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Old 12-13-2018, 09:54 PM   #57
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I am completely new at this and have no idea how to PM someone. I also have a 650 that dropped a valve and would like to contact 08navigator to see what his fix is, but have no idea how to do it. Please help.
http://www.irv2.com/forums/private.p...newpm&u=246224
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Old 12-14-2018, 08:18 PM   #58
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Mark D....thanks for the pics.

Here’s a few pics of my head, intake ports and one of the number six cylinder intake valves. A pretty dirty intake on such a low mileage engine, no wonder some of these engines have failures and don’t make it to what one would think to be a normal overhaul time/mileage. The valve definitely has corrosive pit marks. Probably would have ran quite awhile yet.....just don’t know when the chunk of carbon or junk would have built up on the valve stem enough to sluff off and become lodged between the valve and seat (and then slapped by the piston) or the pitting and corrosion would have caused the valve itself to fail. All the cross hatches are excellent. Notice the BFH......one of the best tools made to get things apart with......22 hrs labor to date.
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Old 12-15-2018, 09:04 AM   #59
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Mark D....thanks for the pics.

Here’s a few pics of my head, intake ports and one of the number six cylinder intake valves. A pretty dirty intake on such a low mileage engine, no wonder some of these engines have failures and don’t make it to what one would think to be a normal overhaul time/mileage. The valve definitely has corrosive pit marks. Probably would have ran quite awhile yet.....just don’t know when the chunk of carbon or junk would have built up on the valve stem enough to sluff off and become lodged between the valve and seat (and then slapped by the piston) or the pitting and corrosion would have caused the valve itself to fail. All the cross hatches are excellent. Notice the BFH......one of the best tools made to get things apart with......22 hrs labor to date.
I wonder if that's from too much idling? Did the mechanic think that much build up was abnormal, seems like it's a bit to much.

Did you need to remove any bracing to get to the head?
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Old 12-15-2018, 12:58 PM   #60
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Yes the head/lead mechanic thought the intake track was excessively dirty along with the build up on the valves, plus the pitting....problems in time was his comment. He also commented that the exhaust valve seals were leaking, I guess he must have thought that was odd for no more miles than on the engine? From your pics we removed more bracing than on your RV.
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Old 12-15-2018, 02:30 PM   #61
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Yes the head/lead mechanic thought the intake track was excessively dirty along with the build up on the valves, plus the pitting....problems in time was his comment. He also commented that the exhaust valve seals were leaking, I guess he must have thought that was odd for no more miles than on the engine? From your pics we removed more bracing than on your RV.
After reading this thread, the filter that is in the exhaust pipe is what causes the pistons to get bathed in acidic exhaust backup causing what Mr. D called chordial something. I am the one with the 500 is that has been done almost 12 month. I know the our mechanic had to replace the particulate filter as it was 99% clogged. We are currently looking for a part to replace the sensor s that Cummins had replaced in the spring of 17 which also failed. They had installed the wrong one and torqued it down cracking it. Just the latest bobble in a whole line of bobbles. We continue to wait patiently after having 30 gs into it.
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Old 12-15-2018, 02:39 PM   #62
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"Chordal malfunction" is what Cummins calls it in their white papers and TSB that they have published.
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Old 12-15-2018, 08:06 PM   #63
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Originally Posted by Hiflyer421 View Post
Yes the head/lead mechanic thought the intake track was excessively dirty along with the build up on the valves, plus the pitting....problems in time was his comment. He also commented that the exhaust valve seals were leaking, I guess he must have thought that was odd for no more miles than on the engine? From your pics we removed more bracing than on your RV.
https://www.cambustion.com/products/egr

Read this, it explains the process. Maybe the EGR valve is defective or something else is at fault. Better to spend a few dollars more now than loads later.
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Old 12-18-2018, 07:32 AM   #64
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Reading this thread I am amazed at some of the high dollar coaches experiencing these failures such as Mark D and his American Coach or Lady Puffin with a Foretravel. I realize the RV manufacturer and Cummins are two seperate entities, but it has to add to the frustrations with these expensive repairs.
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Old 12-18-2018, 02:54 PM   #65
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Reading this thread I am amazed at some of the high dollar coaches experiencing these failures such as Mark D and his American Coach or Lady Puffin with a Foretravel. I realize the RV manufacturer and Cummins are two seperate entities, but it has to add to the frustrations with these expensive repairs.
Cummins is the only option at this time for the most part. I dont blame the coach company, in fact every issue I have had was not due to poor build quality. It was due to an accessory that could have been installed by a different manufacturer.

I do agree that Cummins big mean engine maybe even their flagship engine has more issues than expected and costly.

My wife say a Prevost based Coach yesterday 2015 Milenial edition I think. As we passed it she said look 3 slide outs. "Yes dear but they are expensive". She, knowing I am frugal looked it up and found one for 2.2 million. She stopped asking.

I do wonder if any Prevost based coaches have an ISX with the valve issues?
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Old 12-18-2018, 03:10 PM   #66
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I do wonder if any Prevost based coaches have an ISX with the valve issues?
I think they use mostly DD engines or lower HP Cummins than the 600 or 650 ISX.
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Old 12-18-2018, 03:18 PM   #67
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I think they use mostly DD engines or lower HP Cummins than the 600 or 650 ISX.
Believe older Prevost coaches used the DD 6v/92 and 8v/92 two strokes. In the early 90's went to DD series 60 engines. In 2008 they started using the Volvo d13.
Several coach manufacturers used them in their heavier highline coaches, appears any of the earlier ISX's in any coach can have this problem.
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Old 12-18-2018, 03:32 PM   #68
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I think they use mostly DD engines or lower HP Cummins than the 600 or 650 ISX.

Most of the transit-grade chassis used Detroit Diesel 60 series (some may still). Prevost switched to Volvo engines around 2008/2009, IIRC.


At this point I've decided that no coach with an ISX engine is acceptable to me. I'll live with the lesser selection that gives.
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Old 12-18-2018, 04:18 PM   #69
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Most of the transit-grade chassis used Detroit Diesel 60 series (some may still). Prevost switched to Volvo engines around 2008/2009, IIRC.


At this point I've decided that no coach with an ISX engine is acceptable to me. I'll live with the lesser selection that gives.
In 2011 the series 60 engine was discontinued and replaced by the DD15 engine, so none are in any modern trucks or buses or motorhomes.
Unfortunately, if you want a highline, heavy coach, [Newell, Foretravel, many Newmar's etc] you do not have a choice. Newer ISX's and X15's do not appear to have as many problems though.
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Old 12-18-2018, 04:25 PM   #70
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In 2011 the series 60 engine was discontinued and replaced by the DD15 engine, so none are in in modern trucks or buses or motorhomes.
Unfortunately, if you want a highline, heavy coach, [Newell, Foretravel, many Newmar's etc] you do not have a choice. Newer ISX's and X15's do not appear to have as many problems though.

Unless I play and win the lottery I won't be buying a new (or very recent) DP.


For my purposes ISX=NO bueno. I can't afford to spend 30% of coach purchase price on engine rebuilds necessary because the manufacturer could not deliver an engine suitable for the task it was used.
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