Community Forums

retiredrlk1 · 08-07-2008, 11:46 AM

What do you think of the hydrogen from water generators that are all over the internet? I have a 2003 W22 with the 8.1 and was thinking about using this. I have not seen anything on this on any post any where. Any comments?

RustyJC · 08-07-2008, 11:55 AM

See HERE.

Rusty

fleamarketer · 08-09-2008, 04:01 AM

Well Rusty,

As you will see,I am not a supporter of those and think they are dangerous.They use as much energy as they produce.This link is very long and very detailed with people who have really done their "homework".So set aside lots of time to READ thur it.It has people who comments on both sides. http://www.chevroletforum.com/m_61361/tm.htm

Oemtech · 08-09-2008, 08:32 AM

1) It does take energy to "crack" the water into Hydrogen & Oxygen. But, if you are using the Hydrogen to enhance the efficiency of the engine and not as a replacement it may be worth while.

2)You can also produce "Brown Gas" which from what I understand is combination of Hydrogen & Oxygen in a gas form.

3) Hydrogen is explosive... But, so are gasoline fumes.

4) One other item most people don't consider is the O2 sensor. Once you introduce Hydrogen in the system the O2 sensor will try to compensate for it. So, you need away to fool the O2 sensor into thinking that nothing has changed. There are devices available to do this.

5) There are DIY and commercial versions of H2O generators available.

Lastly this is on my project list...

RustyJC · 08-09-2008, 03:42 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by fleamarketer:
Well Rusty,

As you will see,I am not a supporter of those and think they are dangerous.

I'm somewhat at a loss regarding how you think I might be "fer" or "agin" these devices. All I did was point the original poster to a current thread where hydrogen generators have been discussed comprehensively.

Rusty

MtManLee · 08-14-2008, 04:42 PM

If you read all of our posts from the previous on this subject you would understand. Its the biggest scam since scammers started the lottery scam. Last week on news out of Los Angeles they arrested a couple of people who were scamming people on the net and locally with the Hydro Converter.

DriVer · 08-14-2008, 05:43 PM

I love gadgets of all types but I'll pass on this one.

gorwig · 08-15-2008, 05:08 PM

When water is broken down by an electric current, it generates two volumes of hydrogen for each volume of oxygen. If the two are allowed to mix, you have what is called Brown's gas ... a very, very explosive mix that can release a lot of energy in a strong explosion.

The problem ... it can't release more energy than it took to make it. If it could, you would have the source for perpetual motion, with the exception of simply supplying water. Just use the energy created from exploding Brown's gas to run a generator to create even more Brown's gas.

Hmmm.... Why don't we use that in place of coal or oil or nuclear for all our big electric power generating plants? Just use the surplus Brown's gas to run a big power plant?? I wonder why? The answer is very, very simple. It takes more energy to create it than it can supply in return. It will make a few people very rich until the scam fades away.

Gary Orwig
Seabreeze LX 8321 W22

hamguy · 08-16-2008, 03:04 PM

BTW, the USPTO (US Patent and Trademark Office) will no longer entertain applications that claim perpetual motion or seem to imply such in the writings.

Dean

dieselclacker · 08-16-2008, 04:30 PM

[QUOTE]Originally posted by gorwig:

The problem ... it can't release more energy than it took to make it. If it could, you would have the source for perpetual motion, with the exception of simply supplying water.

===============================================

Yep! Right out of Physics 101!!

Dieselclacker

doc · 08-17-2008, 03:44 AM

Quote:

The problem ... it can't release more energy than it took to make it

Of course you are right, but... When atoms split and fission takes place?...oh well.

gorwig · 08-17-2008, 06:06 AM

Quote:

Of course you are right, but... When atoms split and fission takes place?...oh well

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

The rule still holds true, but on a whole different level. Chemical reactions (like burning (oxidizing) hydrogen are very simple. It takes a specific amount of energy to break the water bonds to create hydrogen and oxygen, plus there is a variable amount of additional energy that is lost depending upon the efficiency of the process ... electrical resistance as heat, etc. When the two elements recombine, only the chemical energy is released, and not all of that can be converted directly to "work" due to more efficiency loses. End result, you never get back more than you put in.

The same holds true for nuclear reactions, but on a nuclear level. It takes a certain amount of energy to create a particular atom (usually happens near the center of stars). If that atom has characteristics that allow it to break apart (fission) or combine (fusion) to form something new at a lower nuclear energy level, you have energy released. A whole lot of energy when compared to chemical reactions since it results from a conversion of mass directly into energy according to Einstein's work. Still, it will never be more than what it took to create the initial atom.

Humans don't usually create those initial atoms. They already exist in nature. So if we can get enough of them together and if we could find a safe way to smash or combine them without wiping out cities or dealing with radioactive waste for hundreds of thousands of years, yes ... that would be an excellent source of energy. When will we see the "Mr. Fusion Home Energy Reactor" that powered the improved DeLorean car of the "Back to the Future" movie series? He fueled it up with a banana peel, among other things. If I remember right, Dr. Emmett Brown picked up that little accessory on a journey to 2015. I'm guessing he might have slipped a bit further into the future and didn't tell anyone!

Gary

TandW · 08-17-2008, 03:32 PM

And so we come to the realization that Global Warming is possibly man-made when the energy of the atom is released but cannot be recycled back into an atom. Not so with every form of chemical energy, be it fossil or so called "green".

Dave from MN · 08-19-2008, 02:00 PM

I think I will pass on this also. I did see a home made one in action on a small $200 Ford car. Not really much to it & it runs off the car voltage. Just some glass jars , stainless steel electrodes & some tubing. This guy claims his milage went from 50 miles per gallon to 75. I can see all kinds of what if's on this one. Play around with it on a $200 car but not my motor home! This gas that is produced will explode under water!