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Old 06-20-2016, 07:58 PM   #183
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Originally Posted by CaymanPilot View Post
Ok, Guys - Since my last post on this thread we have made 2 trips to Wisconsin with the new ATRO bushings installed. They made a definite difference in the wander. There is still some wander when there are strong gusty winds but in light to medium winds or on calm days, the coach is a delight to drive. The steering is much more positive now and the see-sawing of the steering wheel has been significantly reduced. I have one more mod to make to hopefully remove all the sway.
This morning I dropped off my Cayman to Truck Centers in Morton, IL where my favorite RV tech works to have the rear anti-sway bar installed. It may take a while as they are swamped due to this being the peak of RV season and we are not going anywhere until school starts again. Hopefully in a week or two I will have a test drive report and maybe some more GoPro videos for you. Safe travels to all!
Steve, great to hear from you about the improvements from the bushings. I'm glad to hear yours has improved like mine has. We are heading out in a couple weeks for a 2 week trip. After that I can give a better assessment of how mine drives. My previous trips have only been weekend jaunts and not many miles. However, they have been enough to tell a difference in the lack of wander.

I have one more thing to try. I have a steer safe at the house to put on. I've read many people noticed a huge difference with it so I thought I might as well give it a go. If it helps in case of a blowout then all the much better.

Stay cool everyone and safe travels.

Chad
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Old 06-21-2016, 05:09 AM   #184
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Originally Posted by onechaddude View Post
Steve, great to hear from you about the improvements from the bushings. I'm glad to hear yours has improved like mine has. We are heading out in a couple weeks for a 2 week trip. After that I can give a better assessment of how mine drives. My previous trips have only been weekend jaunts and not many miles. However, they have been enough to tell a difference in the lack of wander.

I have one more thing to try. I have a steer safe at the house to put on. I've read many people noticed a huge difference with it so I thought I might as well give it a go. If it helps in case of a blowout then all the much better.

Stay cool everyone and safe travels.

Chad
Chad & Steve.....

I am replacing the trailing arms (with Source) as well as adding their REK package this week before heading out on a 6,000 mile trip this summer!! I have already added the Safety T Plus stabilizer (helped a lot) and as you may recall, did the SWAP a while back. I am really looking forward to enjoying the drive after this work is completed this week, and will share the results with you. (Fingers Crossed!) IF my Cheetah is not completely "sway free" and needs more help, Van, Craig, and I plan to replace the bushings this fall.

Thanks for both of your contributions to this thread.........as with the help of many we are finally getting our coaches to drive as they should have from the factory!

Mike
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Old 06-21-2016, 06:19 AM   #185
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Chad & Steve.....

I am replacing the trailing arms (with Source) as well as adding their REK package this week before heading out on a 6,000 mile trip this summer!! I have already added the Safety T Plus stabilizer (helped a lot) and as you may recall, did the SWAP a while back. I am really looking forward to enjoying the drive after this work is completed this week, and will share the results with you. (Fingers Crossed!) IF my Cheetah is not completely "sway free" and needs more help, Van, Craig, and I plan to replace the bushings this fall.

Thanks for both of your contributions to this thread.........as with the help of many we are finally getting our coaches to drive as they should have from the factory!

Mike
Mike,
You won't be sorry you installed all those good Source engineering products under your coach. Enjoy the ride - and the peace of mind knowing your rear trailing arms won't crack and cause a disaster!
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Old 06-21-2016, 10:02 AM   #186
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Mike,
You won't be sorry you installed all those good Source engineering products under your coach. Enjoy the ride - and the peace of mind knowing your rear trailing arms won't crack and cause a disaster!
X2. You'll be able to rest easy knowing they won't crack. Have a safe trip.

Chad
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Old 06-24-2016, 09:11 AM   #187
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I am very new to this forum and to Rv'ing as well. I recently purchased my first RV:
2008 35SBD Cayman. The original owner didn't do anything to the suspension other than replacing the trailing arms (an absolute must!!!!). The rig had 32K miles on it.
So I spent hours looking for technical information and recommendations about what could smooth out the ride. I found a company call Henderson's Line up in Grants Pass, OR. I called and they helped me with coming up with a game plan in that they have done a bunch of these. Made an appointment, parked in their lot with shore power night before and had me in at 7:30am. They performed their Road Performance Assessment test (took the rig out on multiple road conditions). Upon return they provided me a prioritized list of things that they knew would help the system. I didn't do all of it, but here is what I did do and the ride was drastically improved;
New Koni Shocks (incredible difference) NEW Alpine Peak on the front and FSD's on the rear.
Front end aligned (someone shimmed it in a very poor manner).
Double checked the ride height and did 4 corner weight.
Added Safe T Plus stabilizer on front end. Took me out and showed me how to adjust it if ever needed.
Installed 1/4" Motion Control units on each of the 4 bags.
We with me on test drive after the work was done and Porpoising was pretty much gone. left to right sway was reduced. Overall amazing improvement. Drove down a two lane county road, hands off the wheel and tracked straight and true.
I still need to replace the tires in that the old Goodyears are pretty stiff and the fronts slam pretty hard over bad road.
Other than that, they recommend a new TRW steering Gear (next time I'm through the area.) They also said that I could do the REK if I wanted to try and take it to the next level. Right now I'm quite satisfied and will wait on the REK-its quite expensive. I will say however, that if I have it done, it will be these guys. They are great to work with, very customer centric, showed me what they were doing every step of the way. I highly recommend these guys, they really know their stuff. All the other rigs that were there when I was appeared to be extremely happy with their experiences as well.
I will replace the steering gear at some time to tighten up the front end.
As always, thanks for posting and allowing me to do the same,
Ray and Leslie
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Old 06-24-2016, 03:56 PM   #188
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Originally Posted by Rfriebert View Post
I am very new to this forum and to Rv'ing as well. I recently purchased my first RV:
2008 35SBD Cayman. The original owner didn't do anything to the suspension other than replacing the trailing arms (an absolute must!!!!). The rig had 32K miles on it.
So I spent hours looking for technical information and recommendations about what could smooth out the ride. I found a company call Henderson's Line up in Grants Pass, OR. I called and they helped me with coming up with a game plan in that they have done a bunch of these. Made an appointment, parked in their lot with shore power night before and had me in at 7:30am. They performed their Road Performance Assessment test (took the rig out on multiple road conditions). Upon return they provided me a prioritized list of things that they knew would help the system. I didn't do all of it, but here is what I did do and the ride was drastically improved;
New Koni Shocks (incredible difference) NEW Alpine Peak on the front and FSD's on the rear.
Front end aligned (someone shimmed it in a very poor manner).
Double checked the ride height and did 4 corner weight.
Added Safe T Plus stabilizer on front end. Took me out and showed me how to adjust it if ever needed.
Installed 1/4" Motion Control units on each of the 4 bags.
We with me on test drive after the work was done and Porpoising was pretty much gone. left to right sway was reduced. Overall amazing improvement. Drove down a two lane county road, hands off the wheel and tracked straight and true.
I still need to replace the tires in that the old Goodyears are pretty stiff and the fronts slam pretty hard over bad road.
Other than that, they recommend a new TRW steering Gear (next time I'm through the area.) They also said that I could do the REK if I wanted to try and take it to the next level. Right now I'm quite satisfied and will wait on the REK-its quite expensive. I will say however, that if I have it done, it will be these guys. They are great to work with, very customer centric, showed me what they were doing every step of the way. I highly recommend these guys, they really know their stuff. All the other rigs that were there when I was appeared to be extremely happy with their experiences as well.
I will replace the steering gear at some time to tighten up the front end.
As always, thanks for posting and allowing me to do the same,
Ray and Leslie
Ray, that's great news to hear you are happy with the drive and ride of your coach. I would love to have visited Hendersons line up for an assessment of my coach. I've heard some really good things about those guys. Unfortunately I live on the east coast and a long ways from their location. If you've followed this thread you've noticed there are mixed emotions on the rr4r chassis. Some are happy and others have wandering issues. We haven't been able to explain the why's and what's to why some are good and others are not. We may never figure it out. Fortunately we have been able to try several things on our coaches and lay it out where others can pick and choose to what degree they want to go to on their coach. I, along with Steve (CaymanPilot) are more than glad to help answer questions on anything we have done to try and help anyone.

The steering gear swap has helped many Monaco coach owners tighten their front ends up. I would say it's right up there with the most noticeable of all the changes made to my coach.

Glad you decided to join in our thread and the Monaco forum. There are some wonderfully nice folks on here willing to help. They have helped me do many things I thought I would never have been able to do. Safe travels.

Chad
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Old 06-27-2016, 08:03 AM   #189
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Originally Posted by Rfriebert View Post
I am very new to this forum and to Rv'ing as well. I recently purchased my first RV:
2008 35SBD Cayman. The original owner didn't do anything to the suspension other than replacing the trailing arms (an absolute must!!!!). The rig had 32K miles on it.
So I spent hours looking for technical information and recommendations about what could smooth out the ride. I found a company call Henderson's Line up in Grants Pass, OR. I called and they helped me with coming up with a game plan in that they have done a bunch of these. Made an appointment, parked in their lot with shore power night before and had me in at 7:30am. They performed their Road Performance Assessment test (took the rig out on multiple road conditions). Upon return they provided me a prioritized list of things that they knew would help the system. I didn't do all of it, but here is what I did do and the ride was drastically improved;
New Koni Shocks (incredible difference) NEW Alpine Peak on the front and FSD's on the rear.
Front end aligned (someone shimmed it in a very poor manner).
Double checked the ride height and did 4 corner weight.
Added Safe T Plus stabilizer on front end. Took me out and showed me how to adjust it if ever needed.
Installed 1/4" Motion Control units on each of the 4 bags.
We with me on test drive after the work was done and Porpoising was pretty much gone. left to right sway was reduced. Overall amazing improvement. Drove down a two lane county road, hands off the wheel and tracked straight and true.
I still need to replace the tires in that the old Goodyears are pretty stiff and the fronts slam pretty hard over bad road.
Other than that, they recommend a new TRW steering Gear (next time I'm through the area.) They also said that I could do the REK if I wanted to try and take it to the next level. Right now I'm quite satisfied and will wait on the REK-its quite expensive. I will say however, that if I have it done, it will be these guys. They are great to work with, very customer centric, showed me what they were doing every step of the way. I highly recommend these guys, they really know their stuff. All the other rigs that were there when I was appeared to be extremely happy with their experiences as well.
I will replace the steering gear at some time to tighten up the front end.
As always, thanks for posting and allowing me to do the same,
Ray and Leslie
Ray,

Glad you have found this thread regarding the RR4R Chassis and those of us who have been steadily working to improve Monaco's poor engineering! That said, Chad, Steve, Craig (CrazyKnight), VanWill, and many others have been unselfishly providing really terrific (and proven) changes (and additions) that collectively help the controllability of our Roadmaster RR4R chassis. Here's what I have done so far:

1. Replaced the steering tires with new Continentals.
2. Swapped the old Shepherd steering box with a TRW (w/CrazyKnight's help)
3. Installed a Safe T Steer stabilizer
4. Replaced the rear trailing arms with Source Engineering designed arms
5. Installed Source Engineering Ride Enhancement Kit (REK)

The TRW totally changed the steering (I previously had over 3 1/2" of free play)
The Safe T Steer greatly helped side wind issues (& passing trucks)
The new Trailing Arms removed some of the rear sway
The REK removed the horrible proposing and a more stable, less lean cornering
(Yes, a lot of $$$ spent, but much, much better control and safety)

I do plan on replacing both the front and rear stabilizer bar bushings as well as the pan hard bar bushings with ATRO bushings this fall, but with the enhancements so far, our Cheetah is remarkably better than it was!!

I returned yesterday from a short 150 mile trip in the mountains and noticed a huge difference after installing the REK. I am looking forward to a 6,000 mile trip beginning next month, knowing our coach is much safer and more enjoyable to drive............as a result of those who have contributed to this effort!!!

Best of luck in your endeavor,

Mike (Maddog7)
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Old 06-27-2016, 03:14 PM   #190
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Ray,

Glad you have found this thread regarding the RR4R Chassis and those of us who have been steadily working to improve Monaco's poor engineering! That said, Chad, Steve, Craig (CrazyKnight), VanWill, and many others have been unselfishly providing really terrific (and proven) changes (and additions) that collectively help the controllability of our Roadmaster RR4R chassis. Here's what I have done so far:

1. Replaced the steering tires with new Continentals.
2. Swapped the old Shepherd steering box with a TRW (w/CrazyKnight's help)
3. Installed a Safe T Steer stabilizer
4. Replaced the rear trailing arms with Source Engineering designed arms
5. Installed Source Engineering Ride Enhancement Kit (REK)

The TRW totally changed the steering (I previously had over 3 1/2" of free play)
The Safe T Steer greatly helped side wind issues (& passing trucks)
The new Trailing Arms removed some of the rear sway
The REK removed the horrible proposing and a more stable, less lean cornering
(Yes, a lot of $$$ spent, but much, much better control and safety)

I do plan on replacing both the front and rear stabilizer bar bushings as well as the pan hard bar bushings with ATRO bushings this fall, but with the enhancements so far, our Cheetah is remarkably better than it was!!

I returned yesterday from a short 150 mile trip in the mountains and noticed a huge difference after installing the REK. I am looking forward to a 6,000 mile trip beginning next month, knowing our coach is much safer and more enjoyable to drive............as a result of those who have contributed to this effort!!!

Best of luck in your endeavor,

Mike (Maddog7)
Mike, I'm glad you're liking the benefits of the rek. I knew you would. I'm glad to hear your happy with the improvements now. They really do help. Like you said, cost lots of $$$$, but they have made mine much better than before.

You said you have been on a trip to the mountains, which mountains have you been to?

Chad
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Old 06-28-2016, 05:09 AM   #191
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Mike, I'm glad you're liking the benefits of the rek. I knew you would. I'm glad to hear your happy with the improvements now. They really do help. Like you said, cost lots of $$$$, but they have made mine much better than before.

You said you have been on a trip to the mountains, which mountains have you been to?

Chad
Chad,

Our primary home is in Atlanta, so this past weekend we took the Cheetah up to quiet RV Park in Dillard, GA (just a few miles south of the NC border). Nice curvy roads along with a number of bridges to test the ride.......MUCH better!! Next month, we will be heading northward to the Badlands in SD and through Yellowstone ending up in Glacier Naional Park. That will be a REAL TEST for our upgraded RR4R chassis!!

Mike
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Old 07-09-2016, 09:07 AM   #192
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Just wanted to give an update after all the mods I've completed including the steer safe. I'm halfway into a couple weeks trip and have put a little over 500 miles with the suspension mods. I have to say it is a HUGE improvement over what I had before the sway bars and bushings change and steer safe. I have driven it after every different mod, but not as many miles as I have now. This trip involved some pretty breezy conditions one day and extreme heavy traffic (around Atlanta). It is SOOO! much better now it's unreal.

I wasn't really expecting much out of the steer safe except blowout safety, but I must say, it really tightened the steering up. I know others have said it might mask a problem, but it really helped with the last bit of wander I had. I still want to have my steering gear checked for play, but I'm now very happy with all the mods I've done. There's really no one upgrade that made a huge difference over the others. They each helped a certain area and as one they have made a complete difference in my coach.

Thanks to all who encouraged me and helped with info on the changes. As I've said before, if I can help anyone or answer any questions please let me know.

Chad
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Old 07-11-2016, 04:19 PM   #193
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Just wanted to give an update after all the mods I've completed including the steer safe. I'm halfway into a couple weeks trip and have put a little over 500 miles with the suspension mods. I have to say it is a HUGE improvement over what I had before the sway bars and bushings change and steer safe. I have driven it after every different mod, but not as many miles as I have now. This trip involved some pretty breezy conditions one day and extreme heavy traffic (around Atlanta). It is SOOO! much better now it's unreal.

I wasn't really expecting much out of the steer safe except blowout safety, but I must say, it really tightened the steering up. I know others have said it might mask a problem, but it really helped with the last bit of wander I had. I still want to have my steering gear checked for play, but I'm now very happy with all the mods I've done. There's really no one upgrade that made a huge difference over the others. They each helped a certain area and as one they have made a complete difference in my coach.

Thanks to all who encouraged me and helped with info on the changes. As I've said before, if I can help anyone or answer any questions please let me know.

Chad
Chad,
GREAT to hear you are experiencing the joy of driving a decent handling coach. This is what we are all after! I have been hoping all along that with the correct suspension mods installed on the RR4R to make it the way it should have been from the factory, it would be possible to have a coach that handles properly. It sounds to me that you have struck that chord from your explanation. Congratulations! You have put a lot of $$$ and hard work into your coach by installing it all by yourself so you deserve to enjoy the benefits.

My coach is almost finished. It has been in the shop 2 1/2 weeks this time to have the rear anti sway bar installed. I have done some research on axle u-bolts and the consensus is that they are designed to be installed only once. Since mine have been installed twice (once at the factory and once to install the Source trailing arms) we would be torquing them down for the third time with the sway bar install. I can see the thread damage on all of them so I am having new ones made and they should arrive Wednesday. Hope to be test driving it this weekend with a little luck. At our local spring shop new u-bolts with nuts and washers are $22 each. Cheap insurance in my opinion. Everything is done and the only thing left is to install the u-bolts. Didn't think I would ever hear my self this but I hope it's real windy this weekend!
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Old 07-11-2016, 04:32 PM   #194
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Chad,
GREAT to hear you are experiencing the joy of driving a decent handling coach. This is what we are all after! I have been hoping all along that with the correct suspension mods installed on the RR4R to make it the way it should have been from the factory, it would be possible to have a coach that handles properly. It sounds to me that you have struck that chord from your explanation. Congratulations! You have put a lot of $$$ and hard work into your coach by installing it all by yourself so you deserve to enjoy the benefits.

My coach is almost finished. It has been in the shop 2 1/2 weeks this time to have the rear anti sway bar installed. I have done some research on axle u-bolts and the consensus is that they are designed to be installed only once. Since mine have been installed twice (once at the factory and once to install the Source trailing arms) we would be torquing them down for the third time with the sway bar install. I can see the thread damage on all of them so I am having new ones made and they should arrive Wednesday. Hope to be test driving it this weekend with a little luck. At our local spring shop new u-bolts with nuts and washers are $22 each. Cheap insurance in my opinion. Everything is done and the only thing left is to install the u-bolts. Didn't think I would ever hear my self this but I hope it's real windy this weekend!
Thanks Steve. Great to hear from you as well. Glad you are about to have yours done. I know you'll be glad to have it done. I won't say mine is perfect, but it's to the point I'm happy and I'm not sure where else to go to get any better. I would like to have the steering checked just to make sure it's okay. It really is much better after the steer safe (much to my surprise). But I still would like to know if it's correct or not.

As far as the u bolts, I thought the new trailing arms came with new u-bolts. That would make them the 2nd time being torqued. I could very well be wrong here just going off memory. If they are original I would be interested in knowing who you got yours from and if they would make another set and ship them to me. I'm like you, better safe than sorry.

Again good to hear from you and glad you got your alternator back to normal. After hearing of some others alternator problems, I'm thinking maybe I should take mine off and have it rebuilt. It's got me wondering.

Chad
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Old 07-12-2016, 07:51 PM   #195
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Thanks Steve. Great to hear from you as well. Glad you are about to have yours done. I know you'll be glad to have it done. I won't say mine is perfect, but it's to the point I'm happy and I'm not sure where else to go to get any better. I would like to have the steering checked just to make sure it's okay. It really is much better after the steer safe (much to my surprise). But I still would like to know if it's correct or not.

As far as the u bolts, I thought the new trailing arms came with new u-bolts. That would make them the 2nd time being torqued. I could very well be wrong here just going off memory. If they are original I would be interested in knowing who you got yours from and if they would make another set and ship them to me. I'm like you, better safe than sorry.

Again good to hear from you and glad you got your alternator back to normal. After hearing of some others alternator problems, I'm thinking maybe I should take mine off and have it rebuilt. It's got me wondering.

Chad
Chad,
You are probably correct about the Source Trailing arm kit including new u-bolts. I talked to Scott at Source yesterday and he was going to open up a kit and get me 4 of them if I wanted them but I found a much better deal here in Central Il and would not have to pay shipping for a 30lb pkg from Oregon to Central IL. Even if they were used only once it is advisable to get new ones.
According to my local spring shop the challenge is the 5 inch width of the u-bolts. Most u-bolts are not that wide so most spring shops do not have a die that wide. My local shop sent the dimensions to a shop in Kankakee IL yesterday and they made them up yesterday afternoon so they arrived here today. The overall price was about 1/3 of what the Source u-bolts plus shipping would have been. Today I asked my local spring shop if they would make u-bolts for all of us and ship them out to addresses in the continental US and he said yes. The challenge will be getting the dimensions to him. He pretty much demanded that I bring him an old one which was not a problem for me but may be for some. I still have one of my old u-bolts so you and I could talk and compare measurements and if you want to take the chance that our u-bolts are the same (which they most likely are IMHO) then I would take my old one to him so he could use it for the measurements. The shop in Kankakee IL would then drop ship them to you. My total for 4 springs with washers and nuts, plus tax and shipping was $108. Yours would be a little more for the longer shipping distance I imagine. I also asked for my new u-bolts to be one inch longer than the old ones because the new ones sit on top of the sway bar bushing brackets so a little more length was required.
You could also check with your local spring shop and ask if they could handle the 5 inch width - if they say yes, then take one of your u-bolts to them so they can see the radius of the bends. Chances are good you can save yourself some $$$ and have them made locally. But if it doesn't work out, let me know and we can get them made here for you - I want you to be safe. I think that would still be more cost effective than buying the Source u-bolts by quite a margin. I also called Monaco and they said they had some in stock and they were around $41 a piece plus shipping but I think the original u-bolts from Monaco were much smaller diameter than the ones that came with the Source Trailing Arm kit. Mine measured 7/8" in diameter and this is what you want - nothing less.
The alternator on our Cayman did fine on our recent trip up to Wisconsin. It was only about a 500 mile trip but I am satisfied the alternator is in fine shape now after the rebuild. My philosophy is generally to leave the sleeping dog lie - don't fix it if it ain't broke. If I were you and my alternator has never given me any trouble then I would not get it rebuilt. Leece NeVille alternators can go a looooooong time before requiring a rebuild - they are built very stout. Just my $.02 worth.
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Old 07-12-2016, 08:04 PM   #196
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Thanks Steve. I feel better about the alternator now. Just had me concerned with several folks including you about the age of mine having issues. Most times I've taken the same adage to leave well enough alone.

As far as the u bolts, I can't see why mine and yours would be any different. Let me check around and see if there's a shop that can make me a set. I just assumed they would have to come from Source. Never really even thought about being able to make them, duh!! I looked at mine really closely when I installed the sway bar and I couldn't see any stretched threads. Of course that's with the naked eye. I hate to put you out driving around taking u bolts for me. I'll try and see if their available around home. I do really appreciate the offer. Yes, I do remember mine were 7/8" also as I did replace the nuts. Thanks again,

Chad
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