Hot Brakes?

[jdsr]

What concerns me is this is the second brake recall on year 2000-2003 and now all w20 and w22 and 25 are included except 2009. Whats to say they will get it right this time. Just something to think about. As always imo

[DriVer]

Originally Posted by max49

"Is this a Workhorse?"

You'd think Workhorse would be embarrassed about this situation, but it doesn't seem to bother them much at all..

Max, To answer your question, "NO!"

I don't see where anyone is embarrassed, how about yourself?

[DriVer]

Originally Posted by jdsr

What concerns me is this is the second brake recall on year 2000-2003 and now all w20 and w22 and 25 are included except 2009.

jdsr, Please make sure your facts are correct. The 25 is not involved in this campaign. There is no such thing as a 25. There are 24s and 25.5s which are not involved in the recall. Always good to hear from you.

[EngineerMike]

Max49: "I can't imagine Toyota, Honda, Ford or any other mfgr allowing their reputation to be almost ruined because of what is arguably the most important safety feature of any motor vehicle, the brakes."

I recently had a "campaign" performed on my 1993 Toyota (a 17 year old vehicle) to upgrade a steering link to a beefier design, no charge. No NHTSA involvement in the recall notice or process. I did some followup w/Toyota on their process, and was told:
1) Toyota doesn't do recalls. They don't want customer complaints to get to the level of requiring government intervention, but want customers to see Toyota as proactive in customer safety & vehicle longevity.
2) Toyota wants to sell you the rest of your cars & light trucks, so the customer experience is important.
3) When they have a campaign like the steering link, their records are open to the govt to see what was done, how customers were notified, how many have completed the campaign, etc., but that such communication may never occur as it is not a mandatory recall, or even a "voluntary" recall in which a govt investigation was likely or definitely going to trigger a mandatory recall anyway. There was no mention of NHTSA in their documents at all, as appears to have been required of Workhorse.

This recall is not insignificant. New calipers for 47,000 or so vehicles, 4 per. Gotta be $100 million or more. In theory some large portion of that may be covered by insurance. But the real embarrassment is how much smaller the mintage of vehicles involved would have been if the earliest complaints were taken with appropriate seriousness by WH. Even more disparaging to the WH cache is the number of brake incidents that would have been avoided, and amount of customer brain damage that now seems attributable purely to WH's lackadaisical approach. This woulda been solved a few years and a mountain of brake problems ago.

When this problem first went to the NHTSA complaint stage I was thinking it was a Bosch problem. Since I have changed my thinking. WH makes the chassis, and is therefore responsible for brake component specification & incorporation in the vehicle. Unless they have Bosch contractually accept responsability for design & specification (which won't alleviate the direct and parrallel responsability for WH in NHTSA's eyes & process), WH is in the driver's seat all the way.

Various excuses have been offered here to attempt to excuse both the problem and the way it has been handled. E.g. same type of brake caliper is used on delivery vans which get "driven like they are stolen." That doesn't wash. Fleet vehicles are maintained so they can be driven like they are stolen. And there is minimal comparability of FedEx and UPS vans in the loading; motohomes are 70% or more loaded every time they leave the driveway, while delivery vans are mainly limited by bulk not weight, tho some do go out occasionally fully loaded weight wise. My rig is between 31k & 32k every day, on a 33k GVWR. That's way different than a delivery van full of boxes mostly filled w/styrofoam peanuts.

Hopefully, WH will do several post mortems on how this situation could have gooten to be such a big black eye, and take a more intelligent and customer-centered approach to future issues. Like, say, reimbursements for historical brake problems attributable to failed, recalled brakes?

[Jack R]

Okay, I think this thread is getting out of hand. Need to put a lock on it.

[DriVer]

Originally Posted by Jack R

Okay, I think this thread is getting out of hand. Need to put a lock on it.

I don't think so, we're still communicating. Some folks just get carried away with their opinions when they don't have facts to back up their theories.

[Oemtech]

I have to agree with EngineerMike to some degree... I had the same thing happen on my 97 Honda CRV... I am the 3rd owner. I took it in for a ignition switch problem and the service advisor ran the vin and it came back as needing a Honda recall for, you guessed it, a bad ignition switch. Repaired at no cost to and an apology for not be notified.

When I went thru the shock issue with Newmar when I bought my coach they kept telling me to go see Workhorse. I finally told them I was not working "their" problem. The shocks were bad, you fix it and they did.

I and others ID this issue almost 3 years ago. But, because we are NOT "certified" experts our diagnosis and recommended repair went on deaf ears.

[max49]

Originally Posted by DriVer

Max, To answer your question, "NO!"

I don't see where anyone is embarrassed, how about yourself?

Not me at all. Why should I be embarassed?

Driver, that is so arrogant! I can't believe , even from you, that you are insinuating that WH is not and has no reason to be embarassed.
Are you serious? You are saying they have no remorse for what their customers have and still are going through with brakes that WH decided were good enough for their new flagship ( at the time) chassis?

And the question was and is "Is this a WH chassiss?????????"

If it actually is a P-32, which I'm not convinced of at this time, just because one member says it is, but it may be, it either a WH or it is not. Now I and maybe others are even more curious as to what chassis it is.

[max49]

JDSR has a good point. If the problem is fixed in the '09 chassis, then they have the parts already. Why aren't they putting them in vehicles with the bad brakes?
Because they already made their profit on those vehicles?


And I agree with Engineer MIke. I have always said, that I can not ever remember a vehicle recall that was forced by the government. I only remember mfgr voluntary recalls.

[jdsr]

OOP's. W18 or w25, heck I dont care if its w200. There's over 45,000 chassis being recalled. Who can keep up. Oh well, small mistake.Maybe my brains alittle fried having to get the info out about this brake problem for almost 3 years. But back to my point this is the second brake recall on some of these wh chassis. I have no faith in them getting it right this time either. As always, just my opinion.

[max49]

If that MH is 9 or 10 years, and especially a rental, it is amazing cream puff. It looks as good as new one.

[DriVer]

Originally Posted by oemtech

I have to agree with EngineerMike to some degree....

OK I'll bite. What degree don't you agree with?

[DriVer]

Originally Posted by jdsr

heck I dont care

We've known that all along.

[Oemtech]

Originally Posted by DriVer

OK I'll bite. What degree don't you agree with?

Ok smartly... 20 degrees maybe.