Recall Not until mid Summer?

[DriVer]

Originally Posted by poorfarmer

If Ford owners ignore the brake fluid change requirements they will eventually have the same problems Hopefully for them they have learned from the WH owners.

Poorfarmer, Ford owners have a Maintenance Interval card that shows at a glance all the maintenance requirement that they should accomplish. In that listing, replacing the brake fluid is listed to be done every 2 years with DOT4 fluid.

Workhorse will I expect release the same recommendation sometime during this production year and those instructions should have be included in the 2010 Owner's Manual. I hope that we will see a wider distribution of this recommendation to everyone who has had the recall completed.

In the 2009 Chassis Guide (see the stickies) the maintenance requirement for brake fluid replacement every 2 years is listed.

[darbyjudy]

Originally Posted by DriVer

Max, I spoke to this several times and provided photographic evidence in one of my many posts here. Same calipers, same casting numbers. What's NOT the same is the time that the Ford / Bosch calipers have been in service on those vehicles.

Given the same amount of time 5-6 or more years, you will see that those calipers "may" begin exhibiting the same problems that we Workhorse owners are experiencing right now. For example, some folks running Peak Chassis are exhibiting caliper problems.

One thing that the Ford owners have going for them is the requirement to change their brake fluid every 2 years. That will help.

Driver If you remember I had problems with the rear calipers in 2006 and my MH was a 2004. So some of us did not have the calipers in service 5 or 6 years. I started having problems right off the line but I was not sure what the problem was. I could not beleive I was having brake problems with such few miles.
I don't know why Ford is not having these kinds of problems unless some of the calipers were different in the fact the bore of the caliper was smaller. I have talked to some that have never had a problem. But in my case it was right away.

[DriVer]

Originally Posted by darbyjudy

Driver If you remember I had problems with the rear calipers in 2006 and my MH was a 2004. So some of us did not have the calipers in service 5 or 6 years. I started having problems right off the line but I was not sure what the problem was. I could not believe I was having brake problems with such few miles.

I have addressed this is a few posts. Obviously you were under warranty at the time of the failure and those calipers were most likely replaced under warranty? If something breaks under warranty that's what the warranty is for.

The majority of caliper problems that are exhibited at this time are on 2001-2004 motorhome chassis so those units fall into the timeline I have described. 2005 chassis may begin exhibiting problems this year if my timeline argument works.

I don't expect seizures from 2006 to 2010 motorhome chassis that are subject to the recall and they shouldn't present many problems if any.

Anything can break and I hope those were fixed for you and you've had no further problems. That said, we have seen in print from the Interim Repair document that some pistons were tight and it would be just your luck to have wound up with 2 of those suspect calipers which would today fall within the description of the 50901-C signs and symptoms.

[rednlh]

Originally Posted by DriVer

You're absolutely right and it's very frustrating for anyone that is involved with this recall. As remote as that event might be it could happen. Surely though in the 10 years that these calipers have been on our vehicles someone would have reported an injury to NHTSA due to the defective calipers. I've not seen it and I'm not looking forward to it either.

When the first recall came out our brakes caught on fire while driving on
a two lane highway. At the first pull off I stopped and looked at the
brakes and they were on fire. If I had not been able to pull over there
the whole RV would have been destroyed or worse. They replaced the
brakes but I still do not trust them. I am hearing noises from the front
brakes now. We had them checked when we had the rear seals changed
just before we left on our last trip.

[DriVer]

Originally Posted by rednlh

When the first recall came out our brakes caught on fire while driving on a two lane highway.

rednlh, I was just wondering if you had not felt any drag on the drivetrain or had seen increased RPMs being displayed. When a caliper seizes, and I've been there, when one lets their foot off the gas the machine has a tendency to scrub speed. It isn't at all easy to maintain ones forward speed, normal RPM and still burn up a caliper.

I have had a stuck rear caliper which dragged me down when I let my foot off the throttle plus the odor was nauseating. In another instance a front seized caliper was wanting to tear the wheel out of the driver's hands and the effort required to keep the machine going straight was severe. Again with a front seizure in its incipient phase the odor was present.

Surely the time it would take for the wheel to catch fire would have telegraphed that a heat event was evolving and yield some type of odor clue before it became a bigger problem. In my experience fire would be the end stage of any type of seizure event.

I am glad to hear that you were able to recover from this event and did not loose your coach.

[EngineerMike]

Didn't I read somewhere, either in NHTSA or WH doc, that the driver may be completely unaware of the sticking brake? I would especially expect that on highway runs, and more especially w/cruise control where the driver has minimal feedback if wheels are sticking in axle pairs.

[DriVer]

Originally Posted by EngineerMike

Didn't I read somewhere, either in NHTSA or WH doc, that the driver may be completely unaware of the sticking brake? I would especially expect that on highway runs, and more especially w/cruise control where the driver has minimal feedback if wheels are sticking in axle pairs.

EM, Yes that's what they said! However adding a caveat to that, make that some drivers ..

I don't want to dig myself a hole here but I am only trying to relate what I experienced from my seat of the pants in regard to the issues I had. Cruise control is finicky in that it'll downshift the tranny quite a lot if the vehicle is trying to scrub speed. I would expect that a friction issue would be more noticeable while in cruise as opposed to having your foot in the gas.

Maybe it's just me but after some 85,000 miles when I'm driving my machine I have my finger on the pulse and there isn't very much operationally that won't pester me if the running profile changes to any degree.

[edgray]

Originally Posted by EngineerMike

Didn't I read somewhere, either in NHTSA or WH doc, that the driver may be completely unaware of the sticking brake? .............

EM: I don't know where you read what, but the December 2009 Interim Notice contains this statement:

""Although the driver would normally have warning of the brake drag- if undetected by the driver, the temperature increase at the wheel end can eventually lead to soft pedal conditions due to brake fluid boil and possible extended stopping distance.""

MY interpretation of this statement by WCC is that us drivers "should" have noticed that something "different" was happening, but if we did not notice, or chose to ignore whatever we are feeling, then a temperature increase and other bad things can begin to happen.

I would like to believe that, if nothing else, all this publicity about this problem has a lot of Workhorse drivers pulling over to check their brakes anytime they feel anything that does not seem "normal". This should not be necessary, but until the recall is completed I believe it is the only prudent thing we can do.

I remember feeling quite foolish for stopping because I just "knew" I had brakes dragging. In fact, all it was poor power performance due to the 7,000+ feet of elavation I was climbing thru. My brakes were actaully cold, upon inspection. But I'm still glad I stooped to check, and I hope otheres will do the same. ED

[EngineerMike]

Ed- that was probably it. "Although...normally..., if undetected by the driver..." Seems to leave the distinct possibility the driver wouldn't notice. Especially if on the highway under cruise control where driver receives neither gas nor brake pedal feedback for many, many miles continuously, maybe for a hundred or more. I like to gas up in Barstow, get on 40 and hit the cruise, then not take the cruise off till I turn south on 95 to head to Lake Havasu. Don't know how far that is in cruise control miles, but one trip w/a headwind, I think I passed two birthdays on that stretch.

[edgray]

Originally Posted by EngineerMike

Ed- that was probably it....... Seems to leave the distinct possibility the driver wouldn't notice........

Oh yes, I'm quite sure there are many "steering wheel holders" out there, but that does not mean they are "drivers"

So I don't get blasted for the above remark, I should point out that the term "steering wheel holder" is truck driver slang for other drivers who have low skill levels, such as problems backing their trailer into tight spots, etc.......

[Full-Timers]

I suppose there could be a situation where the calipers do fully release. This could cause a slight drag. This might not be noticed by the driver, other than the smell, and that could be masked by having the air on max, drawing in no outside air.