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Old 01-11-2020, 03:17 PM   #15
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2004 Itasca "Horizon" Starter Solenoid Area (Freightliner Custom Chassis)

Twinboat: Thanks for letting us know the function of each item in the picture.

Here are my assumptions, which I will put in the form of a question so you or perhaps another member can confirm I understand where the cables come from and go-to?

1) Does the Engine Battery Cable go the fuse block? Is that typically 200A or more?

2a) Are those 2-small-wires (16 gauge?) going to Starter Solenoid controlled by the key ignition?


2b) And does the 1-larger wire (12-gauge??) go to a starter motor solenoid (Delco Type)?


3) I always wondered how the generator receives battery power? ...So does that "auto reset circuit breaker" receive power from the HOUSE BATTERIES and then the other cable goes to the generator post located ~35' away?
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Old 01-11-2020, 03:55 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BigLar368 View Post
Our RV does not have a remote solenoid. Hot cable goes straight from the battery to the starter solenoid which is mounted on the starter. Just like a typical old school Chevrolet starter.
The remote solenoid is not in the battery cable. Its in the smaller, start terminal circuit, on the starter motor solenoid.

Its there so you don't have the 8 to 10 amp draw, of the starter mounted solenoid, running 30 feet, each way, thru the ignition switch up front.
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Old 01-11-2020, 04:10 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by imnprsd View Post
Twinboat: Thanks for letting us know the function of each item in the picture.

Here are my assumptions, which I will put in the form of a question so you or perhaps another member can confirm I understand where the cables come from and go-to?

1) Does the Engine Battery Cable go the fuse block? Is that typically 200A or more?

2a) Are those 2-small-wires (16 gauge?) going to Starter Solenoid controlled by the key ignition?


2b) And does the 1-larger wire (12-gauge??) go to a starter motor solenoid (Delco Type)?


3) I always wondered how the generator receives battery power? ...So does that "auto reset circuit breaker" receive power from the HOUSE BATTERIES and then the other cable goes to the generator post located ~35' away?
( 1 ) Most engine start cables do NOT have fuses. The starter motor is not fused as a safety measure. You dont want a blow fuse in a critical situation, like starting on a RXR crossing.
The cable are supposed to be designed to handle the amps the battery delivers.

( 2A ) Yes, one may be a ground, but the other goes to the ignition switch.
( 2B ) One goes to battery + and one goes to the " S " terminal on the starter mounted solenoid.

( 3 ) Some generators start from chassis batteries and some from house. Its more likely that a 200+ amp fuse protects the generator cable. Auto reset breakers typically don't have that high a rating.
The breaker in that picture could be protecting anything. Levelers, slides.....
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Old 01-11-2020, 11:38 PM   #18
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By The Numbers

TwinBoat: I know you know what you mean, but I'm not sure what you mean?

I think you are saying I have my labels wrong. So can you ignore those and just tell us what "A", "B" and "C" are?

Can you describe wires I numbered 1-8 below?

Wire Descriptions

"A"___________
1.
2. and 3.


"B" ___________

4.
5.


"C" ___________

6.
7.
8.


Many thanks for helping us all "get it right." If you fill in the above I will re-draw the picture for everyone to follow.


Note: I think my generator starts off my house batteries, but I can't remember. And unfortunately, my coach is in storage so I can't trace the battery cable to this area. Sorry.
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Old 01-12-2020, 03:28 AM   #19
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This is a randomly selected picture of someone's MH components. They are standard parts used for many applacations.

I can't ID every wire and component without testing or seeing its wiring diagram.

I'm giving you generalizations, every model MH is different.
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Old 01-13-2020, 02:16 AM   #20
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Thanks TwinBoat. You gave me some good information and when I take my RV out of storage in April I will investigate and report back to everyone.


Note: I borrowed this photo from another member's thread. Maybe they will see this request and fill in the blanks before I can?
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Old 01-13-2020, 05:20 PM   #21
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Thanks for the great info. I tried many of things that was recommended. It problem ended up being the starter solenoid which Imnprsd gave me a great tutorial. I appreciate all of the feedback it was helpful.
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Old 01-13-2020, 11:34 PM   #22
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Glad you fixed it.


What was the part number and/or do you have picture you can share?
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Old 01-14-2020, 09:51 PM   #23
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I was told that I could not get the solenoid without the starter. Not sure if that’s true. I purchased a starter. If was was not traveling tomorrow I would have had more time to see if I could find a rebuilt or new solenoid.
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Old 01-15-2020, 05:43 AM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Spark1 View Post
I was told that I could not get the solenoid without the starter. Not sure if thatís true. I purchased a starter. If was was not traveling tomorrow I would have had more time to see if I could find a rebuilt or new solenoid.
Your starter is probably like ours with the solenoid mounted to the starter. It's not worth trying to repair it on the road. Buy a new starter and when you get home take the old one to a repair shop and if they can fix it you will have a spare you can keep in the RV.
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Old 01-15-2020, 08:05 AM   #25
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What "generally" happens to the solenoid is the copper contact disc inside gets corroded and burnt making it lose connection. If you're handy at all It's pretty easy to take apart and clean and sand the disc to make it work again...possibly forever. However, for piece of mind, I agree with BigLar just replace the starter. Either way, Good luck! Glad you found the answer.
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Old 01-15-2020, 06:59 PM   #26
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Torbik was the one who directed you to the Starter Solenoid. So many thanks to Torbik for pointing us in the right direction!

And now that this thread is all about the starter motor I want to better understand my starter circuit, because I just crossed 100,000 miles on my coach, and I have never performed any maintenance to this area! I also can see some lightly corroded battery cable ends, which I intend to cut off (if I have the extra cable) and replace or I will replace the entire battery cable if I need to.

So this is a "shout-out" to all of you with 10+ year old battery cables to check those ends for corrosion between the copper strands... which will grow unseen for inches or feet... and then the cable resistance will increase and your batteries will not have as many useful hours or you cranking power will be less.

Consequently, I'm' putting battery cable maintenance, and starter relay maintenance, on my summer "to-do-list".

Back to the subject of your starter motor circuit:

I called Freightliner, Spokane parts... (BTW, this FL parts team is awesome, conscientious, and they don't mind talking to RV owners.) And here are the part numbers I obtained from the parts counter after I gave them the last 6-numbers of my coach VIN #. Then I was able to later google these part numbers for more information:

Keep in mind this is for a 2004 Itasca 'Horizon" 40AD with a ISC-350:

Delco Remy Starter - Part # 19026028 (FL Price new $560, Reman $236, Ebay $169

The Starter Relay you see on the frame rail picture below (labeled #3, 4, & 5) has to be the switch your ignition key controls. And this Relay / FLD Magnetic Switch controls the starter solenoid. At least that's what I think. (Can anyone confirm this assumption?

ote: FL says this part fails often! So I'm guessing, if you are troubleshooting a "No Start Condition" then you might want to by-passs the switch my adding a "jumper".

==> Frankly a very good (INSULATED) pair of pliers will let you "Tap-Tap" on the switch posts to see if the starter engages with the key off, then you know this relay (mag-switch) is your problem.

What concerns me is the 12-gauge wire coming out of the FLD Switch (relay), which I think will supply current to the Electrical Solenoid Control Switch for Delco 38MT Starters (Part#10512096) that sits on top of the large Starter Soleniod on top of the starter. ... and maybe that solenoid controls a direct battery connection. (IDK, because I can't look at my engine right now.)

ASSUMPTION: I assume the battery bank feeds the FUSE... that connects to this FLD Switch, but the output is a 12-gauge wire that controls the "IMS-Solenoid" that switches the power direct to the starter motor. Is this what is going on? And is this required so the spikes from the starter motor switching on-and-off don't blow your ignition switch?

NOTE: Freightliner will not sell you the larger Starter Solenoid that sits directly on top of the starter motor; however, you can buy these various Kit Parts to overhaul the starter yourself at Napa and many other places. (To view the Kit Part Numbers just click on the picture below to enlarge it.)

Boy we have a lot of relay/solenoid/switches to look at. It's confusing.

So this saga is not over yet. I say that because I am trying to complete my starter motor circuit diagram using the pieces of information I have. So if anyone can label the connections numbered 1-7 below that would be much appreciated!
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Old 01-15-2020, 08:57 PM   #27
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I re-read this thread and thanks to Twinboat I think I have constructed a Starter Motor Circuit Diagram that applies to my 2004 Itasca "Horizon" 40AD, ISC-350, and Freightliner Chassis. This diagram may apply to your coach too, but I can verify that. Hopefully it does.

The problem is that our engine is Cummins... the starter is made by Delco (as in GM style) and it's supplied by Freightiner... and the relays are commonly used in a lot of applications. So in theory you can pick-up starter motor parts at most auto parts stores (at a good price), which is a good thing!

If I labeled all the wires right then the Starter Motor Circuit diagram below should be correct.

However, I still do NOT know what battery leads marked #6 & #7 do. Are these for my generator or do they go to the inverter? Can someone complete this thread?

If this is my last post, then I would like to thank everyone for contributing. Including the "OP" who started it all. And because he did, I now feel like I can diagnose a starter motor problem in the field. ...And it's this type of information all of us need to put in our Library.
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