Understanding weight rating labels?

[wandrlst]

1, The numbers like 3402/7500 is the kilograms/pounds
2, See definitions posted re GVWR, GAWR and GCWR
3, You must have a label (NHTSA rules) that states capacities, tire pressures etc. The tire pressures are usually low and you must get it weighed and use tire load tables. Really should weight four corners and set pressures to heaviest side on each axle.
CCC This was the cargo carrying capacity from 2000 to 2008. It is the capacity you have AFTER having full fuel, full water, and 4 people.
In 2008 NHTSA (in a dumb move) changed the standard to
OCCC (occupant and cargo carrying capacity) depending on your actual build date , you may show this
OCCC is capacity with full fuel and no water and no passengers. This make the cargo capacity seem much larger (in the number quoted) but is often seriously wrong as the front to back loading of the water and passengers (usually on the front axle) may cause one axle to be over.
You ccan always try to dump your water to travel but you may have partially full grey and black which is the same weight- It makes sense to know and use the capacity with full water for this reason.
It is law that the seller has that label and the new 2008 law also demands that any change in weight caused by the dealer options must be reflected on that label. If you don't have it , get the dealer to have it weighed 4 corners with full liquids .
By far, most accidents are due to overloaded /under inflated tires . Just google motorhome crash tire failure 2011
A fortune for the rig and save a few bucks on tires

Quote:

Originally Posted by DGShaffer I'm trying to determine the current load on my Outlaw. I had it weighed on my way out for vacation. The front shows 6,480 lbs and the rear 15,480 for a total of 22,320. The GVWR is 22,000 and the GCWR 26,000 which tells me I have a carrying capacity of 4,000 lbs. this is great considering I weighed in at 22,320 this would tell me I'm light of the GCWR by 3,680 pounds. Here's my confusion. The front weight has this set of numbers 3,402/7,500 and the rear 6,577/14,550 Adding up the 7,500 and 24,500 I get the GVWR of 22,000. The weight ticket showed the front at 6,840 which is less than the labeled 7,500. however, the rear weighed in at 15,480 which exceeds the label for the rear of 14,500. If I have a 4,000 lb carrying capacity, where in the numbers above can I tell how much of that can be carried up front and how much at the rear. I have a feeling these labels 3,402/7,500 and 6,577/14,500 are telling my be I can't make sense of them. Any idea how to figure out how I can arrange my carrying weight?

[DGShaffer]

Quote:

Originally Posted by wandrlst 1, The numbers like 3402/7500 is the kilograms/pounds 2, See definitions posted re GVWR, GAWR and GCWR 3, You must have a label (NHTSA rules) that states capacities, tire pressures etc. The tire pressures are usually low and you must get it weighed and use tire load tables. Really should weight four corners and set pressures to heaviest side on each axle. CCC This was the cargo carrying capacity from 2000 to 2008. It is the capacity you have AFTER having full fuel, full water, and 4 people. In 2008 NHTSA (in a dumb move) changed the standard to OCCC (occupant and cargo carrying capacity) depending on your actual build date , you may show this OCCC is capacity with full fuel and no water and no passengers. This make the cargo capacity seem much larger (in the number quoted) but is often seriously wrong as the front to back loading of the water and passengers (usually on the front axle) may cause one axle to be over. You ccan always try to dump your water to travel but you may have partially full grey and black which is the same weight- It makes sense to know and use the capacity with full water for this reason. It is law that the seller has that label and the new 2008 law also demands that any change in weight caused by the dealer options must be reflected on that label. If you don't have it , get the dealer to have it weighed 4 corners with full liquids . By far, most accidents are due to overloaded /under inflated tires . Just google motorhome crash tire failure 2011 A fortune for the rig and save a few bucks on tires

Thanks for this post as well as the posts by others.
It seems as though the Diesel models have an additional 5k of carrying capacity which I'm curious about. I would have thought having a diesel might give you more towing power but it seems they have different suspension as well. My Scorpion model has a pretty heavy bed tucked in up top on electric levelers. This weight is as far back as you can get it so I'm sure that has something to do with the overloading issue of the rear axle. I may see what's involved with getting that out for trips where I plan on carrying more weight.
For now, my plan is to rearrange all the cargo I have stored in the bays with consideration to the weight of the items bringing the heavier items up front.

Thanks again for all the comments and information. Some homework is in order.

[Vicap]

IMHO the difference in weight limits between diesel and gas is the chassis the models are built on. I have a Freightliner which is designed for heavy stuff...gas models are either Workhorse or Fords - a little more lightweight.

PS - I too have the bed recessed in the ceiling.

[DGShaffer]

I have a feeling that's exactly it. I'd be interested in looking underneath a Freightliner chassis to see how differently it's constructed. All of these should have been built on that chassis. I'm assuming you also have tires rated for the additional weight. Mine are Michelin 235/80 22.5" x 7.5" and they have a 7940# weight rating per axle end at 95 PSI so at least my tires are at the correct pressure for the weight I was carrying.

Overall I'm still happy with my Outlaw and with the Ford V-10 on the F53 chassis. I'm just better off knowing how I need to load it now than I was.

[Vicap]

My tires are Goodyear, 255/70 22.5x8.25 rated at 10k# and 120 psi. This is such an interesting discussion. Thanks for the continued info.

[DGShaffer]

I've been looking around at discussions across the net about carrying capacities of toy haulers. I find it interesting that although the Outlaw is one of the most popular, their weight limitations are in question.

I find this interesting only because IT'S A DAMN TOY HAULER!!!!!! Why make a unit that CAN'T HAUL MY DAMN TOYS!!!!!!

Had I thought for a minute that a toy hauler needed to be evaluate prior to purchase for it's ability TO HAUL MY DAMN TOYS, I would have done so. Instead, I assumed that it was purpose built to HAUL TOYS!

Never the less, with properly inflated tires and by relocating heavier items towards the front axle I'll be OK with my bike in the back (good thing I hadn't intended to carry a car!) and occasionally with two bikes back there.

I still love my Outlaw! It's the Damon marketing and design groups I have an issue with now!

[gmadams]

I am confused. My MH has a front GAWR of 6500 lb and a rear GAWR of 11000 lb. The combined weight of occupants and cargo should not exceed 1886 lbs which includes a full load of water at 465 lbs. So I have 1421 of weight available for people and other cargo.

I weighted my MH and toad today and the front axle is at 6200 lbs and the read axle is at 8320 lbs. The toad came in at 4100 lbs.

I can't find what my GCWR should be. Is this written down somewhere? Am I OK? Can I still add additional cargo weight (food, supplies, etc.)? I don't know how to determine what effect my toad has on my weight limitations.

[DGShaffer]

It seems that you're within limits all around. I'm surprised the GCVW isn't listed on your placard but I'd be shocked if it wasn't rated to pull it.

I found this online under a search for the 2012 A.C.E EVO 29.1:
Chassis Ford Triton Engine GVWR 16,000 lbs
Chassis Ford Triton Engine GCWR 26,000 lbs

Seems you have a 10k differential

[gmadams]

Quote:

Originally Posted by DGShaffer It seems that you're within limits all around. I'm surprised the GCVW isn't listed on your placard but I'd be shocked if it wasn't rated to pull it. I found this online under a search for the 2012 A.C.E EVO 29.1: Chassis Ford Triton Engine GVWR 16,000 lbs Chassis Ford Triton Engine GCWR 26,000 lbs Seems you have a 10k differential

Thanks for the quick response. Does that mean in theory, I can have a toad with a GVWR of that 10000 lb difference? I know that I can't do that in reality because of the limitations from my hitch which is 5000 lbs. And I sure wouldn't want to try and pulll that much weight.

[DGShaffer]

According to the Thor site and the information you have listed in your SIG line, that's it!

2012 ACE Motorhomes: Class A & Class C Hybrid RV by Thor Motor Coach

[gmadams]

Thanks Don. Guess I should do more research before I ask questions like that....

[DGShaffer]

Just ask away, sometimes the answer isn't this easy to find. It does look pretty cut and dried according to their published data.

However, the 11,000 and 6,500 you listed exceeds their listed 16,000 GVWR by 1,700. Something to look into.

[wandrlst]

Quote:

Originally Posted by gmadams I am confused. My MH has a front GAWR of 6500 lb and a rear GAWR of 11000 lb. The combined weight of occupants and cargo should not exceed 1886 lbs which includes a full load of water at 465 lbs. So I have 1421 of weight available for people and other cargo. I weighted my MH and toad today and the front axle is at 6200 lbs and the read axle is at 8320 lbs. The toad came in at 4100 lbs. I can't find what my GCWR should be. Is this written down somewhere? Am I OK? Can I still add additional cargo weight (food, supplies, etc.)? I don't know how to determine what effect my toad has on my weight limitations.

300 pound capacity on the front axle is a concern. Was your weighing with full fuel? Full water? (although you may empty water tank for a trip, the grey and black sometimes cannot be controlled so using full water is safer and more realistic.) The driver and passenger put 10% more then their combined weights on the front axle (they are in front of the axle- so leverage) . So if you had full water and fuel and then include only 2 people, you are at front axle limit. 4 passengers--WELL over. All cargo would have to go above or behind the rear axle-- Basically impossible - But sadly is the problem with many RV's. NHTSA has repeatedly ignored this problem which is probably a major player in the loss of control of large diesel pushers after a front tire blow-out. Owners with the problem should be complaining to them. Always weigh your rig realistically LOADED.
R

[gmadams]

Quote:

Originally Posted by wandrlst 300 pound capacity on the front axle is a concern. Was your weighing with full fuel? Full water? (although you may empty water tank for a trip, the grey and black sometimes cannot be controlled so using full water is safer and more realistic.) The driver and passenger put 10% more then their combined weights on the front axle (they are in front of the axle- so leverage) . So if you had full water and fuel and then include only 2 people, you are at front axle limit. 4 passengers--WELL over. All cargo would have to go above or behind the rear axle-- Basically impossible - But sadly is the problem with many RV's. NHTSA has repeatedly ignored this problem which is probably a major player in the loss of control of large diesel pushers after a front tire blow-out. Owners with the problem should be complaining to them. Always weigh your rig realistically LOADED. R

I had a full tank of gas but no water. I'm included in the weight but no one else. Most of the cargo was loaded but not everything. This is the first time I have had the setup weighted. I wanted to get a base weigth to see where I stand of everything before we were fully loaded and ready to hit the road.