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Old 12-04-2018, 04:16 PM   #5335
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If at one time both or even one bracket was loose the constant slamming against the bushings and then the metal brackets can/will compromise the metal which can/will eventually fatigue and break.

If the bolts were found to be loose and just tightened with lock tight added that does not mean that down the road the clamps won't break as yours did.

If the inside of the metal brackets look like the bushings have been worked hard then there's no lubrication on the inside of the bushings. The bushings should not move. The SB rotates inside the bushings.

When our RV was less than 1 year old I took the bushings off to lube them and they were dry,dry,dry. No lube from the factory.

As of now nobody knows why the F-53 chassis rear bushing clamp bolts are coming loose. This happens on new and old RV's.

Keep in mind (IMHO) the lock tight is a must. I'm certain they were torqued at the factory. It's just not like Ford or any manufacturer to not torque bolts. Then why are they coming loose??? I'm still not sure but lock tight will prevent them from coming loose again.

This is just an educated guess. Prior to 2012 or beginning with 2011 and earlier chassis they used a Soy bean oil based bushing which did not last. As they became softer it may have allowed more SB/bushing movement and eventual slamming of the clamps during normal use. That slamming as things banged back and forth will cause metal fatigue and strap bracket failure.

When it happens to the newer units I don't have an answer but torquing and lock tight sure will prevent any further issues. We have 30,000 miles and no problems.
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Old 12-05-2018, 06:19 AM   #5336
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Tegu, which chassis do you have?
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Old 12-05-2018, 07:20 AM   #5337
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FLHTC3,

Just for future reference if you can always look under a posters user name then "Private Profile" and in his case you'll see he has a 30' Baystar RV which is an 18,000 lb chassis. That is the same F-53 chassis we have.
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Old 12-05-2018, 07:46 AM   #5338
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Tegu, which chassis do you have?
I read somewhere that with the wheelbase I have and model I'm supposed to have an 18000 lb chassis, however the Ford vin sticker and the Newmar sticker both say its 20500 lb.
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Old 12-05-2018, 08:25 AM   #5339
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TeJay---When you talk about toe-in in inches, how or where is that measured? It seems to me that the dimension would be different depending on how far away from the axle it is measured. I would ASSUME that it would be measured from center to center at the front of the tires.
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Old 12-05-2018, 10:08 AM   #5340
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FLHTC3,

Just for future reference if you can always look under a posters user name then "Private Profile" and in his case you'll see he has a 30' Baystar RV which is an 18,000 lb chassis. That is the same F-53 chassis we have.
Tejay, I may have looked at the same thing you did. I went back to the specs in the brochure and the Baystar Sport is 18000 lb, the Baystar is 20500. I wonder if they used the same sb and brackets, etc.
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Old 12-05-2018, 02:01 PM   #5341
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It would be that moving the stock front links to the other holes. It has been discussed that this lessens the down travel.
Maybe it's more noticeable on my comparatively lightweight and short RV. Winnebago Intent 26m.
Another recent poster had a similar feeling with his shorty.
I've got plenty of driving time now and the changes made are staying! It's a completely different vehicle to drishort. I love it.



[QaUOTE=TeJay;4487445]YGoHome,

"It feels as if it is being yanked back after hitting a bump. I'm guessing that it's the lessened available down travel."

Based on the above statement of the MODs you did which do you believe caused this feeling? Just curious!!!!!![/QUOTE]
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Old 12-05-2018, 02:53 PM   #5342
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When the link is moved from the outer hole to the inner hole (CHF) of the SB the only change is the length of the lever on the SB. You are now 3" closer to the point of rotation. That is called the fulcrum point.

I'm still confused how that could make anything harsher. The energy of the tire/leaf spring moving up as is encounters a dip is stored in the SB (it twists). The opposite side stays locked in place so the energy of motion is stored in the SB and your RV does not SWAY. Hence an anti-SWAY bar or SB.

It is a torsion spring but only stores energy as the result of motion.
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Old 12-06-2018, 08:34 AM   #5343
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Quote:
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FLHTC3,

Just for future reference if you can always look under a posters user name then "Private Profile" and in his case you'll see he has a 30' Baystar RV which is an 18,000 lb chassis. That is the same F-53 chassis we have.
TeJay, his Private Profile is available to his "Friends" only. This is why most of us add make/model/yr and other pertinent info of our motorhomes to our signatures, it cuts down on the many questions in an effort to help others.

My chassis is the 22k class and not the 18k .... as shown in my signature line.
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Old 12-06-2018, 03:14 PM   #5344
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That was my mistake. I meant and should have said, "Public Profile." Yes he will eventually post his info in the signature but I noticed he has less than 50 posts so I gave him the benefit of just being new.
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Old 12-07-2018, 06:54 PM   #5345
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I don't know why the page would say for friends only, as I seem to be able to go to profile pages without signing in. Also, I'll get around to the signature within the next twenty or so posts. (lazy)
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Old 12-10-2018, 11:25 AM   #5346
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When the link is moved from the outer hole to the inner hole (CHF) of the SB the only change is the length of the lever on the SB. You are now 3" closer to the point of rotation. That is called the fulcrum point.

I'm still confused how that could make anything harsher. The energy of the tire/leaf spring moving up as is encounters a dip is stored in the SB (it twists). The opposite side stays locked in place so the energy of motion is stored in the SB and your RV does not SWAY. Hence an anti-SWAY bar or SB.

It is a torsion spring but only stores energy as the result of motion.
The reason that it makes the ride harsher is bacause it changes the angle of the links to the sway bar.

A sway bar is designed to transfer the load of the chassis from one side to the other as the chassis passes over uneven surfaces and/or cornering. This is accomplished by the end links forcing down on the sway bar and the sway bar rotating (fairly) freely in the axle bushings.

Any change in the angle of the links to the bar (from the ideal 90* angle) will create force against the link bushings and the sway bar bushings instead of relatively free rotation.

Even the factory angle of the front end links in the outer holes is less that ideal for a smooth transfer of load @ about ~80*. I assume that this was done to facilitate chassis assembly. When the stock links are moved to the inner holes, the angle is changed to nearly 20*. This causes a tremendous amount of force being transferred BACK through the links, against the axle. The axle is not designed to be pushed back and that results in a jarring effect in the chassis as apposed to a free rotation of the sway bar.

If you look at the links on the rear sway bar, they are at the ideal angle of ~90*. The odd thing is, the rear sway bar bushings are failing and the front sway bar bushings aren't .

When I changed the links to the inner holes on our 2005 Southwind 32V, I obtained adjustable links (Hellwig #7962). I 1st mounted them to keep the factory attitude of the sway bar. This entailed extending the link from the factory length of 10" to a new length of 12.5" just to keep the sway bar in exactly the same place instead of rotating the bar up to meet the links. Although that kept the bar at the factory attitude it still changed the angle of the link to the bar from ~80* to about 75* so I gave the link another 1/2" to reach the factory (link to bar) angle of ~80*. I would have lengthened it farther but I am concerned about the strength of the threaded portion of the link.

I think that the best solution to this issue is to remove the factory links, cut them in half and weld a pipe over the link rods to extend them and strengthen them to ~ 13.5" long.

This picture was taken with the links adjusted to 12.5" long.
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Old 12-10-2018, 04:46 PM   #5347
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Wavery,

Your analysis and information is correct. The sever angle created when the CHF is employed has been discussed many, many times over the 5,000 + responses on this thread.

Many were aware the severe angle would create more stress on the bushings but I know I didn't relate that to increased harshness. I've made adjustable plates and can select from 4 SWAY control positions and my link angle never changes from its stock position. That's probably the main reason why I never associated harshness with the CHF.

I guess one can still learn something new every day. Thanks!!!

Several solutions have been discussed: extend the link, adjustable Helwig links or use adjustable plates. All of these solutions have been used by many F-53 owners.

However there are still many owners who have done nothing except moving the link to the inner hole and they are happy.
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Old 12-10-2018, 05:30 PM   #5348
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Wavery,

Your analysis and information is correct. The sever angle created when the CHF is employed has been discussed many, many times over the 5,000 + responses on this thread.

Many were aware the severe angle would create more stress on the bushings but I know I didn't relate that to increased harshness. I've made adjustable plates and can select from 4 SWAY control positions and my link angle never changes from its stock position. That's probably the main reason why I never associated harshness with the CHF.

I guess one can still learn something new every day. Thanks!!!

Several solutions have been discussed: extend the link, adjustable Helwig links or use adjustable plates. All of these solutions have been used by many F-53 owners.

However there are still many owners who have done nothing except moving the link to the inner hole and they are happy.
That's a real puzzle to me. Considering the angle of the links to the sway bar, I can't see the the sway bar is really doing much (if anything) at all. The mechanics of it just doesn't pan out.
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