Community Forums

Wolf S · 11-13-2006, 09:01 AM

hope you didn't trade it off with the brake disassembled. Some unsuspecting buyer could have a serious problem or accident if they are expecting the brake to hold and it is not functional.

Nope, It was reassembled just prior and disclosed to the dealer. Being a car guy, I like to understand in what kind of emergency this style if "brake" would be usefull in the first place. All it does is lock up the drive shaft and the way the system works the lock will not activate while the unit moves. So all it really does it helps the transmission park position...or???

FreshAir · 11-13-2006, 02:35 PM

I have been following this thread but now I'm getting confused. I have a WH Chassis. Do I have the electronic park brake or is it called an auto/hydraulic brake? Is there a difference? Does mine clamp the drive shaft? If mine does clamp the shaft can it freeze up under extreem cold camping conditions and cause damage?
I would really appreciate someone clearing this up for me.
Many Thanks,
Pat

MikeT · 11-13-2006, 02:40 PM

You have the J 72 auto park as described by Mike B

It consists basically of a pump that applies pressure to overcome the spring pressure that applies the brake inside the drum on the drive shaft. If you cannot get hydraulic pressure in the system, the spring applies the parking brake.

Anything can act up under extreme cold, but what is extreme cold if you are still camping ????

Ultra RV Products · 11-13-2006, 02:52 PM

There is a brake drum & backing plate assembly on the back side of the transmission.Some coaches have a foot pedal as well as electric switch that activates the park brake.Some coaches are completely automatic(like Yours)When you take the coach out of park it disengages the park brake & does the oposite when you put it bacvk in park,your system is very difficult to disable.On either system the brake shoes push out against the drum to hold the coach from rolling.

gsdog · 11-13-2006, 03:40 PM

Wolf, Thanks for getting back to me, I too have learned how to climb under the motorhome, pull the cotter pin and clevis pin, to disable. Right know, I am carrying a spare relay and have to order an extra sensor, since, that will be another cause for breakdown. Glad I carry enough tools.

Wolf S · 11-13-2006, 04:03 PM

I am glad you are prepared to take matters in your own hand if you need too. I have a hard time with the concept that one spends lots of money on a new MH and than has to deal with such basic things as a parking brake.

Good luck, and enjoy anyway!

max49 · 11-13-2006, 05:51 PM

And the "aftermarket world" obviously can not figure out a way to replace or at least an emergency release for it. It is such a poor , problematic design, no wonder no one else wants to use any thing similar to it. It's also not very popular with mechanics either. Has anyone ever heard anybody say "I really like my electric parking brake". I did'nt think so . Thanks WCC,
Is it true that there are only types of people with the 'autopark'? Those who have had trouble with it and those that will have trouble with it?

FreshAir · 11-13-2006, 06:23 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by MikeT:
You have the J 72 auto park as described by Mike B

Anything can act up under extreme cold, but what is extreme cold if you are still camping ???? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Thanks Mike B.
We dry camp a lot in the winter on snowmobile trips in the mountains of Utah, Idaho etc. Not uncommon to see zero or below on occassions. I can remember seeing others with hammers beating on their drive shaft park brakes to free them up. They were on mid 90's brands and I have no idea how their systems worked and it was before Workhorse. Probaly all pretty much the same. At the time I would think how lucky I was to have a xmission with a Park pawl. We never used our, "manual," emergency brakes in the winter. Hoping WH had that solved.

Pat

DriVer · 11-13-2006, 06:59 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by max49:
It is such a poor , problematic design, no wonder no one else wants to use any thing similar to it. It's also not very popular with mechanics either. Has anyone ever heard anybody say "I really like my electric parking brake". I didn't think so . Thanks WCC, </div></BLOCKQUOTE>Max49, You don't not know what you are talking about and you are just venting. FRED uses an AAPB and so do many other commercial vehicles. The UFO and the 07 FE Workhorse chassis will continue to use the AAPB however the technology has changed as it has the right to. Read this .... "Many" people have not had a hint of trouble with their AAPBs and yes they like their brakes.

The WCC AAPB operates the same as would an air brake system to release or apply the brakes except it uses a hydraulic pump to make pressure instead of an air compressor. If you loose your air or blow a line on an air brake system you're going to be sitting on the side of the road waiting for service. I see many 50 foot or longer skid marks on the highway where trucks have had brakes lock up so nothing mechanical is going to operate perfectly during its lifetime. It just doesn't happen.

The J72 AAPB exceeds federal DOT requirements for parking brake systems.

Any RV mechanic that has been around for a while knows the J71 and the J72 AAPB system or else they wouldn't be RV mechanics. These systems have been on RVs for quite a few years and so far there isn't a better mousetrap that will work given the various weight configurations that must be met by the automotive engineers. There will always be an AAPB system however the mechanics, electronics and hydraulic properties of the systems will radically change.

DriVer · 11-13-2006, 07:05 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Pat & Denise:
We never used our, "manual," emergency brakes in the winter. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>Pat, That exactly right! You never want to set a parking brake when ever it gets extremely cold outside where the system is exposed to extended periods of freezing temperatures. The e-brake may not release.

Wolf S · 11-14-2006, 02:11 AM

Hi Driver...

I have long since sold my WCC MH. The reason I am back on the site is that someone found my old post about the electronic brake and e-mailed me. There should be a rule against folks like you on the various websites posting without disclosing who you represent. I remember your various postings, according to you all is perfect and there are no design and service issues.

Having spend many years in the Automotive business, it simply is not so. And it is because of sites like this, that issues get highlighted and fixed.

There really is no need to attack people that voice concerns and lecture them about design. In this case is it obvious that it is a poor design, or maybe just poor execution. Have you ever followed the various wires and relays that control the system? It would be obvious to a 2nd year trainee technician that this is prone to fail (confirmed by my experiences and the postings here)

So, if you want to be useful, bring the issue to the attention of the people that you defend, and everyone will benefit.

And no, there is no need to respond.

Ultra RV Products · 11-14-2006, 06:21 AM

WHoa! No need for everybody to get hot under the collar.
Max49,

We are a Workhorse authroized repair center & I have been with Workhorse since it's inception.We do not see that many coaches with park brake issue's.There are a few yes,but not that many.The Ford has a similar system also,with four wheel disc brakes(like Everybody wants)so far there is no other way to have a parking brake system.The issue's we see are driving with the brake on(burn up the shoes)old P32 chassis as well as Workhorses & occasionally we have them driven in where some unknowing Tech has cut the cable off or wired the pump on to release the brake.

This system is not perfect but it work's.

Pat & Denise,
If you drive in wet weather & then it freezes the shoes could lock up or freeze against the drum,it is not a water proof system.It should break loose if you cycle the transmission in & out of park a couple of times.

DriVer,

Keep on Keepin on,You are doing a great job.It is always easy to find fault in something because hindsight is 20/20!!! I used to work for someone like that & you know who he is!

Redlands Truck and RV · 11-14-2006, 09:03 AM

Actual component failures have been minimal, I can think of only 2 where the switch was bad and 1 other where we had to install a relay. What have found was coach company wiring/ connections failed, resulting in no power to the relay.

max49 · 11-14-2006, 04:49 PM

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Brazels RV Performance:
WHoa! No need for everybody to get hot under the collar.
Max49,

We are a Workhorse authroized repair center & I have been with Workhorse since it's inception.We do not see that many coaches with park brake issue's.There are a few yes,but not that many.The Ford has a similar system also,with four wheel disc brakes(like Everybody wants)so far there is no other way to have a parking brake system.The issue's we see are driving with the brake on(burn up the shoes)old P32 chassis as well as Workhorses & occasionally we have them driven in where some unknowing Tech has cut the cable off or wired the pump on to release the brake.

This system is not perfect but it work's."

Mike, When did Ford start using an electric parking brake? If this is true then that's anothert MH that I will never buy. I drove an'06 Ford Hurricane 20500 with the new 5 speed and 362 HP. It had a foot operated parking brake AND a Parking pawl. I would be very surprised and disappointed if Ford uses an electronic parking brake.
Driver, I've been in heavy highway construction since 1969. Air brakes are a tried and proven reliable braking system. Every heavy vehicle uses air brakes. No body wants to copy the problematic autopark system. It can strand you dead in the hwy. You can't even flag someone down to pull you off the road and out of yours and others danger. We can jump out to the shoulder but what about the person that runs into the back of our MH. Wh could'nt even give us an emergency release or a transmission stong enough for a parking pawl. Other than Brazel's ,I've never heard anyone defend this system except ppl who may depend on WH to make a living or are trying to keep up their resale value maybe .Even WH svc centers shake their heads about the autopark. I'm sure there may be others but the only truck I've seen with the autopark is the ice cream truck and it looks old.
Calling all WH damage control agents.
If it's true, could someone post a link about Ford using an electric parking brake.
An electric parking brake might be ok if it had a manual override to release it and also a prking pawl.
Workhorse does'nt even warn us that if the autopark loses 12 volts of power , the brake is going to slam on.
PS

I have an '04 WH P32 chassis. According to WH they started using the J-72 system during the '04 model year. They do not say that all '04's have the J-72. Does anyone know of way I can idetify something that will tell me if it is a J-72 or the J-71? Am I correct to assume that Wolf has the J-71? Is the J-72 really any more reliable? So far, only the actuator assembly has had to be replaced .