Understanding weight rating labels?

[DGShaffer]

I'm trying to determine the current load on my Outlaw. I had it weighed on my way out for vacation. The front shows 6,480 lbs and the rear 15,480 for a total of 22,320.

The GVWR is 22,000 and the GCWR 26,000 which tells me I have a carrying capacity of 4,000 lbs. this is great considering I weighed in at 22,320 this would tell me I'm light of the GCWR by 3,680 pounds.

Here's my confusion. The front weight has this set of numbers 3,402/7,500 and the rear 6,577/14,550

Adding up the 7,500 and 24,500 I get the GVWR of 22,000. The weight ticket showed the front at 6,840 which is less than the labeled 7,500. however, the rear weighed in at 15,480 which exceeds the label for the rear of 14,500.

If I have a 4,000 lb carrying capacity, where in the numbers above can I tell how much of that can be carried up front and how much at the rear. I have a feeling these labels 3,402/7,500 and 6,577/14,500 are telling my be I can't make sense of them.

Any idea how to figure out how I can arrange my carrying weight?

[TXiceman]

The GCWR is the total weight of the RV plus any thing you are towing. Your coach setting on the tow axles has a weight limit of 22,000#, so by your weights, you already have 120# over the coaches load limits.

You need to look at the front and rear axle GAWR to see how much weight you can carry on each axle.

To get your towing capacity, weigh the coach and this is you LADEN vehicel weight rating...or LVW.

GVWR -LVW = coach load capacity...you are already over loaded.

GCWR - LVW = max capacity you can tow which is less than 4000# since you are over the GVWR.

By your weight tickets you are over loaded on the rear axles by 920#.

If you have full water and wand/or waste tanks, you need to dump them,

Time to put the rig on a diet.

Ken

[lonestarace]

Your over weight! on the rear axle. Your rear axle gross weight shouldn't be more than 14,500 Lbs. I hope you can shift some weight forward and loose some weight?
Your Gross vehicle weight rating(GVWR) is 22,000 Lbs without towing anything.
You have the ability to tow 4000 Lbs giving you a Combined vehicle weight rating(GVWR) of 26,000 Lbs.
We hope this helps.
Don

[Dr4Film]

CCC = Cargo Carrying Capacity

That should be listed on your weight rating tag somewhere.

Dr4Film ----- Richard

[Crabby Mike]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr4Film CCC = Cargo Carrying Capacity That should be listed on your weight rating tag somewhere. Dr4Film ----- Richard

It might be ... but don't get too excited about it. Some rigs don't list it at all, but even if they do, it's based on your GVWR less an assumed "empty" weight. Much better to do as the OP appears to have done -- weigh your coach loaded as you would normally travel, then adjust as necessary.

Just don't kid yourself about your GCWR -- it has nothing to do with anything other than towing capacity. You can't "borrow" from excess towing capacity to overload the rig itself.

[Davdeb1]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Crabby Mike It might be ... but don't get too excited about it. Some rigs don't list it at all, but even if they do, it's based on your GVWR less an assumed "empty" weight. Much better to do as the OP appears to have done -- weigh your coach loaded as you would normally travel, then adjust as necessary. Just don't kid yourself about your GCWR -- it has nothing to do with anything other than towing capacity. You can't "borrow" from excess towing capacity to overload the rig itself.

Ok, maybe a dumb question, couldn't you just put the excess is a toad? As long as you didn't over load it past gcwr?

[TXiceman]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Davdeb1 Ok, maybe a dumb question, couldn't you just put the excess is a toad? As long as you didn't over load it past gcwr?

Yes

Ken

[DGShaffer]

I'm in a bit of an odd situation having a Toy Hauler. It seems as though I can't haul any toys? I am carrying a lot of wood and I weighed it with a full tank of fuel and water. Not carrying our own wood and traveling with enough water to get us where we're going is the only way to go from now on. Another owner of a Damon Outlaw was told that it had a 2100 pound carrying capacity and is now carrying a Smart car which would severely overload it.

Thank you all for helping me understand this issue. Not so happy but better informed

[KC1BUD]

If what your towing is vehicle with 4 wheels on the ground then you have a towing capacity of 4000 pounds.
However, if your towing a trailer then the tongue weight of the trailer affects the total loaded weight of the motor home. Typically the tongue weight is around 10 percent of the trailer total weight, especially if a weight distribution hitch is used.

So 4000 pound properly loaded on a trailer would have a tongue weight of around 400 pounds.


I will say this, I have hauled four horse steel horse trailer with four horses and an eleven and a half foot camper in the back of a pickup at the same time, the truck was a 4 wheel drive with a 350CI engine and a turbo 350 transmission. No doubt it was overloaded, especially since I had to extend the tongue of the trailer 6 foot in order to get enough turning clearance.

For the curious, a steel 4 horse trailer can be around 2000 pounds empty, more or less,(I think ours was 2500 pounds as I recall) and the usual allowance for the weight of each saddle horse is 1000 to 1200 pounds each. This doesn't account for tack and feed.

I have hauled many truck/motor home and trailer combinations since that were over loaded to some extent, never had a failure of any kind related to being over GVW, GVWR and GCWR in over 30 years of towing. As a final note most of my towing has been in the flatter regions of the country, and not in mountains of the east or west.

For more information on all of these terms and more go to;

GVW and Towing

I had no problems at all hauling this way, but I would never recommend that anyone try this. To do so is at your own risk.

[Mr_D]

From RVIA:

Quote:

RATINGS are LIMITS established by the manufacturer, which are not to be exceeded. Ratings are based on structural strength, drive train strength, braking power, stability, controllability, and performance. Exceeding a rating invites unsafe conditions, potential damage, may void a warranty, may complicate an insurance claim, and in some cases, may violate a law. GVWR: Gross Vehicle Weight Rating The MAXIMUM ALLOWABLE WEIGHT of the fully loaded vehicle, including liquids, passengers, cargo, and the tongue weight of any towed vehicle. GAWR: Gross Axle Weight Rating The MAXIMUM ALLOWABLE WEIGHT each axle assembly is designed to carry, as measured at the tires, therefore including the weight of the axle assembly itself. GAWR is established by considering the rating of each of its components (tires, wheels, springs, axle), and rating the axle on its weakest link. The GAWR assumes that the LOAD IS EQUAL ON EACH SIDE. GCWR; Gross Combined Weight Rating The MAXIMUM ALLOWABLE COMBINED WEIGHT of the tow vehicle and the attached towed vehicle. GCWR assumes that both vehicles have functioning brakes, with exceptions in some cases for very light towed vehicles, normally less than 1,500 pounds. (Check your chassis manual or towing guide.) HITCH RATINGS GTWR: Gross Trailer Weight Rating The MAXIMUM TOWED VEHICLE WEIGHT. Each component (receiver, drawbar, ball) of a ball-type hitch has its own rating. Some ball-type hitches have separate ratings when used with a weight distributing system. TWR/TLR/VLR: Tongue Weight, Tongue Load, Vertical Load Rating Different terms for the MAXIMUM VERTICAL LOAD that can be carried by the hitch. TIRE RATINGS The MAXIMUM LOAD that a tire may carry is engraved on the sidewall, along with a corresponding COLD inflation pressure. A reduction in inflation pressure requires a reduction in load rating. Tire manufacturers publish charts that establish the load capacity at various inflation pressures WEIGHT and LOAD. These terms are generally used interchangeably. For the purposes of understanding RV applications, vehicles have WEIGHT, which impart LOADS to tires, axles, and hitches. Scale measurements taken when weighing are LOADS carried by the tires. These measured loads are used to calculate Gross Vehicle Weight (GVW), Gross Axle Weight (GAW), Gross Combination Weight (GCW), and hitch loads. UVW: Unloaded Vehicle Weight (1996 RVIA Definition) The WEIGHT of a vehicle as built at the factory with full fuel, engine(generator) oil and coolants. It does not include cargo, fresh water, LP gas, occupants, or dealer installed accessories. NCC: Net Carrying Capacity (1996 RVIA Definition, but no longer used) The MAXIMUM WEIGHT of all personal belongings, food, fresh water, LP gas, tools, dealer installed accessories, etc., that can be carried by the RV. SCWR: Sleeping Capacity Weight Rating (2000 RVIA Definition) The manufacturers designated number of sleeping positions multiplied by 154 pounds (70 kilograms) CCC: Cargo Carrying Capacity (2000 RVIA Definition) Equal to GVWR minus each of the following: UVW. full fresh potable water weight (including water heater), full LP gas weight and SCWR. LIQUID WEIGHTS (pounds per gallon) * Water: 8.3 * Gasoline: 5.6 * Diesel Fuel: 6.8 * Propane: 4.2

Also: don't depend on the NCC given for a vehicle, it is probably wrong. Our DSDP had a NCC of 5,200#'s. We didn't load it with all the options like real tile floor or washer/dryer. Even so at delivery our CCC was only 663#'s and all of that was on the rear axle as the front was overloaded by 50# before we ever got in or loaded a thing.

[BpK9Miami]

Don my friend, if you're considered over weight and need to put your's on a diet, I better think about leaving mine parked at the curb.

It sounds like I need to go to the weight station again and double check.

[Lindaxtwo]

Don,
Your weights will affect what psi your tire needs to be inflated to. We just had our 2012 Outlaw weighed this morning and are making some "corrections". We're in Livingston at the Escapee park and had each tire weighed at the "Smart Weigh" center. Great service...we know where we stand now.

[Vicap]

Quote:

Originally Posted by DGShaffer I'm in a bit of an odd situation having a Toy Hauler. It seems as though I can't haul any toys? I am carrying a lot of wood and I weighed it with a full tank of fuel and water. Not carrying our own wood and traveling with enough water to get us where we're going is the only way to go from now on. Another owner of a Damon Outlaw was told that it had a 2100 pound carrying capacity and is now carrying a Smart car which would severely overload it. Thank you all for helping me understand this issue. Not so happy but better informed

I think DGShaffer is talking about me as the person carrying the Smart. He has a gas model and I have a diesel. Here is a reprint of a post I made under another listing that deals with the weight issues:

My GCWR is 30,000 lbs (diesel vs. gas is the difference with DGShaffer's smaller GCWR I guess). I stopped at Friendly Gus's Truck Stop on I16 in GA and was the first RV the attendent had ever weighed. The full ensemble totaled 25,780 lbs which is way below the max. Front allowance is 10k, I weigh 8,320. Rear allowance is 17,500, I weighed in at 17,460. Fuel tank almost full, fresh water about 50 gal, empty black and gray water tanks. Interesting notes: the rear axle was 2/3rd of the total weight; the Smart Car is only about 15% of the rear weight and about 10% of the total weight. My garage has a sign on the door that states no more than 2500 lbs can be carried back there so the Smart car is within that limit too.

Not all Outlaws are created equal!

[BpK9Miami]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vicap I think DGShaffer is talking about me as the person carrying the Smart. He has a gas model and I have a diesel. Here is a reprint of a post I made under another listing that deals with the weight issues: My GCWR is 30,000 lbs (diesel vs. gas is the difference with DGShaffer's smaller GCWR I guess). I stopped at Friendly Gus's Truck Stop on I16 in GA and was the first RV the attendent had ever weighed. The full ensemble totaled 25,780 lbs which is way below the max. Front allowance is 10k, I weigh 8,320. Rear allowance is 17,500, I weighed in at 17,460. Fuel tank almost full, fresh water about 50 gal, empty black and gray water tanks. Interesting notes: the rear axle was 2/3rd of the total weight; the Smart Car is only about 15% of the rear weight and about 10% of the total weight. My garage has a sign on the door that states no more than 2500 lbs can be carried back there so the Smart car is within that limit too. Not all Outlaws are created equal!

Don and Vicap got me to thinking that I hadn't looked at my plate for awhile and perhaps I should peek under that pesky steering wheel to see where I stood.

Vicap - my label pretty much tracks your's..GCWR 30K, GVWR 27k, Front 10k and Rear 17,5k. But, my rear label shows a limit of 2100 lbs (because of the murphy bed I'm guessing. However, we (few) diesel owners get a few more pounds to pack away more toys anyway.