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Old 06-02-2014, 03:51 PM   #757
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Here is something to ponder. I noticed before all of the improvements with the add ons that as a vehicle passed and caused the thing to really dive about that hitting the accelerator seemed to tighten things up a bit. Looking at the pictures posted it occurred to me that the torque from the drive shaft could cause the axel to shift or tighten up to one side and give momentary better tracking. The cross braces should take that out of course.
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Old 06-02-2014, 08:42 PM   #758
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HELP! I need your pix!

OK, guys, I need some help. Attached are two pix of the front suspension of my coach, a 2000 Dynasty 36 with a 7.5 Onan Quiet Diesel generator. I do not know how to annotate pix, so I did the best I could to point out two vertical 1-1/2" square tubing vertical support members that connect the rear of the generator slide assembly to the coach frame above. The pix were taken with the generator extended all the way out the front of the coach.

Here is what I need--would as many of you as possible please take pix of YOUR coach, that mimic the pix I took of my coach? I need to see if an idea I have is applicable to other coaches, and not just my own. You could post the pix here on the thread, or send them to me directly. If you do not have my direct email address, send me a private message and I'll get it to you.

I'm holding my breath, but all that lying around I did under my coach over the last weekend led me to one of those Eureka! moments. I'm sure what I have in mind will work on my coach. Now I just need to determine if it's applicable to a significant number of other coaches.

Thanks, guys!

Van W 2000 Dynasty 36, pulling one Harley
Eastern NC
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Old 06-03-2014, 07:49 AM   #759
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Van,
You have me interested. I am away from my RV for a few days, however your pictures look very familiar. I will get pics to you on Friday. I can also get measurements, if necessary.

Darin
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Old 06-03-2014, 03:25 PM   #760
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FINALLY the Van X Bars are now installed on our no longer made Navistar Monaco 36' 8 air bag motorhome chassis. Unpacking the two boxes of hardware and "white tubes" one can't help notice the TOP DRAW AMAZING quality of the components. The engineering that Van put into making this needed correction to the Roadmaster Chassis is beyond most of our capabilities. My son AAron summed it up best when he said think of a cardboard box with no ends. Try to stand it up and it will fall down folded almost flat. If you put X braces inside or the ends back on the box it will hold its rectangular shape. That is a simple analogy of the way our "H" frames on this particular chassis works. It took a "Van" and input from lots of members of this community to come up with a fix that Monaco and Navistar never thought of to fix this wondering chassis, and no wonder it was never completely tested before Monaco bought this future "bus" chassis. To bad Fleetwood didn't know how to make this good chassis into the BEST with 8 or 10 outboard air bags. Now they purchase theirs from outside chassis vendors. I only found two things that might be helpful to those who purchase their Van-X-Bars: some instructions and the "special" washer on the GOLD bolts should be turned around before shipping. Of course anyone who can turn a ratchet wrench can figure the above out without installation instructions. I personally printed some pictures of the installed Van-X-Bars that others already installed from the 760 blogs on this subject. THANK YOU Van for OUTSTANDING devotion for solving this problem and making our journeys in our MHs more enjoyable. deSanford PS just read he is working on the front of these Roadmaster Chassis.
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Old 06-03-2014, 11:16 PM   #761
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Quote:
Originally Posted by deSanford View Post
FINALLY the Van X Bars are now installed on our no longer made Navistar Monaco 36' 8 air bag motorhome chassis. Unpacking the two boxes of hardware and "white tubes" one can't help notice the TOP DRAW AMAZING quality of the components. The engineering that Van put into making this needed correction to the Roadmaster Chassis is beyond most of our capabilities. My son AAron summed it up best when he said think of a cardboard box with no ends. Try to stand it up and it will fall down folded almost flat. If you put X braces inside or the ends back on the box it will hold its rectangular shape. That is a simple analogy of the way our "H" frames on this particular chassis works. It took a "Van" and input from lots of members of this community to come up with a fix that Monaco and Navistar never thought of to fix this wondering chassis, and no wonder it was never completely tested before Monaco bought this future "bus" chassis. To bad Fleetwood didn't know how to make this good chassis into the BEST with 8 or 10 outboard air bags. Now they purchase theirs from outside chassis vendors. I only found two things that might be helpful to those who purchase their Van-X-Bars: some instructions and the "special" washer on the GOLD bolts should be turned around before shipping. Of course anyone who can turn a ratchet wrench can figure the above out without installation instructions. I personally printed some pictures of the installed Van-X-Bars that others already installed from the 760 blogs on this subject. THANK YOU Van for OUTSTANDING devotion for solving this problem and making our journeys in our MHs more enjoyable. deSanford PS just read he is working on the front of these Roadmaster Chassis.
Wow, Sanford! Now all my hats are too small. LOL

But to give credit where it is due, I might never have come up with this device if it were not for all the input from folks on this forum. It just goes to prove that you don't have to be a master mechanic to have valuable input into solving a mechanical problem. One of the most important things that members contributed was getting me to think of "no weld" solutions that almost anyone could do themselves. If you are not a welder yourself, a project that requires welding is often enough to cause you to drop consideration of the project completely.

Now, I think we are on the verge of a solution for the front suspension for those coaches that did not respond well enough to adding crossed rear braces. I'm working on something...

Van W 2000 Dynasty 36, pulling one Harley
Eastern NC
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Old 06-04-2014, 06:14 AM   #762
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I will get you some pictures today of my 08 Endeavor front end. The parts for the X braces are trickling in but I will definitely have them installed before my long trip. If you come up with something for the front end before I leave I would remove my steering shock while testing the brackets. Heck, I can sort of weld and will buy a welder if necessary. Now for getting an add on adaptive cruise control like my Ford Edge has. Really nice feature. Set the cruise control and it keeps a safe distance without having to fiddle with the control.
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Old 06-04-2014, 06:36 AM   #763
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Jim
Agree. Steering stabilizers attempt to mask the symptom of improper alignment, but do nothing to fix the problem, premature replacement of tires. May help in case of a front tire blowout, though.
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Old 06-04-2014, 07:31 AM   #764
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At Quartzsite this year two members showed up carrying Mig welders.
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Old 06-04-2014, 09:17 AM   #765
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At Quartzsite this year two members showed up carrying Mig welders.
Mike, what were they doing with the welders?

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Eastern NC
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Old 06-04-2014, 09:35 AM   #766
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All pictures taken leaning against the inside of the right tire looking towards the driver side.
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Old 06-04-2014, 10:58 AM   #767
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Van, It's one of my standard carry items, we full time so half of our lower stowage is loaded with tools.
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Old 06-04-2014, 10:59 AM   #768
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Guys, as I've said before, one thing that has always baffled me is how some coaches get truly excellent results from adding rear crossed braces, and some folks have said the difference is negligible. Only in the last week have I become aware of something that might explain that. Harry Martin told me, "Monaco's are like snowflakes--no two are alike." That is turning out to be more true than I would ever have imagined.

It is surprising enough to me that there are such variations in trailing arm and P-rod lengths. But now I'm realizing that the placement of the P-rod is not even uniform on the various H-frames. One would expect that they all would be in approximately the same location on the H-frame--centered or towards the rear of the H-frame or toward the front of the H-frame. It appears that Monaco located them wherever it was convenient considering the other components that had to be installed nearby. This is a seat-of-the-pants feeling, not supported by engineering analysis, but it would seem to me that the P-rod would do the most to stabilize the H-frame if it were located as near the center of the length of the trailing arms as possible. I would guess that the worst location for the front H-frame would be to locate it near the rear of the H-frame, BEHIND the axle and the trailing arm. That is the situation on my 2000 Dynasty.

But Harry Martin sent me a very clear sketch of his front H-frame, and it has the P-rod mounted near the front of the H-frame. Since if one wished to employ either an additional P-rod or a Watts link, you would want to mount it as far from the present P-rod as possible, in Harry's case the best placement would be BEHIND his front H-frame.

None of these variations necessarily eliminates using a Watts link, but the number of different mounting supports for the pivot bar might become large. On my 2000 Dynasty, as long as the Watts link is "inverted" (pivot bar mounted to coach chassis), it appears a Watts link could be attached at the front or rear of the H-frame, but would do the most good at the front.

I had hoped to get more pix by now, but if some of you (especially those who have installed crossed rear braces) could just tell me the approximate length of your front P-rod, and whether it is located at the front, center, or rear of your front H-frame, it would surely help. Thanks!
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Old 06-04-2014, 11:06 AM   #769
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Van, It's one of my standard carry items, we full time so half of our lower stowage is loaded with tools.
Holy Smokes! At least one reason I could never full-time is that I could not live without my home workshop. You must come as near as anyone to carrying your workshop with you, Mike!
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Old 06-04-2014, 11:15 AM   #770
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YC1, thanks so much for the pix. 1) It appears to me that your generator support framework is as sturdy as mine and could support the center pivot of a Watts link, especially since the pivot mount would also triangulate the two vertical supports. 2) It appears that your P-rod is located toward the rear of your front H-frame. Are both those statements correct?
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