Not stuck in Death Valley -- Blown engine!

[bruceh]

Got towed to Pahrump. Technician tells me that I have a spun bearing and need ane new engine. Ugh, big bucks.

Checked with another tech at a different dealership and he concurred.

This is a real disapointment. I only have 37,000 miles on this and have been diligent with oil changes.

[bruceh]

Got towed to Pahrump. Technician tells me that I have a spun bearing and need ane new engine. Ugh, big bucks.

Checked with another tech at a different dealership and he concurred.

This is a real disapointment. I only have 37,000 miles on this and have been diligent with oil changes.

[rgrstndgby]

Bruceh..
Im really sorry to hear this, a major $$ hit for sure. .Did the tech say, "Rod, Main or Cam bearing ? I know there was some early thought that the trouble was in the valve train. If you dont mind, I'd like to know what your "running", and "idle" oil pressure was on "cold restart" after the damage was done... These 8.1's dont carry alot of OP even when new, and I'd be interested to know what yours was after the damage.. Thanks...rgr...

[Argosy]

Serious detonation (from the original thread) is extremely hard on an engine. It will blow the tops out of the pistons, beat the bearings out of the rods.

Once you loose a bearing oil pressure is very low, the clearance is so great it is hard to build pressure.

[rgrstndgby]

Argosy says...<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Once you loose a bearing oil pressure is very low, the clearance is so great it is hard to build pressure. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Once you loose a bearing oil pressure is very low, the clearance is so great it is hard to build pressure. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
.......................................

Thats generaly true...however, just spinning a bearing (and we dont know just what was spun)usually shuts off the oil supply to that journal, and if its not run much, it may not show much of a drop.. I'm sure there wont be much of an "autopsy" done, but I wonder where the knock sensor was in all this, and what caused the detonation in the first place.. and why didnt the knock sensor handle it?. If it was something coming apart, piston crown/land etc., that would be beyond the parameters of the sensor. There are alot of factors involved in engine failure, and its not possible to make a definitive statement as to "What Happened" without knowing more...rgr...

[edgray]

I realize that probably not "enough" is known about this particular situation, but I'd like to know from some of you knowledgable members if a spun bearing AUTOMATICALLY requires a complete engine replacement?? Can't these brutes be repaired anymore? Can you tell I don't know, especially since I can't even phrase the question properly? ED

[Brazels RV Performance]

Just a thought but do you have a service contract???

[Rocky 2]

37,000 miles. Bummer. A friend of mine had 36,100 miles on his 4 year old W22 when the same thing happened. Fortunately for him, he had a service contract that picked up the cost. He just had to get towed twice. His towing insurance picked up the first tow but he had to pay the second to the repair facility in Minot, ND. Stuck there for three weeks.

[rgrstndgby]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Can't these brutes be repaired anymore? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
ED, your question is perfectly phrased.
Im lookimng for an "embarassed modesty" icon, but failing I'll rant on...
Theoretically , yes they can, in fact places like Jaspers, etc. that make a huge business selling rebuilt engines require (usable)cores to be returned to rebuild. These places are like factorys tho, the days when some dude in greasy coveralls, engine swinging from a chain in a tree, pieces spread out on his wifeys card table, are pretty much gone. (been there, done that)..From a practical standpoint tho, by the time an RV owner gets someone to R&R the engine, strip all the acessories, dissasemble the engine, (the parts we are talking about, the bearings, are at the "deepest" part of the engine), and find a competent machinest to do the machine work,then re assemble and reinstall it all, BIG bucks are involved.. If its the rod bearing thats spun, the rod, bearing, and crankshaft must be replaced. If its a Main bearing, or cam bearing, then add the engine block to the list. Most Mechs. will want to replace about everything inside to make their responsibility a little more brearable, and the cost goes thru the roof. We will expect him to Guarantee the job, so he isn't likely to take any chances on slightly worn parts, so a "new " engine is the result..Im still thinking that some event" led up to this failure. Rather than a ping, I wonder if it was a knock, indicating that a piece had found its way from perhaps a piston, or valve, and produced the sound. No room for "strangers" in there, and anything roaming around will quickly bring failure...rgr...

[edgray]

rgrstndgby: Thanks for your reply. I understand a little better now. Part of my question was due to the thought that removing the entire engine from a typical Class A MH can't be too easy, and I "assumed" it would be easier to drop the bottom off the block and replace the crank, rods & bearings, and pistons from underneath.

Now I'm sure you understand just how little I know! ED

[Argosy]

Depending on the amount you want to spend and how well you trust the machine shop it really isn't necessary to replace cranks, rods and blocks unless there is extensive damage. If I had to replace a crank and block, I would replace the engine.

Rod caps and main bearing caps are accessed by pulling the oil pan, once it is off they are about all you will see.

Cranks can be turned to standard undersizes. They can also be welded and turned. Rods can be resized. Generally a block is reuseable with an align bore if it hasn't had a rod break loose. Cylinders can be sleeved. Sleeving and welding cranks would not be economically feasible for all cylinders/crank journals unless it was an exotic or rare engine, but for a single cylinder it is a lot cheaper than replacing the part.

[rgrstndgby]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Cranks can be turned to standard undersizes. They can also be welded and turned. Rods can be resized. Generally a block is reuseable with an align bore if it hasn't had a rod break loose. Cylinders can be sleeved. Sleeving and welding cranks would not be economically feasible for all cylinders/crank journals unless it was an exotic or rare engine, but for a single cylinder it is a lot cheaper than replacing the part. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>


this is all true, However, IMHO, these things have no place in an engine that gets run like a MoHo engine does. Also, considering the labor $$ involved in R&R the engine, Its just not worth the compromized result..back in the day, I've bored/sleeved blocks and ground cranks [IMG]in the chassis[/IMG], but thankfully, those days are long gone. I'd have no problem with a QUALITY independant, or factory rebuild in a MoHo, but a welded crank,or sleeved block, no way...rgr....

[FreshAir]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by edgray:
rgrstndgby: Part of my question was due to the thought that removing the entire engine from a typical Class A MH can't be too easy, and I "assumed" it would be easier to drop the bottom off the block and replace the crank, rods & bearings, and pistons from underneath.

ED </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Ed, interesting thought on removing thr 8.1. I was at the WH dealer in north Salt Lake City last year when they were removing an 8.1 from a class A. They raised the coach up on a lift and then had a fork lift with a home made cradle that fit the motor lower it from the bottom. The service manager said it was no big deal, easier than some car's and truck's and they do them, 8.1 MH, often.
Well, that worried me as there were old 8.1's on pallets all over the place. I asked the service manager what were they going to do with the old engines and he said just use them for salvage as Work Horse doesn't want any of them back. I thought, "Oh Man!" wish I hadn't seen this 8.1 salvage yard. Is this signs of things to come?

Maybe Brazels could add a little light on what's involved in the exchange of an 8.1 on the Work Horse chassis and are they doing a lot of them?
Pat

[NeilV]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by edgray:
I realize that probably not "enough" is known about this particular situation, but I'd like to know from some of you knowledgable members if a spun bearing AUTOMATICALLY requires a complete engine replacement?? Can't these brutes be repaired anymore? Can you tell I don't know, especially since I can't even phrase the question properly? ED </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

If the engine was immediatly shut down then maybe it could be repaired. However this one was pushed for some time pulling up a hill so the chances are slim.