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Old 12-06-2006, 04:00 PM   #1
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In the summer time my fans turn on and off fairly often. I don't think they come on now that it is cool to cold out. However my cab heater is warm but doesnt seem as warm or hot as I'd like it.
The engine temp gauge stays dead in the middle no matter what. I got a big trip coming up (4000 mi.). I'm thinking about putting something across the grill opening to let the engine get a little warmer if I get some real cold weather.
However, with the temp gauge always staying in the middle, I don't really know what my engine temperature is.
Does anyone know at what temperature the electric cooling fans are programed to come on?
It would be good to know what temp. our engine is at when the fans come on.
Also , at what temperatur will the gauge finally move off the middle? When it does move, will it go all the way to the peg or will it gradually move toward the hot side?
Thanks for sharing if you know. Be nice Driver
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Old 12-06-2006, 04:00 PM   #2
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In the summer time my fans turn on and off fairly often. I don't think they come on now that it is cool to cold out. However my cab heater is warm but doesnt seem as warm or hot as I'd like it.
The engine temp gauge stays dead in the middle no matter what. I got a big trip coming up (4000 mi.). I'm thinking about putting something across the grill opening to let the engine get a little warmer if I get some real cold weather.
However, with the temp gauge always staying in the middle, I don't really know what my engine temperature is.
Does anyone know at what temperature the electric cooling fans are programed to come on?
It would be good to know what temp. our engine is at when the fans come on.
Also , at what temperatur will the gauge finally move off the middle? When it does move, will it go all the way to the peg or will it gradually move toward the hot side?
Thanks for sharing if you know. Be nice Driver
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Old 12-06-2006, 04:15 PM   #3
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Max, if your not getting the heat you should get, mine is plenty hot , the EVANS valve my not be opening up far enough thus poor heat coming from heater.
It would seem to me if you block grill for more heat the fans are just going to come on more often thus defeating your purpose for more heat.
I would check out that valve to see if its opening as it should.
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Old 12-06-2006, 04:26 PM   #4
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<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by max49:
Thanks for sharing if you know. Be nice Driver </div></BLOCKQUOTE>Mike, The auxiliary cooling fans will come on when the engine requires additional cooling only if it's not getting enough cooling from the main engine fan.

The main function of the auxiliary fans is to move air through the condenser. This is an air conditioning need and not at all related toward coach or cabin heat coming from your dash registers.

The entire heater circuit in the coach builder's responsibility and none of it falls under the Workhorse umbrella.

When the needle in the water temperature gauge is pointing at the 3 o'clock position it is telling you that the engine has achieved its normal operating temperature. If it were possible to show incremental movement in the temperature gauge you would not be able to get significantly more heat from the coach heater because as soon as the engine achieves a preset temperature the auxiliary fans or the main engine fan will come back on line.

If your dash heat isn't hot enough there could be problems with your water temperature valve in that your dash heat selector is not allowing the valve to open at all or only partially open.

I would look at this before I tried anything else. Now we have also seen where these valves get stuck open every so once in a while and when cold air is needed the A/C is working against heat coming through the heater core.

Exactly at which temperature the needle will begin its upward climb would be above the normal operating temperature of the cooling system and at that point there would be more of a failure in the cooling system rather than it simply heating up to the point where it simply moves the needle. The needle isn't going to move significantly upward unless something is very wrong. Before that happened you no doubt would smell anti freeze and or possibly experience a loss of power and or other indications that would leave you to believe that you have a an engine cooling system failure. A huge vaporous cloud would be one indicator or coolant dripping from under the coach would be another sign.

In closing "Do not occlude your grill opening or cause a reduction in the air flow passing to the radiator in any way shape manner or form".
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Old 12-06-2006, 04:34 PM   #5
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Max,

Don't block the air flow... Fix the problem not the symptom. I agree with 007 that your heater valve is probably not working right. Also, in the winter you will want to run in max air mode. This way you are not pulling cold air in from the outside.

As for the fan on/off temps. My OBD2 scans show the ECT temps to be around 202. That may sound high be remember you have anti-freeze and 14 psi on the cooling system. This will raise the boiling point to almost 250. I suspect the fans will come on about 206 to 210 and shut off at about 200.
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Old 12-06-2006, 04:45 PM   #6
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Oops, maybe I made my own heater problem.
In the summer, I put a ball valve on the heater hose, just to make sure no hot water was getting thru , to see if it would help my AC.
The heater has 5/8" hose and all I could find was a 1/2" ballvalve. I wonder if that 1/8" could make a differnce in my heater.
Thanks for your help.
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Old 12-06-2006, 05:30 PM   #7
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<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by max49:
Oops, maybe I made my own heater problem.
In the summer, I put a ball valve on the heater hose, just to make sure no hot water was getting thru , to see if it would help my AC.
The heater has 5/8" hose and all I could find was a 1/2" ballvalve. I wonder if that 1/8" could make a differnce in my heater.
Thanks for your help. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>Yeah could be.

As others have stated DO NOT BLOCK YOUR GRILL! If you do, I guarantee you will be replacing spark plug wires. All the problems related to the plug wire burning (engine miss) issue are due to the coach manufacturer not providing enough airflow, in my case grill space.
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Old 12-06-2006, 06:22 PM   #8
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<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Does anyone know at what temperature the electric cooling fans are programed to come on? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
According to the often quoted Chassis Guide:
" The electric condenser fans also assist with engine cooling.........These fans are controlled by the PCM and operate whenever the dash air conditioning compressor is operating OR if the engine temperature is above 221 degrees F."ED
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Old 12-06-2006, 07:29 PM   #9
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I had the PCM programmed to turn the two fans
on for approx 2min. upon engine shutdown. TENN.
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Old 12-07-2006, 03:45 AM   #10
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<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by edgray:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Does anyone know at what temperature the electric cooling fans are programed to come on? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
According to the often quoted Chassis Guide:
" The electric condenser fans also assist with engine cooling.........These fans are controlled by the PCM and operate whenever the dash air conditioning compressor is operating OR if the engine temperature is above 221 degrees F."ED </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
Thanks Ed, that's interesting. So if the fans come without the AC on, then the engine is actually pretty hot. I thought 180 was about normal. I can't remember if my fans ever come on without the AC on.
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Old 12-07-2006, 03:01 PM   #11
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Max, a piece of 1/2" copper plumbing pipe fits snuggly inside a 5/8" heater hose. You could just make a patch until you find the correct ball valve. I'd use about 6" and double hose clamp on each side of the splice.
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Old 12-07-2006, 05:22 PM   #12
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Yea but a 1/2" copper pipe probably won't let any more water thru than my 1/2" ball valve. I think they make a 5/8" ball valve but I don't know where yet. Also since 1/2" fit inside my heater hose so well , I don't know if the 5/8" will work.
I got this idea here on IRV.com so putting a manual shutoff for the heater hose is not a new idea. What has everybody else who has did this used?
BTW the manual shutoff might have helped my AC but I'm not sure. I probably should have just felt the hoses going to the heater core to see if hot water was leaking past the Evans valve.
In Co. we need heat in the morning, AC in the afternoon and heat again at nite for many months so the manual valve did'nt stay closed for long.
I kept the original hose, I might just put it back on.
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Old 12-07-2006, 05:27 PM   #13
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<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by max49:
In Co. we need heat in the morning, AC in the afternoon and heat again at nite for many months so the manual valve didn't stay closed for long. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>If you modify the automation on this system, these are the challenges that you are going to have to deal with.

I don't have these challenges on my Winnebago. The heater control valve works very well. The dash board selectable valve is on or open when it's supposed to be and off when it supposed to be closed.
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Old 12-07-2006, 05:37 PM   #14
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Maybe I went with the "monkey see, monkey do" thing. Some people said it helped their AC unit. It is not an irrevesable thing. The hose is less than 2' long from the Evans valve to the core. I installed the ball valve on a new hose and kept the original.
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