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Old 04-10-2017, 02:48 PM   #1
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Another Aluminum Wheel Swap Thread

Hello

I've searched this forum and several others and still have a couple questions concerning swapping out the front and outer rear steel wheels with aluminum wheels. I'm working with a 2006 Winnebago Adventured on a Workhorse W24 Chassis. Hoping you guys can help me out.

Here is what I think I know about the swap.

1. Alcoa and Accuride both make 22.5x7.5 aluminum wheels for the WH24 Chassis.

2. Alcoa wheels may have a slightly more polished finish than the Accurides.

3. Alcoa wheels have a disc thickness of .875". Accuride wheels have a disc thickness of .935". The Alcoa's are .060" thinner at the wheel mounting surface.

4. Stock steel wheels on a WH24 are approximately 6.75" wide.

Here is what I'm trying to wrap my head around.

1. Will I need to replace my inner steel wheel with a 7.5" wide steel wheel so that the two rear sets of duals all on the same size wheel and match exactly. I'm seeing mixed messages on this. 7.5" wide steel wheels are about $230 each and with mounting and balancing I would be looking at about $600 extra to replace all 6 wheels instead of just the outer 4.

2. From everything I can find the rear stud length appears to be long enough for either the Accuride or Alcoa Aluminum wheel with the extra disc thickness. Can anyone confirm this for sure?

3. On the front it appears the stud length is barely long enough but maybe not quite depending on the thickness of the wheel disc. From everything I can find and the pictures I have seen online it appears that when using the Accuride wheels the end of the stud is flush with the end of the lug nut when all torqued up properly. Using the Alcoa wheel would allow for about .060" of the lug to extend past the end of the lug nut. After talking to several tire shops in the mid west they will not mount the wheel back on the coach if the stud does not extend past the lug nut. Can anyone provide some insight on this?

4. The $64000 question, Does anyone have a part number for the longer studs if I have to replace the studs on the front hubs?

Thanks for your time. I know it's been beat to death but I can't seem to find definitive answers to these questions.
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Old 04-10-2017, 07:34 PM   #2
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If you need longer studs, just knock one out and take it with you, tell them you need some longer. should find them at truck tire service center. And take a lug nut, to make sure it is the right size.
I have been thinking about doing the same thing.
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Old 04-10-2017, 07:38 PM   #3
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If you go that route make absolutely sure you have the correct serrated shoulders.
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Old 04-10-2017, 08:40 PM   #4
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I have not done this swap, but have ask some of the same questions. I can only tell you what the truck tire shop that I have dealt with most of my adult life said about the difference in wheel widths from the 6 3/4 steel to the 7 1/2 alum. Quote: the minimal difference of 3/4" will not cause any adverse affect on either tire when paired on the same side
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Old 04-10-2017, 09:49 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blaster View Post
If you need longer studs, just knock one out and take it with you, tell them you need some longer. should find them at truck tire service center. And take a lug nut, to make sure it is the right size.
I have been thinking about doing the same thing.
Sounds good. I almost positive I will be going with the Alcoas. The disc is .060" thinner on the Alcoa so the studs of the front hubs should be long enough to protrude past the end of the lug nut.

I will post back when I make the swap and let everyone know my findings.

Quote:
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If you go that route make absolutely sure you have the correct serrated shoulders.
I assume you mean the shoulder of the wheel stud if it turns out I have to replace them. If so then roger that for sure. I don't think you replaced the wheel studs on your MH when you went to Alloys??? Your wheels are the Accurides with the slightly thicker disc???

Quote:
Originally Posted by MoCoTom View Post
I have not done this swap, but have ask some of the same questions. I can only tell you what the truck tire shop that I have dealt with most of my adult life said about the difference in wheel widths from the 6 3/4 steel to the 7 1/2 alum. Quote: the minimal difference of 3/4" will not cause any adverse affect on either tire when paired on the same side
The Tire Shop I called today, Pro Tire in Columbus OH. said basically the same thing. They said they do dozens of 22.5 tire swaps per year and that many of them still use the stock width inner steel wheel and they don't see that as an issue. The retailer that I am hoping to buy the new Alloy wheels through was the primarily source for the idea that I needed to replace the stock steel wheels with 7.5" steel wheels. I'm spending just shy of $5000 for 6 brand new tires and 4 new Alloy wheels. Another $600 for new steel inners isn't the end of the world if it's really needed. I'm still up in the air on this one.

Thanks everyone for the responses so far. I will be picking up the "new to me" coach on May 17. By about May 24 I will know for sure if I have big enough studs..... Hahaha
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Old 04-10-2017, 10:54 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AKIQPilot View Post
I assume you mean the shoulder of the wheel stud if it turns out I have to replace them. If so then roger that for sure. I don't think you replaced the wheel studs on your MH when you went to Alloys??? Your wheels are the Accurides with the slightly thicker disc???
The shoulder and serration width but more importantly the width (thickness) and number of serrations.

I did not change any studs when I put my Accurides on.

When I originally started to change the wheels I checked a lot of GM trucks and RVs new and they all had steel wheels on the inner directly from the factory with the aluminums on the outside.
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Old 04-11-2017, 08:24 AM   #7
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Quote:
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The shoulder and serration width but more importantly the width (thickness) and number of serrations.

I did not change any studs when I put my Accurides on.

When I originally started to change the wheels I checked a lot of GM trucks and RVs new and they all had steel wheels on the inner directly from the factory with the aluminums on the outside.
Ok, Thanks for the info and that all sounds very good.

I noticed when reading your Upgrades Thread that you put Centramatic wheel balancers on the front. Two questions.

1. In the picture of your front wheel that you posted in your "Stud Part Number" thread, is the centramatic in place behind your aluminum wheel? If so then the stock studs are for sure long enough for my application if I want to add the alloy wheels without the Centramatic balancers.

2. Do the balancers work as advertised? Can you notice a difference? Seems like a fairly inexpensive way to reduce tire balance issues and improve tire wear and ride quality.

And a third slightly unrelated question. I assume you remove and install your own tires/wheels. You seem to do it fairly regularly. Do you use the supplied lug wrench? Do you "retorque" to 375-400 ftlbs or whatever the recommended lug nut torque is? Or do you use the "200lbs, 2' out from the CL of the lug nut" method of getting the lug nuts retorqued?

Thanks for all your help in this regard.
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Old 04-11-2017, 01:53 PM   #8
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The picture is with the Centramatics installed you can see it between the wheel and hub for reference as well as see a bit of it in the top left wheel hole.

I don't know how they work yet as I have not driven it since they were installed, I'm not sure how well I will be able to know since new Michelins were put on at the same time.

I normally use a 1" impact gun to tighten the lug nuts set in the medium range. As soon as I can find a reasonable priced torque wrench to do the job I'll buy it and keep it in the bus.

I would rather have had the Alcoas but Accuride is what my dealer sold so I got them rather than pay additional freight.
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Old 04-17-2017, 10:24 AM   #9
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If you do decide to mix the 6.75 rims with the 7.5" rims, measure the tire height before installing. The 7.5" rim mounted tires will be a smaller dia. and circumference. The difference in tire height could or might not work well. If the height is to much of a difference, a bit or a small amount might be acceptable?

They might even out over time. It would help to possibly run different pressures, but who knows what they would need??? I would myself like them to be at the same height for highway speeds.

There were some tire manufacture charts, that mention tire height, as measured on a certain width rim.
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Old 04-17-2017, 01:08 PM   #10
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If you do decide to mix the 6.75 rims with the 7.5" rims, measure the tire height before installing. The 7.5" rim mounted tires will be a smaller dia. and circumference. The difference in tire height could or might not work well. If the height is to much of a difference, a bit or a small amount might be acceptable?

They might even out over time. It would help to possibly run different pressures, but who knows what they would need??? I would myself like them to be at the same height for highway speeds.

There were some tire manufacture charts, that mention tire height, as measured on a certain width rim.
Yes, thanks for chiming in Doug. I don't think there is any doubt that the tires will be different sizes on the two different width rims. Measuring the outer circumference will be an easy way to tell the exact difference. If the circumferences are different then one tire on each set of duals will be traveling a longer distance with every rotation. This has to cause an increase in temperature on the tires. The two tires may share the extra burden of fighting each other but it seems like they will fight none the less. Like you mentioned, I could compensate with different air pressures in the tire but that would just be trial and error to get them matched up. I may be able to match the circumference with air while they are off the ground unloaded but what happens when you put a load on the tires? All things to think about.

With tires being such a critical component of a safe motorhome I've been leaning toward just replacing the inner steel wheels while I'm at it. If I don't it will always be something on the back of my mind and will likely play tricks with me. Every time I think I feel something unusual I will likely try to blame it on the mismatched wheels on the back of the coach.

At under $300 each mounted and balanced I think it will be in my best interest to just bite the bullet and get the 7.5" wide steel wheels while I'm at it.

Thanks for responding.
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Old 04-23-2017, 04:29 PM   #11
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Aluminum Wheels

I have Alcoa Aluminum wheels as a factory option on my 2007 Voyage W24. Maybe you can call Winnebago and get the correct part number so you can order from Alcoa.
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Old 05-25-2017, 09:28 PM   #12
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Well I finally picked up our (new to us) motorhome. It is a 2006 Adventurer 38J. It is in exceptional condition. Hardly a blemish inside or out. The dealer had it all washed and waxed before we picked it up and it looked good even with the stock steels and simulators.

I have wanted Alcoa wheels since my first Dually in 1984. I had all kinds of questions earlier in this thread and tanks to everyone who offered some advice. I ordered 4 brand new Alcoas from a wheel dealer in Columbus Ohio. He recommended a local tire shop in Columbus called Pro Tire. This morning I showed up and Billy at Pro Tire took real good care of me. In and out in under 2 hours.

So here is the low down.

1. Yes, the wheel studs, front and rear, are plenty long enough to get several threads showing past the lug nut. This is even using an HDPE disc behind the aluminum wheel to prevent corrosion and chafing of the aluminum.

2. After lots of debate back and forth I took the advice of the guys at Pro Tire and stuck with the stock steel wheel which is slightly narrower than the new Aluminum wheel. A 7.5" wide steel wheel was available but I decided to stick with the stock narrower wheel and save the $600.

My tires were brand new and only had about 400 miles on them before today. When the new tires were installed (as part of the purchase) they were not balanced, or at least there were no balance weights on the wheels and no beads inside the tire. They felt perfectly in balance and I would have never guessed they were not balanced when they were installed earlier this month.

I had all 6 new tires and all the wheels, both new and old, dynamically balanced with ceramic balancing beads inside. The Alcoas had brand new valve stems and I had Pro Tire put the correct 45" stems on my inside dual wheels so it would protrude through the aluminum wheel with the correct rubber centralizer. I can add or subtract air with ease now and no flexible valve stem extenders to wear, rub or leak.

Put 95psi in the front and 90 in the rear as per my weight and balance of the coach. Added the Eez tire TPMS sensors and off we went. Put about 300 miles on them and things are still awesome.

Was it worth $2000? Who knows but it sure looks better IMO and I finally have a set of Alcoas. Something I have wanted for over 30 years.

Before with the simulators.



After with the Alcoas.









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Old 05-25-2017, 09:37 PM   #13
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Problem is that now your tire outside diameter isn't the same due to the narrower rim on the inside, plus the wider rim on the outside might change the load rating unless both rim widths are within the tire rim width tolerance.
Tires have a recommended rim width for a reason, going outside those specifications can cause problems. You haven't given us enough info to go on though.
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Old 05-25-2017, 10:02 PM   #14
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Thank you for the update they are important for those who may do a search of the subject in the future.

It's good to see you got it taken care of.
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