembly. Any offset could be a problem.

Other than getting the Pitman arm off the gear I would say the most difficult part is getting the gear down and up in the space. Removing, he just lowered it with a strap. Installing, he strapped the gear to a jack and lifted it (he had a little help for this part). The space is tight; the gear is heavy and gear/bolt to frame alignment is precise.

And last, IIRC, the Pitman arm to gear nut needed to be torqued to 3000 lbs.

Hope that helps.
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Old 08-31-2017, 06:14 PM   #3
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A motorcycle jack works wonders for lowering and raising the steering gear if you have access to one.
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Old 08-31-2017, 07:11 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark- View Post
Hello,

A few months ago I had to have the same steering gear replaced, same reason, leaking shaft seal. I got a replacement from Weller Truck Parts. Sheppard could also supply a rebuild. Sheppard could have it built and tested in a few days then shipped. Weller had a rebuild ready and shipped the next day. Weller was also a bit lower cost. Core charge was high. They really want the core returned. J

I closely watched the mechanic so if down the road something went sideways I might be able to handle.

As to the remove/replace, my coach has a generator in front that slides out. Sliding out the generator provided easy access to the top of the gear and the three large bolts attaching the gear to the frame.

It took the mechanic 1.5 hours to get it out. It is heavy. Shipping label had 120 lbs. I think it was a bit less but, still not easy to move about.

After he got it out the single snag occurred. He tried many different ways to get the Pitman arm off the gear. He had a Pitman puller but it was not large enough. We ended up finding a guy with a large three prong puller that had an additional adjustable brace that applied downward pressure on the prongs. Tighten prongs, (pulling up force) tighten brace, (force holding prongs together/down) repeat and 3 mins later the arm was off the gear.

It took the mechanic 1.5 hours to put the gear on and all back together.

After filling the oil reservoir, the rebuilt gear was full of oil (transmission fluid), next, lower the front level jack. When the tires are off the ground and the engine running, move the steering wheel, fully, to the left and right. That sets the valves in the gear.

The gear shaft and pitman arm had clear alignment marks. If not clearly marked, make sure to mark it before disassembly. Any offset could be a problem.

Other than getting the Pitman arm off the gear I would say the most difficult part is getting the gear down and up in the space. Removing, he just lowered it with a strap. Installing, he strapped the gear to a jack and lifted it (he had a little help for this part). The space is tight; the gear is heavy and gear/bolt to frame alignment is precise.

And last, IIRC, the Pitman arm to gear nut needed to be torqued to 3000 lbs.

Hope that helps.


3k for torque or 300ft lbs?
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Old 08-31-2017, 09:01 PM   #5
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3k for torque or 300ft lbs?
Ooopppsss....


It was stamped on the gear.



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Old 08-31-2017, 09:12 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark- View Post
Ooopppsss....


It was stamped on the gear.





Need a bigger torque wrench and a whole lot of us to hold it! Lol. 350 sounds better. [emoji514][emoji514]
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Old 08-31-2017, 10:14 PM   #7
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I did mine by myself in my driveway Rusty. It just looks like a big job. The shaft on mine is accessed from inside after taking the plastic shroud off.

I used a floor jack under the end of a big wrench to break the big bolts loose. Yes I used safety glasses and ear plugs. The ear plugs were so I would not offend myself with the foul language that would likely occur.

I picked up my steering box at Weller in Tampa.

Just leave the plastic shroud off the steering column until you drive it for several miles. There is a good chance you will need to tweak it a bit.

The heavy box once lifted into place can be pinned with one bolt and then swing it up .
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Old 09-01-2017, 06:10 AM   #8
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Thanks, guys, for making me feel much better about the task.

And thanks for the heads-up on how to access the upper-shaft, too. Makes it seem more do-able. I mighta figured that trick out right after finishing the rest of the job .

Finally got a 'roadside repair' guy to call me back. He sounded like he knew what he was talking-about, and said it should only take 2-3 hours to replace. Does that sound reasonable, assuming he has the tools/jack/etc (and expertise)?

Talked to 'RedHead Steering Gears', and they quoted $450 for a 24-48 hr turnaround. I have the eBay gearbox (guy said it was NOS, but we'll see) coming next week, and may make a decision as to which to use after I see it.

Another question: My box right now is tight (well, except for where it leaks ), so after reading the Sheppard/TRW discussions, I'm a bit hesitant to just swap boxes and possibly get one with a lot of play. Is the play a common issue? Should I be on the lookout for any other gotchas?

On edit: Myron/YC1 - did you use that $250 Pittman puller? Mark mentioned having to get creative with his.


I like the earplug idea, might have to spring for them for the entire neighborhood. Wife really knows me too, she's already ordered a hardhat so I don't bend the frame with my forehead when I bang into it.
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Old 09-01-2017, 07:13 AM   #9
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Thoughts

Quote:
Originally Posted by RustyTools View Post
Thanks, guys, for making me feel much better about the task.

And thanks for the heads-up on how to access the upper-shaft, too. Makes it seem more do-able. I mighta figured that trick out right after finishing the rest of the job .

Finally got a 'roadside repair' guy to call me back. He sounded like he knew what he was talking-about, and said it should only take 2-3 hours to replace. Does that sound reasonable, assuming he has the tools/jack/etc (and expertise)?

Talked to 'RedHead Steering Gears', and they quoted $450 for a 24-48 hr turnaround. I have the eBay gearbox (guy said it was NOS, but we'll see) coming next week, and may make a decision as to which to use after I see it.

Another question: My box right now is tight (well, except for where it leaks ), so after reading the Sheppard/TRW discussions, I'm a bit hesitant to just swap boxes and possibly get one with a lot of play. Is the play a common issue? Should I be on the lookout for any other gotchas?

On edit: Myron/YC1 - did you use that $250 Pittman puller? Mark mentioned having to get creative with his.


I like the earplug idea, might have to spring for them for the entire neighborhood. Wife really knows me too, she's already ordered a hardhat so I don't bend the frame with my forehead when I bang into it.

There are some "tight" Sheppards out there. Please understand that the play or "non motion" is in the design of the Sheppard steering gear. How tight a Sheppard is depends on the internal parts tolerances from the get go. Non adjustable. I have talked with coach owners who have had their Sheppard steering gear replaced, some under warranty, only to end up with a steering gear with more "play". Very few have seen an improvement but it could happen.


If you contact Brent Hofstra at Weller truck parts and want to stick with the Sheppard and tell him it is for a motorhome Brent could have a "tight" Sheppard built. I bet Weller could even rebuild your Sheppard steering gear with a quick turn around. That is and option, at least you know what you already have. Email bhofstra@wellertruck.com Tell him Craig French sent you

Now all of that being said, if your are going to replace the steering gear anyway a TRW is just a few more dollars to install and yes easy to do. 3-5 hour job if you have all the pieces and parts available. The pitman indexing part is easy, plus you do not have to remove the Sheppard pitman arm to return the Sheppard core.

You could move this discussion over to the TRW thread if you decide to swap and there might be an owner who has performed the exact same swap who would be willing to chime in and help.

I would never try to sway a coach owner one way or another. I am about providing a coach owner with all the available information and allowing the owner to make an informed choice.

Good luck, safe travels and keep us posted,

Craig
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Old 09-01-2017, 08:18 AM   #10
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Rusty,, I use a hard hat liner to protect my head. About $10. Using a piece of elastic glued in place with a hot glue gun keeps it on and sure has saved me.

I did not use any special tools to remove anything. When you get a new steering box you buy a new pitman arm when doing the swap. The cost is around $200 for the arm.

I know you are in a pinch but changing to the new TRW is just as easy as installing a replacement. Check with the experts here and you may not even want to or need to drill a hole for the adjustment at first. You can always go back and do it later if needed. That was probably the most tiring.
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Old 09-01-2017, 09:15 AM   #11
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Great input, guys, and thanks for taking the time to help. I will talk to Weller too. The Down-The-Road plan is to hit Josam-Frame when we get back to the mainland and let them go thru everything to make sure.

I started reviewing the Sheppard/TRW thread for quite some time back, but felt that my gearbox was 'ok' - at least to me. And always entertained the thought that sometime in the future, I'd get around to digging deeper into it. And somewhere that I'd have some kind of access to parts, supplies, facilities, etc - and not laying in full sun on hot sandy gravel with sticker-burrs everywhere.

Right now, I'm simply in the 'get it fixed and ready to move again' mode. So far this season, we've dodged the storms here but it seems there's always one more just coming off of Africa.

I need to quit reading the 'fix-it' threads, seems that as soon as I do, my coach breaks too .
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Old 09-01-2017, 09:29 AM   #12
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YC1 - where would I source a new Pittman Arm for that?

When I talked to Sheppard to verify my gearbox part number, he mentioned that one character in the number referenced that the gearbox originally was supplied to Monaco with an arm, but they don't do that anymore.
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Old 09-01-2017, 11:27 AM   #13
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Rusty, cruise from half way through those two threads on the swap. You will find specific information on who to contact and what you need.

It has become a bit daunting going through them and I have not made a snippit of the contact information.

Here are a couple of examples of the great information there. I forgot I even posted a do it yourself list.

Brute strength and ignorance works.

DO USE JACK STANDS: BE CAREFUL: I recently dropped my pickup on my upper body even though I had a jack stand and a floor jack. That put the hurt on me but sure could have been worse.
Attached Files
File Type: pdf steering gear box swap instruction.pdf (572.3 KB, 104 views)
File Type: pdf Steering gear swap.pdf (1.48 MB, 90 views)
File Type: pdf Weller Truck parts contact for steering gear.pdf (50.9 KB, 68 views)
File Type: pdf 2017-09-01_13-30-06.pdf (207.3 KB, 73 views)
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Old 09-01-2017, 05:53 PM   #14
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Thanks. I'll go thru them again. I must admit my eyes got a bit crossed reading thru all the data, and I mighta missed something.

Bummer to hear about your incident. I can only count to 19 (using fingers and toes) but that's another story .
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