Wandering, sway bars, alignment, ride height, oh my!!

[Gearhead383]

Great write up Van! After reading about your success, I suppose it's time to look into one of these mystery gadgets. Like yours, my p-rod also sits towards the rear of the "H" frame. I have two jacks up front so I guess I'll have to do some welding to provide a secure enough mount. I would like to see some pics when you get some time. I'm very interested to see what the similarities are between our chassis. Thanks again.
-Ron

[YC1]

Just double checking after re-reading the threads. The current part number for my M100 is a TAS65 126? They seem to be having some difficulties finding one? They had one but someone apparently got to it first.

Will I need spacers for this unit? If so, instead of having fancy round stand offs made why not just cut some square stock that is the proper thickness and drill it. Not as pretty but should do the trick don't you think?

[Vanwill]

Originally Posted by YC1

Just double checking after re-reading the threads. The current part number for my M100 is a TAS65 126? They seem to be having some difficulties finding one? They had one but someone apparently got to it first.

Will I need spacers for this unit? If so, instead of having fancy round stand offs made why not just cut some square stock that is the proper thickness and drill it. Not as pretty but should do the trick don't you think?

Myron, did you mean to post this on Craig's "Sheppard swap" thread? I think you are right about the spacers could be made different ways. Best to check with Craig the "prop jockey" (airplane pilot) about this, though. He is surely the resident expert on this swap. Wish I could take more credit for his work, but all I did was suggest he and I should look at replacing his Sheppard with a TRW, instead of rebuilding his Sheppard. Next thing I know, he's got it done before I ever even get to crawl under his coach! Smart boy, that Craig...fer a young 'un.

Can't wait to hear from you after your swap, though. It will put a smile on your mug from ear to ear.

[YC1]

Thanks Van. Guess I'm bleary eyed going back to each of the threads trying to make sure I have my stuff in a group. Apparently not.

[Vanwill]

Originally Posted by Gearhead383

Great write up Van! After reading about your success, I suppose it's time to look into one of these mystery gadgets. Like yours, my p-rod also sits towards the rear of the "H" frame. I have two jacks up front so I guess I'll have to do some welding to provide a secure enough mount. I would like to see some pics when you get some time. I'm very interested to see what the similarities are between our chassis. Thanks again.
-Ron

Ron, I cannot say that I'm perfectly happy with the fabrication details of my front Watts installation, even though I'm SUPER happy with the results. I'll attach a few pix. If they make sense to you, that's great. If not, perhaps your front setup is not like mine.

On my coach, the only vertical members attached to the coach body that were forward of the H-frame were two 1-1/2" square tubes used partially to support the tracks the genny slides in and out on. On the driver's side, the 1-1/2" square tube is also welded to another rectangular tube that runs horizontally forward to form part of the mount for the steering gear.

Those two vertical tubes were all I had to mount my Watts pivot bar to, and they were more "spindly" than I would have liked. Hopefully, you can see from the pix that I welded pieces of 1-1/2 x 3 rectangular tube to the rear side of them to stiffen them fore-and-aft and to allow some room for the genny's wiring to "fold up" as the genny is retracted.

And since the forces on the Watts pivot bar are horizontally left and right, I needed to stiffen the 1-1/2" tubes in the side-to-side direction. To do that, I mounted a 1/4 x 6 plate straddling the two 1-1/2" vertical tubes to make a platform for the Watts pivot. As you can see from the pix, I used (6) 3/8-16 Grade 8 bolts on each side of the plate. Had I been certain of the vertical position the plate would end up, I would have simply welded it. The multiple bolt locations allowed me to move the Watts pivot up or down in 1” increments. I welded a piece of 3” channel to the 1/4” plate to place the Watts pivot in the correct location relative to the front crossmember of the H-frame.

Another difference between front and rear mounted H-frames is the location of the link end brackets. When the Watts link is mounted to the rear of the H-frame, the link end brackets can be located further outward, almost to the air bag mounts. In a front installation, the links must be quite a bit shorter to prevent interfering with the trailing arms. In my case, the links were 13” (plus the rod ends). In the front installation, the links cannot extend into the travel area of the trailing arms, and must therefore be placed further inward. I first thought this might be a problem, but after mounting everything, I ran the coach all the way down on the bag stops and jacked it all the way up to the shock extension limit. The rotation of the Watts pivot was still a modest amount. That proved not to be a problem.

I hope the pix make sense. I took a bunch of them but these are the three that best show how it works. The first pix is taken from the driver's side, the second from the passenger side, and the last shows the Watts pivot in the center. I’ll take more pix as I delve into another couple of issues in the front end. If you have any questions, let me know.

[JDL]

Van,
My "snowflake" and yours are very similar. I laid under the coach this past weekend with the link in hand working on the mounting solution.

I like the way you added the 3" tubing better than the arms I was thinking of building. The channel created by the tubing will offer more isolation for the fuel and electrical lines of the genny. Its also a simpler mounting design.


Thanks for the work and the pictures.

Darin

[Sheriffbubba]

I finally got my Source Engineering / Roadmaster anti sway bars mounted under my 08 Endeavor on Friday... They were installed by Brazels RV Performance and they were a pleasure to deal with. They know their stuff when it comes to the Roadmaster chassis.
I also had them install eight comfort control valves... One on each airbag.
I drove the rig home today, 130 miles, and it drove like a new motorhome! Much more stable and handles bumps and dips better.
Not the cheapest mod, but worth the money in my opinion.
Getting ready to go to the Crater Lake Oregon area next month so these improvements will make the drive more enjoyable for me and the wife.
I still need to get the steering box changed out to a TRW unit, but I'm pretty happy for now.

Brian.


Sent from my iPad using iRV2 - RV Forum

[Vanwill]

Originally Posted by Sheriffbubba

I finally got my Source Engineering / Roadmaster anti sway bars mounted under my 08 Endeavor on Friday... They were installed by Brazels RV Performance and they were a pleasure to deal with. They know their stuff when it comes to the Roadmaster chassis.
I also had them install eight comfort control valves... One on each airbag.
I drove the rig home today, 130 miles, and it drove like a new motorhome! Much more stable and handles bumps and dips better.
Not the cheapest mod, but worth the money in my opinion.
Getting ready to go to the Crater Lake Oregon area next month so these improvements will make the drive more enjoyable for me and the wife.
I still need to get the steering box changed out to a TRW unit, but I'm pretty happy for now.

Brian.


Sent from my iPad using iRV2 - RV Forum

Brian,

If you are happy with what you've done, just wait until you change the steering box!

[deSanford]

Yes I agree with Van change the steering box if you have a Sheppard. Sanford

[nodine]

Originally Posted by Vanwill

Brian,

If you are happy with what you've done, just wait until you change the steering box!

Ditto on the TRW swap. I am a slow leaner and did the steering box swap last. The coach was already a very nice handling coach with Koni shocks, Roadmaster sway bars front and back, Blue Ox TruCenter, and a front Watts link. Even with all that, putting in the TRW with no play made a significant improvement in handling and wind tolerance.

Bob

[Voyager35L]

I just returned from 4k miles in a 2015 Fleetwood Bound with an F53 chassis V10. I want to install something to stabilize the steering. I have used Davis Tru-Trak in the past on an Winnebago Workhorse and it did ok. Has anyone installed any steering assist mechanisms on a Bounder F53 chassis? I am looking for suggestions. I want up to date and current equipment.

[Gearhead383]

Originally Posted by Vanwill

Ron, I cannot say that I'm perfectly happy with the fabrication details of my front Watts installation, even though I'm SUPER happy with the results. I'll attach a few pix. If they make sense to you, that's great. If not, perhaps your front setup is not like mine.

Van,

Thank for the pics. They do help a lot. Once I get a few other projects caught up, I'll probably bother you and some other folks on the installation. But first, I need to fab up the supports as you did. Too many hobbies and not enough time...

[Vanwill]

Originally Posted by Voyager35L

I just returned from 4k miles in a 2015 Fleetwood Bound with an F53 chassis V10. I want to install something to stabilize the steering. I have used Davis Tru-Trak in the past on an Winnebago Workhorse and it did ok. Has anyone installed any steering assist mechanisms on a Bounder F53 chassis? I am looking for suggestions. I want up to date and current equipment.

Voyager, this thread pertains only to the Roadmaster (Monaco products) chassis. I think there is a forum that pertains only to your F53 chassis. I'm sure you can find help there.

[mhughes]

It has been a while since I posted to the thread. Busy working for a living and no real time for hobbies lately.

I've completed another variation of the front Watts linkage. Changes were made to accommodate the use of steering tie rod ends instead of Heim joints. On installation the bell crank will be angled to clear the jack much as pictured here. Does not affect the operation.

A few of the the details are:
3/8" grade 5 U-bolts instead of bolts and clamps.
H-Frame bracket has a top tension bolt to keep the bracket from rocking.
11" bell crank with ends offset to the rear 5/8".
5/8" Steering Tie Rod ends (Federal Mogul).
Brackets and bell crank are reamed with a 7 degree (1 1/2" ft) taper.
1 1/8" 6061 Aluminum tubes swedged and threaded to 5/8".
2" x 2" Angle mounting brackets are notched to clear welds on the jack mount.

On the next set I'll be reducing the thickness of the H-Frame clamps to 3/8" and adding gussets to the top tensioner bolt mount. With the three way mounting I don't believe I need near as much clamping force to hold the bracket in alignment.

I'll be vacationing in Oregon next week and will drop these off to two of our group members. One is install themselves and the other is paying an alignment shop to do the install.